2015 NHL Entry Draft

[CarltonTheBear]

Apart from whether it's an argument for or against anyone in this draft, it raises a question for me: does "BPA" need to be revised somewhat to consider what's available by other means (UFAs, trades)? Seems there are a lot more windows to get very good defensemen than there are to get very good centers.

I don't think any of those guys listed in the article are legit #1 defencemen, which is what many predict Hanifin to be. A lot of them aren't even top pairing defencemen. So I don't really think I would let that really effect a 1st round draft pick.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Apart from whether it's an argument for or against anyone in this draft, it raises a question for me: does "BPA" need to be revised somewhat to consider what's available by other means (UFAs, trades)? Seems there are a lot more windows to get very good defensemen than there are to get very good centers.

I don't think any of those guys listed in the article are legit #1 defencemen, which is what many predict Hanifin to be. A lot of them aren't even top pairing defencemen. So I don't really think I would let that really effect a 1st round draft pick.

Yeah he had 23 points in 37 games as a 17-18 year old in college.  That's pretty damn good.

 

[Kessel Run]

Arizona certainly has some interesting choices to make. I wonder if they would be influenced at all to take Marner, seeing they already have his London teammates Domi and Dvorak.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Yeah he had 23 points in 37 games as a 17-18 year old in college.  That's pretty damn good.

Yup. And what doesn't seem to get talked about nearly enough is that he should actually be playing his senior year in high school right now. He fast-tracked his final year to start college early. Players almost never play in the NCAA as 17-year olds. So his freshman year saw him scoring at a better pace than guys like Erik Johnson, Ryan Suter, and Kevin Shattenkirk, despite the fact that they all entered the NCAA AFTER their draft year.

 

[ZBBM]

Reading all the quotes upthread from Dubas, he seems preternaturally mature, level-headed, and thorough.

I don't trust him.  I think he's a Stepford Guy under the control of Lucifer Carlyle and his evil plans to dominate the cosmos.

 

[Highlander]

Yes and those duracell batteries are bound to burn out soon with no Eveready's available  to make him like that Bunny that never stops

 

[Al14]

Yes and those duracell batteries are bound to burn out soon with no Eveready's available  to make him like that Bunny that never stops

No name batteries work too.  They last almost just as long.

 

[Pick]

Here's a couple of questions for you all:

Assuming leafs take Strome in the draft, do Leafs send him back to Junior or does he take a spot on the Leafs? Do you promote Strome over Nylander?

I know, that it will all depend on performance at training camp, but there are always other considerations. What do you think?

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Here's a couple of questions for you all:

Assuming leafs take Strome in the draft, do Leafs send him back to Junior or does he take a spot on the Leafs? Do you promote Strome over Nylander?

I know, that it will all depend on performance at training camp, but there are always other considerations. What do you think?

The Leafs have shown recently that they're going to be extra-cautious with their AHL eligible prospects (basically refusing to call Brown/Nylander up this past season). Obviously Strome isn't AHL eligible, so that might change how they approach him, but I would imagine that they'll still prefer to be cautious. With Dubas and Hunter here too we have a management team that likely thinks pretty highly of OHL hockey.

One other thing that I've brought up before is that even though Strome dominated the OHL this season, there's a pretty good reason to think that he could benefit from being sent back down. He's spent the last 2 seasons being overshadowed by McDavid. He hasn't had the experience of being his teams go-to player over the course of a full season. The Otters will be taking a pretty big hit next season when McDavid leaves. It could be good for Strome to try and carry that team on his back.

 

[LuncheonMeat]

Here's a couple of questions for you all:

Assuming leafs take Strome in the draft, do Leafs send him back to Junior or does he take a spot on the Leafs? Do you promote Strome over Nylander?

I know, that it will all depend on performance at training camp, but there are always other considerations. What do you think?

The Leafs have shown recently that they're going to be extra-cautious with their AHL eligible prospects (basically refusing to call Brown/Nylander up this past season). Obviously Strome isn't AHL eligible, so that might change how they approach him, but I would imagine that they'll still prefer to be cautious. With Dubas and Hunter here too we have a management team that likely thinks pretty highly of OHL hockey.

One other thing that I've brought up before is that even though Strome dominated the OHL this season, there's a pretty good reason to think that he could benefit from being sent back down. He's spent the last 2 seasons being overshadowed by McDavid. He hasn't had the experience of being his teams go-to player over the course of a full season. The Otters will be taking a pretty big hit next season when McDavid leaves. It could be good for Strome to try and carry that team on his back.

