2017-2018 NHL Thread

[bustaheims]

I think that last bit is debatable. I suppose I don't entirely see the value in what that person would bring. You'd first have to define what that line is and what makes something acceptable. Not to mention that that line will change as the culture of the game changes. I think you need a forward-thinker, first and foremost. Someone who can steer the game in a safer direction.

I don't know. I'm kinda with Nik here. I like the idea of having a guy who has the experience of what it's like to play a very physical game, but without having had to cross the line into cheap shots and illegal hits to be effective. There's also no reason to suggest Parros can't be a forward-thinker who can steer the game in a safer direction. If anything, someone with his history could have clearer insights into how the keep the physical aspect of the game intact while doing so.

 

[Kin]

I think that last bit is debatable. I suppose I don't entirely see the value in what that person would bring. You'd first have to define what that line is and what makes something acceptable. Not to mention that that line will change as the culture of the game changes. I think you need a forward-thinker, first and foremost. Someone who can steer the game in a safer direction.

Ok, s let's think about what sort of mitigating factors tend to go into these decisions. Typically we're not talking about the most flagrant sort of fouls there. We're talking about things like "Did the player throwing the hit have time to react to a sudden change in movement by the player who was hit" or "was the head specifically targeted". In those cases shouldn't you want someone who's intimately familiar with throwing hits? To know about angles of it and reaction time and such?

 

[Bill_Berg]

I think that last bit is debatable. I suppose I don't entirely see the value in what that person would bring. You'd first have to define what that line is and what makes something acceptable. Not to mention that that line will change as the culture of the game changes. I think you need a forward-thinker, first and foremost. Someone who can steer the game in a safer direction.

Ok, s let's think about what sort of mitigating factors tend to go into these decisions. Typically we're not talking about the most flagrant sort of fouls there. We're talking about things like "Did the player throwing the hit have time to react to a sudden change in movement by the player who was hit" or "was the head specifically targeted". In those cases shouldn't you want someone who's intimately familiar with throwing hits? To know about angles of it and reaction time and such?

I do. I think these guys are better able to call those borderline hits. Not perfectly of course. I mean we see Kadri throw a hit at a guy's head or knee and he immediately says he didn't mean it, only he knows if he did or not, but he goes through that exercise as a player a few times in a career. Then when he retires, who better to determine if the next Kadri is aiming of the head or not?

If Kadri doesn't mean to hit the head, then he can relate to the player and probably pick up on things like positioning, feet movement, whatever.

If Kadri does mean to hit people in the head, then he knows the tricks and can bust other people trying to use them.

 

[Bullfrog]

Ok, s let's think about what sort of mitigating factors tend to go into these decisions. Typically we're not talking about the most flagrant sort of fouls there. We're talking about things like "Did the player throwing the hit have time to react to a sudden change in movement by the player who was hit" or "was the head specifically targeted". In those cases shouldn't you want someone who's intimately familiar with throwing hits? To know about angles of it and reaction time and such?

I get what you're saying, but I have doubts as to whether or not a "hitter" like Matt Martin would really be able to provide any more insight on things such as player vulnerability than other professional hockey players who've played the game at a high level. Similarly, I don't think you need to be an elite player to become an elite coach.

 

[Bullfrog]

I think that last bit is debatable. I suppose I don't entirely see the value in what that person would bring. You'd first have to define what that line is and what makes something acceptable. Not to mention that that line will change as the culture of the game changes. I think you need a forward-thinker, first and foremost. Someone who can steer the game in a safer direction.

I don't know. I'm kinda with Nik here. I like the idea of having a guy who has the experience of what it's like to play a very physical game, but without having had to cross the line into cheap shots and illegal hits to be effective. There's also no reason to suggest Parros can't be a forward-thinker who can steer the game in a safer direction. If anything, someone with his history could have clearer insights into how the keep the physical aspect of the game intact while doing so.

Just to clarify: I didn't in any way intend to suggest that I think Parros isn't qualified for the job. I was just commenting on the job qualifications. We're talking about the head of the department, hence my comment: "I think you need a forward-thinker, first and foremost"

 

[Kin]

I get what you're saying, but I have doubts as to whether or not a "hitter" like Matt Martin would really be able to provide any more insight on things such as player vulnerability than other professional hockey players who've played the game at a high level. Similarly, I don't think you need to be an elite player to become an elite coach.

Right, I think a lot of people have compellingly made the case that the less gifted a player is the more likely they are to have to become students of the game which then translates into coaching. But nobody is saying that solely being a player who throws hits qualifies anyone for the job. Just that it's an added and important perspective when dealing with the actions of guys throwing hits.

I guess I don't see the connection because I maybe don't know what you're saying with "player vulnerability" but the examples I used are specific to guys throwing hits, not the guys getting hit. I don't think the extent to which a player is vulnerable tends to be a mitigating factor.

 

[Kin]

From the "What we'll see after the next CBA" department:

[tweet]905911497557254144[/tweet]

I wonder if we'll see more guys follow Matthews and go to Europe for a year.

