Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590

[Andy007]

What an exciting game. Kapanen, Plekanec, Brown, Nylander and Marner really stood out for me. And I thought Gardiner was very good on the back end of things.

A plea to Babcock for game 7: Pleeeease stop sending your forwards to the Bruins blue line during defensive zone breakouts. The amount of icings and giveaways as a result of 0 forwards being anywhere near their defensize zone was staggering. You could see how much easier breaking out was in the third period when that silly 'stagnant blueline standing' strategy wasn't employed and how much better the team played as a result.

Anyway that's my armchair criticism/observation for the day   I'm happy the Leafs made a series out of this; Boston is clearly the superior team.

 

[Chris]

Anyway that's my armchair criticism/observation for the day   I'm happy the Leafs made a series out of this; Boston is clearly the superior team.

I was thinking that last night especially during the second period, but upon further reflection...I don't think it's clear cut. The Bruins are certainly more effective at certain phases of the game. They are more effective at establishing offensive zone play, better along the boards whereas the Leafs are more of a quick-strike offense. This makes the game look skewed in the Bruins favor but here we are 3-3 with one game to go. Both goalies have been good but Andersen has been better the past 2 games so I don't think one can say that the Bruins are clearly superior overall...

 

[Guru Tugginmypuddah]

Anyway that's my armchair criticism/observation for the day   I'm happy the Leafs made a series out of this; Boston is clearly the superior team.

I was thinking that last night especially during the second period, but upon further reflection...I don't think it's clear cut. The Bruins are certainly more effective at certain phases of the game. They are more effective at establishing offensive zone play, better along the boards whereas the Leafs are more of a quick-strike offense. This makes the game look skewed in the Bruins favor but here we are 3-3 with one game to go. Both goalies have been good but Andersen has been better the past 2 games so I don't think one can say that the Bruins are clearly superior overall...

I think the biggest advantage Boston has is more experienced players.  There are still a few players on that team left over from their Cup winning team.  They also went to the finals in 2013.

Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak. 

This is a learn on the fly series for the young guys, and I think the Leafs have looked better and better with each game.  We'll see how good they look Wednesday. 

 

[dappleganger]

Anyway that's my armchair criticism/observation for the day   I'm happy the Leafs made a series out of this; Boston is clearly the superior team.

I was thinking that last night especially during the second period, but upon further reflection...I don't think it's clear cut. The Bruins are certainly more effective at certain phases of the game. They are more effective at establishing offensive zone play, better along the boards whereas the Leafs are more of a quick-strike offense. This makes the game look skewed in the Bruins favor but here we are 3-3 with one game to go. Both goalies have been good but Andersen has been better the past 2 games so I don't think one can say that the Bruins are clearly superior overall...

I think the biggest advantage Boston has is more experienced players.  There are still a few players on that team left over from their Cup winning team.  They also went to the finals in 2013.

Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak. 

This is a learn on the fly series for the young guys, and I think the Leafs have looked better and better with each game.  We'll see how good they look Wednesday.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

 

[bustaheims]

Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

Not that they're playing much, but we can add Martin and Moore to the list of players who have been on teams that have won an NHL playoff series.

 

[rdowdall]

Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

Not that they're playing much, but we can add Martin and Moore to the list of players who have been on teams that have won an NHL playoff series.

I wonder if Nathan Horton and Joffrey Lupul ever get included in numbers like that by mistake.

 

[Andy007]

Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

Not that they're playing much, but we can add Martin and Moore to the list of players who have been on teams that have won an NHL playoff series.

I think the main difference, though, is that a lot of the Boston players with experience are also pretty valuable players. Krejci, Marchand, Bergeron, Backes, Nash, Rask, Krug and Chara beats JVR, Marleau, Plekanec, Andersen, Hainsey and Polak pretty soundly, imo.

 

[Oracle]

Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

Not that they're playing much, but we can add Martin and Moore to the list of players who have been on teams that have won an NHL playoff series.

I think the main difference, though, is that a lot of the Boston players with experience are also pretty valuable players. Krejci, Marchand, Bergeron, Backes, Nash, Rask, Krug and Chara beats JVR, Marleau, Plekanec, Andersen, Hainsey and Polak pretty soundly, imo.

We'll find out tomorrow night!

 

[Bender]

Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

Not that they're playing much, but we can add Martin and Moore to the list of players who have been on teams that have won an NHL playoff series.

I think the main difference, though, is that a lot of the Boston players with experience are also pretty valuable players. Krejci, Marchand, Bergeron, Backes, Nash, Rask, Krug and Chara beats JVR, Marleau, Plekanec, Andersen, Hainsey and Polak pretty soundly, imo.

Krejci, Backes, Nash, Krug have done barely anything this whole series. The B's whole series literally (actually figuratively, but who cares!) rests on the top line. You shut them down and they shouldn't be able to match Toronto's depth on paper, regardless of experience.

 

[Andy007]

Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

Not that they're playing much, but we can add Martin and Moore to the list of players who have been on teams that have won an NHL playoff series.

I think the main difference, though, is that a lot of the Boston players with experience are also pretty valuable players. Krejci, Marchand, Bergeron, Backes, Nash, Rask, Krug and Chara beats JVR, Marleau, Plekanec, Andersen, Hainsey and Polak pretty soundly, imo.

Krejci, Backes, Nash, Krug have done barely anything this whole series. The B's whole series literally (actually figuratively, but who cares!) rests on the top line. You shut them down and they shouldn't be able to match Toronto's depth on paper, regardless of experience.

I don't neccesarily disagree with any of that (although Krug has 7 or 8 points this series I think), I was just pointing out the differences in the calibre of experienced players in context of the debate as to which team has more experience.