First, I hope they have a chance to take Strome.  But if they do get him, I can't see them having him play on the big club next season.  The team is likely going to be a tire fire again next season, and being the go-to guy on his OHL team, like you said, would probably be better for his development.

 

[Kin]

I don't think it's a case of "what happens in camp" so much as it is trying to get a snapshot of a player and what they're ready for and how the management team thinks they'll react to the pressures of playing in the NHL. I know there's a school of thought that says regardless of how well they'd play they should be sent down in a nod to "caution" or what have you but I tend to think most NHL teams think that their coaches and their training staff are the best teachers a player can have.

Obviously if a player would get embarrassed and, as a result, discouraged in the NHL that's not reason enough to keep him up but it would be tough to look at what happened with players like Landeskog or Monahan and say that young players should only be in the NHL if they're superstars from the word go.

 

[bustaheims]

One other thing that I've brought up before is that even though Strome dominated the OHL this season, there's a pretty good reason to think that he could benefit from being sent back down. He's spent the last 2 seasons being overshadowed by McDavid. He hasn't had the experience of being his teams go-to player over the course of a full season. The Otters will be taking a pretty big hit next season when McDavid leaves. It could be good for Strome to try and carry that team on his back.

That's how I'd be leaning, as well. Give him a year to be "the guy" in an environment he's already comfortable with before bringing him up to the Leafs, where he's likely to be expected to fulfill a similar role in a couple seasons.

 

[ZBBM]

The Leafs have shown recently that they're going to be extra-cautious with their AHL eligible prospects (basically refusing to call Brown/Nylander up this past season). Obviously Strome isn't AHL eligible, so that might change how they approach him, but I would imagine that they'll still prefer to be cautious. With Dubas and Hunter here too we have a management team that likely thinks pretty highly of OHL hockey.

Strome is not McDavid or Eichel.  Hence there should be no question of what they do with Strome if they get him.  Otherwise Shanahan's talk of "finally doing things the right way" will be exposed as just another chapter in MLSE bait-and-switch.

Let's say we get Strome and he tears up camp.  Then he scores  something like 14 or 15 or 16 points in the first 9 games.  The happiest day of my life would be if they sent him back to junior after that.  For it would finally show that management is not going to swayed by short-run success.

 

[Guilt Trip]

The Leafs have shown recently that they're going to be extra-cautious with their AHL eligible prospects (basically refusing to call Brown/Nylander up this past season). Obviously Strome isn't AHL eligible, so that might change how they approach him, but I would imagine that they'll still prefer to be cautious. With Dubas and Hunter here too we have a management team that likely thinks pretty highly of OHL hockey.

Strome is not McDavid or Eichel.  Hence there should be no question of what they do with Strome if they get him.  Otherwise Shanahan's talk of "finally doing things the right way" will be exposed as just another chapter in MLSE bait-and-switch.

Let's say we get Strome and he tears up camp.  Then he scores  something like 14 or 15 or 16 points in the first 9 games.  The happiest day of my life would be if they sent him back to junior after that.  For it would finally show that management is not going to swayed by short-run success.

If Strome tears it up as in your scenario, he won't be sent back to Jr.

 

[Kin]

Strome is not McDavid or Eichel.  Hence there should be no question of what they do with Strome if they get him.  Otherwise Shanahan's talk of "finally doing things the right way" will be exposed as just another chapter in MLSE bait-and-switch.

I don't understand the point you're making at all. What separates Strome from McDavid or Eichel outside of ability? If Strome shows an ability to play at a high level of the NHL why would sending him down make sense where it wouldn't for McDavid or Eichel?

 

[ZBBM]

Strome is not McDavid or Eichel.  Hence there should be no question of what they do with Strome if they get him.  Otherwise Shanahan's talk of "finally doing things the right way" will be exposed as just another chapter in MLSE bait-and-switch.

I don't understand the point you're making at all. What separates Strome from McDavid or Eichel outside of ability? If Strome shows an ability to play at a high level of the NHL why would sending him down make sense where it wouldn't for McDavid or Eichel?

Anyone who is not a consensus generational talent should be developed slowly and not fast-tracked just because of a spate of preseason and early season good games.  That, I take it, is what Shanahan means by the "right way" (essentially, the Wings way). 

(BTW, we could argue about whether Eichel has that consensus tag, but Strome certainly doesn't.)

Personally, if they get Strome I'd just send him back to junior after camp no matter how well he does, just close off needless debating if he does tear it up for a few regular season games.

