2013 Toronto Blue Jays Thread

[bustaheims]

Nothing really going right for the Jays - when they've hit it hard, right at guys.  Not concerned at all, though.

I said cancel the parade.

They're digging themselves a hole here.  Only 161 games left.

Much better.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Blaming it on Adam Lind.

 

[TML fan]

Pretty lacklustre effort from everyone.

 

[hockeyfan1]

JPA really needs to learn to catch the knuckleball if he's going to be behind the plate for any of Dickey's future starts.

I wouldn't panic too much considering that Dickey's catcher with the Mets, Thole, had 34 passed balls in one season.  In fact, Gibbons didn't harbour much confidence in Arancibia.  Dickey is the who want Arancibia as his primary catcher.

It's worth noting that Dickey's decision to go with JPA was solidified when the two played in the 2013 WBC (World Baseball Classic).

Here's the story:
http://sports.nationalpost.com/2013/04/02/blue-jays-drop-the-ball-in-home-opener-in-front-of-their-expectant-fans/

 

[Peter D.]

The one positive I took from the game was Brett Cecil. He hit 92-94 consistently. For someone who was sub-90 not too long ago, this was an impressive turnaround. He looked really good in the limited sample he provided.

 

[hockeyfan1]

 

[Redleaf]

I don't follow baseball too closely. Ive only watched a handful of games since the Jays won it all in '93.

Are they still gonna win the World Series his year?

 

[Kin]

Not too happy with Lind, though. Gibby is going to have to have a short leash if he is going to suck like that. I was also curious that with all the talk about speed, Reyes didn't try to steal when he walked in the 1st - I figured they would want to put an exclamation point on all that speed.

Gibbons' teams have never been running teams though. You could say it was a personnel thing but he's never managed a team that finished higher than 17th in steals and never had an individual steal more than 17 bases.

It's too early to tell if that's going to be true going forward but considering the questionable value of a steal in the first place and the power in the lineup it wouldn't surprise me if we see less running than we'd expect.

 

[Corn Flake]

Was it me or did every batter take the first pitch every single time? I know they did in the final 2 innings for sure.

I absolutely despise that strategy.

 

[TML fan]

Not too happy with Lind, though. Gibby is going to have to have a short leash if he is going to suck like that. I was also curious that with all the talk about speed, Reyes didn't try to steal when he walked in the 1st - I figured they would want to put an exclamation point on all that speed.

Gibbons' teams have never been running teams though. You could say it was a personnel thing but he's never managed a team that finished higher than 17th in steals and never had an individual steal more than 17 bases.

It's too early to tell if that's going to be true going forward but considering the questionable value of a steal in the first place and the power in the lineup it wouldn't surprise me if we see less running than we'd expect.

Reyes also never got a good count to steal on in the first. He was taking some pretty monstrous leads though.

 

[Kin]

Reyes never had a good count to run on in the first. For what it's worth, he was taking some pretty monstrous leads.

As you can see from this fangraphs article, there's no real difference in SB success rates as determined by the count(a variance of 5% from the best to the worst) and considering that the count was 1-2 for most of the at-bat, and 1-2 seems to be one of the better running counts, I'm not sure that the count would be a big factor here.

Like I said, I think that while some of the players being fast runners will probably help the club, I don't know how much we'll see it in terms of stealing bases.

 

[TML fan]

Was it me or did every batter take the first pitch every single time? I know they did in the final 2 innings for sure.

I absolutely despise that strategy.

Masterson walked 4 batters. I'd be taking too.

 

[Corn Flake]

Was it me or did every batter take the first pitch every single time? I know they did in the final 2 innings for sure.

I absolutely despise that strategy.

Masterson walked 5 batters. I'd be taking too.

Yeah true, but not as a default for every at bat.  Pitchers know they can toss one up the middle and get ahead without any challenge.  The Cleveland relievers knew it and took big time advantage.

 

[TML fan]

Was it me or did every batter take the first pitch every single time? I know they did in the final 2 innings for sure.

I absolutely despise that strategy.

Masterson walked 5 batters. I'd be taking too.

Yeah true, but not as a default for every at bat.  Pitchers know they can toss one up the middle and get ahead without any challenge.  The Cleveland relievers knew it and took big time advantage.

I think by the end of the game they had just given up. Honestly the whole team looked dull and out of it last night.

 

[Kin]

Was it me or did every batter take the first pitch every single time? I know they did in the final 2 innings for sure.

I absolutely despise that strategy.

It wasn't every hitter but as you say they took every first pitch in the last 2 innings and looked at 15 first pitch strikes overall.

It's tough to say that it was a pre-determined strategy, though.

 

[Corn Flake]

Was it me or did every batter take the first pitch every single time? I know they did in the final 2 innings for sure.

I absolutely despise that strategy.

It wasn't every hitter but as you say they took every first pitch in the last 2 innings and looked at 15 first pitch strikes overall.

It's tough to say that it was a pre-determined strategy, though.

Sure looked like it was in the final two.  Each hitter looked like they were almost completely ignoring the first pitch, even Bautista. 

 

[Kin]

Sure looked like it was in the final two.  Each hitter looked like they were almost completely ignoring the first pitch, even Bautista.

Yeah, as mentioned though with Masterson a little wild it could be something that developed naturally in response. Either way, because it didn't pop up until the later innings even if it was part of a co-ordinated effort it only likely cost the team one or two strikes.

I can't speak to it's efficacy as a strategy though as I haven't seen much in the way of numbers on it.

 

[Peter D.]

What was corcerning for me, particularly with Lawrie out, is that the batting lineup doesn't look as great as thought.  The top four is obviously very good. 

But Lind-Arencibia-Rasmus-Izturis-Bonifacio leaves a lot to be desired.  Once Lawrie's back he'll take Lind's spot, who is misplaced in the 5th spot.  Arencibia and Rasmus are a little too inconsistent.  And Izturis and Bonifacio aren't going to provide much; granted, as #8 and 9 hitters they probably shouldn't be expected to, but hopefully they don't illicit the 'automatic out' type of feeling.

 

[Kin]

What was corcerning for me, particularly with Lawrie out, is that the batting lineup doesn't look as great as thought.  The top four is obviously very good. 

But Lind-Arencibia-Rasmus-Izturis-Bonifacio leaves a lot to be desired.  Once Lawrie's back he'll take Lind's spot, who is misplaced in the 5th spot.  Arencibia and Rasmus are a little too inconsistent.  And Izturis and Bonifacio aren't going to provide much; granted, as #8 and 9 hitters they probably shouldn't be expected to, but hopefully they don't illicit the 'automatic out' type of feeling.

Doesn't Lawrie replace Izturis? I can't imagine they'll put Izturis or Bonifacio in at DH.

 

[Corn Flake]

Sure looked like it was in the final two.  Each hitter looked like they were almost completely ignoring the first pitch, even Bautista.

Yeah, as mentioned though with Masterson a little wild it could be something that developed naturally in response. Either way, because it didn't pop up until the later innings even if it was part of a co-ordinated effort it only likely cost the team one or two strikes.

I can't speak to it's efficacy as a strategy though as I haven't seen much in the way of numbers on it.

I guess time will tell over the next few games. If we start seeing it a lot, especially vs. relievers then I would question that approach.  I'm all for racking up pitch counts on starters, especially ones with control problems like Masterson had at times last night, but not on setup men and closers.