Who is your most disappointing player this season?
- Thread starter BrownRolo
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B
brothert
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Can't we change the thread title to Clarkson's most disappointing moments this season....
B
brothert
Guest
Seriously though, other than Clarkson, you have to give some grief to Franson. He really regressed since last year. And Kulemin seems to be fading from a potential 2/3 line player to a solid 3rd liner. His hands are reminiscent of Hoglund's, solid granite.
Andy007
Active member
JohnK's Revenge said:
Eh Franson was never really that great imo anyway. He was a giveaway machine in the playoffs and couldn't make a decent pass to save his life. Others may differ on his performance last year though.
Kulemin, on the other hand, is the hardest working and hardest/best checker on the team and his even strength offensive numbers are pretty good, despite playing alot of 3rd line minutes with 3rd line teammates. Give him a regular spot all season with Lupul and Kadri and I bet you see 20 goals and 50 points.
I think that Kulemin is extremely valuable. He appears to make anyone playing with him look better. He can fill in on any line. If JVR were to get injured, I'd promote Kulemin to the top line and I think they would continue to do well. (Obviously he wouldn't score as much as JVR but he wins puck battles and cycles well and is our best player in the D zone when it comes to getting the puck out of the zone along the boards up his side of the ice.
GhostofPotvin29
New member
Clarkson is the obvious answer, but I didn't really have good expectations for him. Franson is my final answer.
GhostofPotvin29
New member
hap_leaf said:
Kadri had fortunate luck in the shortened season with a high on-ice SH% that likely wasn't sustainable. His production has been fine for a young 2nd line C. James Mirtle had a good piece about this last season (I think) - how Kadri was the 'luckiest man' in the league and that expectations for his points going forward should have been tempered.
Kessel Run
New member
hap_leaf said:
I agree he's been brutal. Sophomore slump perhaps? Not sure we should trade him yet.
Potvin29 said:
Like I said, points are not the major gripe I have here. I'm really put off by his effort out there on most nights.
What is missing as well is that egocentric confidence that we saw. Where are those magical dangles with the puck that were so intriguing? He is not even trying that stuff anymore just like he is not even trying on the backcheck.
Redleaf
Active member
hap_leaf said:
Yeah. Last night was a blatant example. He just stands around in the leafs zone, watching the defencemen struggle. I've had some serious doubts about his future here in Toronto, and have given him the benefit of doubt up until now. But, if he can be moved for a young, skilled two-way forward, I'd probably make that deal in a second.
GhostofPotvin29
New member
hap_leaf said:
I don't think he ever did those moves to a great degree last season, but maybe it just felt like he did. He's still done it a number of times this season, that assist vs. Montreal being probably the best example. It's a longer season too, probably still part of him learning to deal with an entire NHL season and how grueling it can be. Maybe he could get away with it last season but not now.
Either way I don't think there's anything wrong with how he's playing.
Stickytape
New member
Clarkson is like that freebie square on a bingo card. He's a given.
Phaneuf had a good start to the year, but he's really been pissing me off lately. Ever since he signed his contract his performance has just dropped off, especially during this losing streak which has seen his at one time team-leading +/- drop to just +5 (for reference, Gunnarson is still at +14). He leads the team in PIM, and leads the league in minor penalties. I can't think of any qualities that make him stand out as a team captain, either.
I've liked Franson in previous seasons, but this year he's been a pylon. I don't know what this team has against one-timers, but if he isn't going to one-time the puck, get him off the PP. It's absolutely no surprise that the Leafs have let in so many shorthanded goals with Phaneuf and Franson on the blueline. I know he's never been fast, but I swear his speed took about a 30% drop this season.
And Reimer hasn't exactly been disappointing, but that's because I already knew he's no good as a backup goalie. For whatever reason he plays well when he's happy, and when he's playing regularly. Getting the cold shoulder from Carlyle and being thrust back into 40-shot games after a long stretch on the bench is a recipe for disaster with him. I hope he finds a solid #1 role with a decent team, because he's a nice guy and he's being wasted here.
Lupul and Kadri haven't been as electric this year as I've grown accustomed to, but they've been saddled with Clarkson for a lot of the season and have still somehow managed to put up good numbers. With Kulemin on the line they looked a LOT better, and I'm interested to see how a new coach will use them. I'm not happy with their crappy backchecking (especially Lupul; sometimes Kadri comes through), but I hope they both stick around over the summer.
Kulemin has been great. He's like Gunnarson: solid, dependable, but somehow almost invisible out there. He shouldn't be held to that high-scoring season he had on the MacArthur/Grabovski line when both of those players were let go and he's been playing a different role on a 3rd line.
Phaneuf had a good start to the year, but he's really been pissing me off lately. Ever since he signed his contract his performance has just dropped off, especially during this losing streak which has seen his at one time team-leading +/- drop to just +5 (for reference, Gunnarson is still at +14). He leads the team in PIM, and leads the league in minor penalties. I can't think of any qualities that make him stand out as a team captain, either.
I've liked Franson in previous seasons, but this year he's been a pylon. I don't know what this team has against one-timers, but if he isn't going to one-time the puck, get him off the PP. It's absolutely no surprise that the Leafs have let in so many shorthanded goals with Phaneuf and Franson on the blueline. I know he's never been fast, but I swear his speed took about a 30% drop this season.
And Reimer hasn't exactly been disappointing, but that's because I already knew he's no good as a backup goalie. For whatever reason he plays well when he's happy, and when he's playing regularly. Getting the cold shoulder from Carlyle and being thrust back into 40-shot games after a long stretch on the bench is a recipe for disaster with him. I hope he finds a solid #1 role with a decent team, because he's a nice guy and he's being wasted here.