 

[bustaheims]

From the "What we'll see after the next CBA" department:

[tweet]905911497557254144[/tweet]

I wonder if we'll see more guys follow Matthews and go to Europe for a year.

Interesting. Doubt we'll see much push back from the PA on that one. It also opens up more possibilities for players to go straight to the AHL after being drafted (I think).

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

From the "What we'll see after the next CBA" department:

[tweet]905911497557254144[/tweet]

I wonder if we'll see more guys follow Matthews and go to Europe for a year.

Top five caliber players who are on the young end of the spectrum for their draft class should definitely go abroad.

They can likely make close to a million dollars abroad over 18-24 months instead of playing junior.

It's hilarious that the whole draft system hasn't been challenged in court, in Europe the Bosman rule changed the landscape of soccer by making players free agents any time they did not have a contract.

The premise was that sportsmen are normal citizens and should have the same employment conditions placed upon them as everyone else.

Ownership of rights is very archaic.

I don't think it's a perfect system, but I would think there is a middle ground that may work.

 

[bustaheims]

It's hilarious that the whole draft system hasn't been challenged in court, in Europe the Bosman rule changed the landscape of soccer by making players free agents any time they did not have a contract.

The premise was that sportsmen are normal citizens and should have the same employment conditions placed upon them as everyone else.

Ownership of rights is very archaic.

I don't think it's a perfect system, but I would think there is a middle ground that may work.

I wonder if the prevailing opinion is that the leagues would end up winning in a similar situation to MLB's antitrust exemption. That being said, I think it would probably be a worthwhile endeavour.

Honestly, though, I'm a fan of the draft, as it helps maintain a level of competitiveness - and, somewhat because of that, helps raise the entertainment level of the average NHL game. I would, however, love to see the RFA system eliminated. Give teams the rights to a sign a player to their first contract, but, that's it.

 

[Kin]

I don't think it's a perfect system, but I would think there is a middle ground that may work.

I've never really understood, aside from an unwillingness to rock the boat and a desire to make running a team idiot-proof, why you'd still have a draft as well as having a hard salary cap.

Well, that and a PA that screws over younger players.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I just genuinely don't see any point in raising the draft age other than scouts want their jobs to be easier.

 

[Kin]

That being said, I think it would probably be a worthwhile endeavour.

Probably not for the player that does it though. As we've seen with Colin Kaepernick anyone who isn't a star who bucks an established system can be frozen out. Basically it would take a superstar level prospect who was willing to sit out a year or two to fight the system and, at least in the case of Eric Lindros, those prospects can hold out and get what they want eventually.

So basically you're talking about an 18 year old willing to forgo millions of dollars and defy an established authority to establish a more fair labour state. That would be a remarkable teenager.

 

[bustaheims]

So basically you're talking about an 18 year old willing to forgo millions of dollars and defy an established authority to establish a more fair labour state. That would be a remarkable teenager.

I don't think it's likely to happen, nor do I think a single prospect would be enough to really move the needle enough - especially, since, as you said, the high-end guys get what they want eventually, while the mid-tier and lower end guys will just get largely ignored/passed over/frozen out/etc. It would really mean a group effort from a significant number of the top prospects in a draft class or a kid from a wealthy background who is unlikely to make it but willing to be the sacrificial lamb by being the guy to mount a legal challenge (assuming they'd even have a chance/case) for there to be any real movement.

 

[hockeyfan1]

Team-by-team previews/breakdowns:

http://www.sportsnet.ca/blogs/nhl-31-in-31/

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Cody Franson's will be at Chicago's camp as a PTO. With that, a Blackhawks blog posted their expected line-up for next season... and it was interesting:

Saad-Toews-Panik
Sharp-Anisimov-Kane
Jurco-Schmaltz-Hartman
Bouma-Kero-Wingels

Keith-Murphy
Kempny-Seabrook
Forsling-Franson

Crawford

That doesn't look very good. Especially when you remember that Patrick Sharp turns 36 in December and scored at a 30-point pace. Is this the year that Chicago misses the playoffs? Kane, Toews, Keith, and Crawford will likely have to grab them there kicking and screaming.

 

[herman]

Cody Franson's will be at Chicago's camp as a PTO. With that, a Blackhawks blog posted their expected line-up for next season... and it was interesting saad and might be time to panik:

FTFY

 

[Bullfrog]

I just genuinely don't see any point in raising the draft age other than scouts want their jobs to be easier.

I like the idea. I think the draft should be for players expected to go into professional hockey right away, rather than another two years in junior.

I don't know why I think that, though. lol

 

[herman]

https://twitter.com/alex_prewitt/status/905778829968408578
www.twitter.com/alex_prewitt/status/905778829968408578

 

[herman]

The Jets extended Cheveldayoff and Maurice with multi-year contracts.

On the one hand, the pressure is on the players to reach their roster's potential. On the other hand, their players' hands are tied because Maurice is still their coach, so how different will things be?