 

[Kin]

Anyone who is not a consensus generational talent should be developed slowly and not fast-tracked just because of a spate of preseason and early season good games.  That, I take it, is what Shanahan means by the "right way" (essentially, the Wings way). 

Well, I'd ask you to show your work but I'm guessing it wouldn't go over well. Simply put, there are tons of players in the NHL who came into the league quickly without "generational talent" labels on them and have done fine. Ken Holland himself has said that if he ever had a high draft pick he'd probably develop that player differently than he does with lower round picks.

 

[Pick]

Strome is not McDavid or Eichel.  Hence there should be no question of what they do with Strome if they get him.  Otherwise Shanahan's talk of "finally doing things the right way" will be exposed as just another chapter in MLSE bait-and-switch.

I don't understand the point you're making at all. What separates Strome from McDavid or Eichel outside of ability? If Strome shows an ability to play at a high level of the NHL why would sending him down make sense where it wouldn't for McDavid or Eichel?

Anyone who is not a consensus generational talent should be developed slowly and not fast-tracked just because of a spate of preseason and early season good games.  That, I take it, is what Shanahan means by the "right way" (essentially, the Wings way). 

(BTW, we could argue about whether Eichel has that consensus tag, but Strome certainly doesn't.)

Personally, if they get Strome I'd just send him back to junior after camp no matter how well he does, just close off needless debating if he does tear it up for a few regular season games.

I agree with you. I do, however, take issue with your statements about "the right way" "The Wings way".

What is the "Wings way"? To many it has come to mean build with the draft and develop players at their rate. This is somewhat of a myth.

How many 1st rounders did Red Wings trade away the last 20 years?

Also, if Shanahan is gonna build this team the Red Wings way, expect a lot of trades and free-agent signings. Remember, Shanahan himself, nor his buddy from St. Louis Brett Hull were drafted or developed by the club.

 

[herman]

I can't see why anyone should need to take a hardline stance on where Strome, or whichever player we draft, will play as defining whether Shanahan is serious about his development plan or not.

Every player is different and has a different development curve. If Strome/Marner/Hanafin can learn and develop best playing against the best without taking a significant blow to his confidence, why not play in the NHL? If he needs more seasoning, why not let him dominate in the OHL another year and learn to be the go-to guy? Saying it has to be one way or the other, or doing that just because another team seems to be doing it that way is silly.

However, if they're bringing this player up to the NHL and dubbing him the franchise saviour before he has even played a game, then we can safely say the Leafs new management philosophy of patient development has been thrown out the window.

I agree with you. I do, however, take issue with your statements about "the right way" "The Wings way".

What is the "Wings way"? To many it has come to mean build with the draft and develop players at their rate. This is somewhat of a myth.

How many 1st rounders did Red Wings trade away the last 20 years?

Also, if Shanahan is gonna build this team the Red Wings way, expect a lot of trades and free-agent signings. Remember, Shanahan himself, nor his buddy from St. Louis Brett Hull were drafted or developed by the club.

I don't really understand your point about the 'Wings Way' myth. They draft quite low most of the time, so their prospects need more seasoning. The difference is they actually have the patience to let them marinate to the point where they can take jobs from the incumbents. It's not really about forcing all their prospects to stay down for 3 years minimum, or some other hardline rule.

The Leafs of the past decade+ try them out in the NHL too early (seemingly to make a splash or to demonstrate their drafting prowess in picking "NHL-ready" players), and then they end up trading them for pennies only to watch them take off under teams with actual development programs.

 

[herman]

One of the quotes from the Kyle Dubas on Brady & Walker interview (link) highlights why I think this management team shows promise.

The way I looked at this draft, I knew we were going to get a good pick, we weren?t going to pick lower than 5th, but the focus for us and where we have to begin to really become a great organization is on the second pick [...]. We have to make a good pick and hit on that one. That?s where a lot of our focus has been. We know it?s going to be in the mid 20s, and that?s where myself and Mark Hunter have been spending a lot of our time, is tracking those players that are in that range. Making sure we find a player that fits the identity of where we?re going as an organization and we?re certain is going to be a guy who has a good chance of becoming in (sic) and being a big time player, be it a forward, D or goaltender; someone that we?re confident can be not just someone that?s a safe pick that will play low in our lineup, but a really good player. You look at a lot of the organizations now, they?re able to find real good players late in the 1st and that?s what we want to become. Having that pick is a great opportunity for us.