Lupul and Kadri haven't been as electric this year as I've grown accustomed to, but they've been saddled with Clarkson for a lot of the season and have still somehow managed to put up good numbers. With Kulemin on the line they looked a LOT better, and I'm interested to see how a new coach will use them. I'm not happy with their crappy backchecking (especially Lupul; sometimes Kadri comes through), but I hope they both stick around over the summer.
Kulemin has been great. He's like Gunnarson: solid, dependable, but somehow almost invisible out there. He shouldn't be held to that high-scoring season he had on the MacArthur/Grabovski line when both of those players were let go and he's been playing a different role on a 3rd line.
L K
Active member
The criticism of Kadri is really bordering on hilarity at this point. He's not a Selke winner but my god. Has anyone taken a look at Phil Kessel? How about we take a trip in our time machine to the Phil Kessel during his first few years with the Leafs. The guy couldn't be bothered to skate back into the defensive zone. Now keep in mind that Kadri is 3 years younger than Kessel.
The 2009 draft was a pretty decent draft so far. Kadri was picked 7th overall and is the 7th highest scoring player out of that draft. On a per-game basis he's top 5 in both goals, assists and points. Seeing as the only guys he's behind on a per-game pace were drafted ahead of him, the criticism seems a little over the top.
He hasn't taken that next step this year, but it's also his 2nd full NHL season and that's pretty common for a guy to struggle. Now take into account that he's played with Clarkson for good stretches of the year and that the team as a whole has played like refried garbage and I'm not sure how closely we need to look at Kadri as the most disappointing player on the team. He still has had a better offensive season (cumulative totals not PPG) than Bozak has ever put up in a season despite 2nd/3rd line ice-time and 2nd unit PP time all year.
There are definite flaws that need to be addressed. I think his skating took a half-step backward this year. Something has happened that he isn't trying to be nearly as creative with the puck (coaching staff?), his defensive play has been disappointing for large stretches, and while I'm not surprised about his slowed offense, the team could have used a few goals from him in the last few weeks.
Obvious answers would be:
Clarkson. I didn't expect good things from him, but I was also figuring he was going to be an overpaid 30 point player with 15-20 goals and 10-15 assists who threw some nice hits but was essentially an overpaid 3rd-borderline 2nd liner.
Franson. He was never a dominant top 4 guy but he seems slower than ever. Even though his raw hit totals are nice he still strikes me as a guy who is incredibly soft when fighting for pucks in the defensive zone. His play on the blueline in the offensive zone has been suspect and in general he has pretty much stopped firing his very nice shot from the point.
McClement. I don't care about him being a marginal offensive player. He has provided absolutely nothing offensively this year. And he's captaining an atrocious PK unit. He also spent a good portion of the year below average on faceoffs.
Orr. I'm not surprised that he's not an NHL hockey player. I'm disappointed that he has as few hits as he does. I'm disappointed that he doesn't fight when he's actually in the lineup. I'm disappointed that he's been garbage every single game.
Lupul. Speaking of Kadri's bad defense, how about floaty-Mcfloaterson over here. Lupul's play has really stagnated this year in comparison to his unsustainable production last year. I still wonder if this isn't a bit of a Carlyle effect as they really never saw eye-to-eye in Anaheim.
The 2009 draft was a pretty decent draft so far. Kadri was picked 7th overall and is the 7th highest scoring player out of that draft. On a per-game basis he's top 5 in both goals, assists and points. Seeing as the only guys he's behind on a per-game pace were drafted ahead of him, the criticism seems a little over the top.
He hasn't taken that next step this year, but it's also his 2nd full NHL season and that's pretty common for a guy to struggle. Now take into account that he's played with Clarkson for good stretches of the year and that the team as a whole has played like refried garbage and I'm not sure how closely we need to look at Kadri as the most disappointing player on the team. He still has had a better offensive season (cumulative totals not PPG) than Bozak has ever put up in a season despite 2nd/3rd line ice-time and 2nd unit PP time all year.
There are definite flaws that need to be addressed. I think his skating took a half-step backward this year. Something has happened that he isn't trying to be nearly as creative with the puck (coaching staff?), his defensive play has been disappointing for large stretches, and while I'm not surprised about his slowed offense, the team could have used a few goals from him in the last few weeks.
Obvious answers would be:
Clarkson. I didn't expect good things from him, but I was also figuring he was going to be an overpaid 30 point player with 15-20 goals and 10-15 assists who threw some nice hits but was essentially an overpaid 3rd-borderline 2nd liner.
Franson. He was never a dominant top 4 guy but he seems slower than ever. Even though his raw hit totals are nice he still strikes me as a guy who is incredibly soft when fighting for pucks in the defensive zone. His play on the blueline in the offensive zone has been suspect and in general he has pretty much stopped firing his very nice shot from the point.
McClement. I don't care about him being a marginal offensive player. He has provided absolutely nothing offensively this year. And he's captaining an atrocious PK unit. He also spent a good portion of the year below average on faceoffs.
Orr. I'm not surprised that he's not an NHL hockey player. I'm disappointed that he has as few hits as he does. I'm disappointed that he doesn't fight when he's actually in the lineup. I'm disappointed that he's been garbage every single game.
Lupul. Speaking of Kadri's bad defense, how about floaty-Mcfloaterson over here. Lupul's play has really stagnated this year in comparison to his unsustainable production last year. I still wonder if this isn't a bit of a Carlyle effect as they really never saw eye-to-eye in Anaheim.