That Bergeron line has brutalized Toronto though and could have scored about a half dozen goals yesterday. The only thing shutting that line down is/has been Andersen. I think Matthews needs a little more help on his wings..

 

[herman]

Krejci, Backes, Nash, Krug have done barely anything this whole series. The B's whole series literally (actually figuratively, but who cares!) rests on the top line. You shut them down and they shouldn't be able to match Toronto's depth on paper, regardless of experience.

A strong possession driving line does not necessarily need to score on their own, but through the course of their play, they can force repeated icings, bad matchups, and tired lines that usually result in a higher chance for either scoring or drawing a penalty. The Bruins' depth lines do a good job setting the table for Bergeron's line.

In this game, Cassidy elected to keep sending out Bergeon and Krejci's lines because they were in a faceoff winning groove and kept hemming the Leafs in their own zone. If it wasn't for Andersen and some lucky blocks, they could have taken the series then and there.

 

[hockeyfan1]

Boston's management are the best. They get so pissed off.. I'm waiting for their heads to explode.

You gotta love Cam Neely.  That shot of him, his head looks like an overinflated football that some evil being just keeps pumping air into.  At least that's a realistic human reaction.  Lou looks someone just stunned him with a 2x4.

LOL

 

[herman]

https://twitter.com/RLeesam/status/988573355375673344

Leg day, every day.

 

[Heroic Shrimp]

https://twitter.com/RLeesam/status/988573355375673344

Leg day, every day.

While on the surface it looks like Mitch just hoists him back, Marner definitely trips him by "accidentally" pulling his stick forward into the back of the guy's skate.

 

[herman]

https://twitter.com/RLeesam/status/988573355375673344

Leg day, every day.

While on the surface it looks like Mitch just hoists him back, Marner definitely trips him by "accidentally" pulling his stick forward into the back of the guy's skate.

Hard to tell in motion, but it looks to me like the starting point of Marner?s stick is in front of Krug?s skate, which would make tripping him not very likely.

 

[Heroic Shrimp]

https://twitter.com/RLeesam/status/988573355375673344

Leg day, every day.

While on the surface it looks like Mitch just hoists him back, Marner definitely trips him by "accidentally" pulling his stick forward into the back of the guy's skate.

Hard to tell in motion, but it looks to me like the starting point of Marner?s stick is in front of Krug?s skate, which would make tripping him not very likely.

The camera cuts up at exactly the wrong moment, but it still strikes me that Marner's stick is between Krug's legs, and as he pulls it forward, he just happens to turn the blade behind Krug's right heel.  It certainly adds up when you look at how hard and fast Krug goes down.

 

[sickbeast]

https://twitter.com/RLeesam/status/988573355375673344

Leg day, every day.

While on the surface it looks like Mitch just hoists him back, Marner definitely trips him by "accidentally" pulling his stick forward into the back of the guy's skate.

Hard to tell in motion, but it looks to me like the starting point of Marner?s stick is in front of Krug?s skate, which would make tripping him not very likely.

The camera cuts up at exactly the wrong moment, but it still strikes me that Marner's stick is between Krug's legs, and as he pulls it forward, he just happens to turn the blade behind Krug's right heel.  It certainly adds up when you look at how hard and fast Krug goes down.

Actually comparing Marner to a heroic shrimp on that play would be a good analogy. So I will trust your judgment on that.

 

[herman]

https://twitter.com/RLeesam/status/988573355375673344

The camera cuts up at exactly the wrong moment, but it still strikes me that Marner's stick is between Krug's legs, and as he pulls it forward, he just happens to turn the blade behind Krug's right heel.  It certainly adds up when you look at how hard and fast Krug goes down.

If you don't mind, I will take this as an invitation to continue presenting formal arguments for this play.

Ladies and gentlemen of the forums, at Mr. Shrimp's prompting and out of respect for his keen eye, I have delved deeper into this video capturing the moment when Mr. Mitch Marner was waylaid from behind by Mr. Torey Krug, in which an ensuing scuffle resulted in Mr. Krug thrown to the ice.

Mr. Shrimp contends that while it appears that Mr. Marner hoisted Mr. Krug into the air by the strength of his lower body, he surmises that Mr. Marner aided Mr. Krug's fall by way using his stick behind the skate of Mr. Krug to lever him to the ice.

In my quest to uncover the truth of the matter, I have discovered that Mr. Shrimp is actually correct! [pause for gasps] There was indeed a trip! However, [pause for effect], it was not a trip by way of Mr. Marner's stick!

Exhibit A: At the beginning of the video clip referenced above, as I presented earlier, Mr. Marner's stick is held against the ice in front of Mr. Krug's right skate. As all know from basic kinematics, if a stick was used to trip a player, the direction of motion of the fall would be in the direction of the falling player's centre of gravity traversing over the point of contact with the stick. In layterms, a stick in front of a player's skate would yield a fall forward, while a stick behind the skate would yield a fall backwards. As evidenced by the video, Mr. Krug falls back and to the left.

Exhibit B: Note Mr. Krug's body position at the intiation of his fall. His right leg, ostensibly the one that would be tripped by Mr. Marner's stick, remains on the ice, while his left leg is the first indication that he has lost balance, leading to his fall back and to the left.

Exhibit C: Mr. Marner's moment of force is directed in a single direction: upwards. Mr. Krug had heretofore been draped across Mr. Marner's shoulders, right hand braced upon the back of Mr. Marner's head, but the bulk of his centre of gravity is outside of Mr. Marner's body column. Mr. Marner's movement should not have been able to throw Mr. Krug to the ice if it was a hoisting as I had first surmised.

So what truly caused Mr. Krug's fall?

Ladies and gentlemen of the forum, I refer you back to Exhibit B: Mr. Krug's left leg. At the beginning of the video, Mr. Krug's left leg is not astride Mr. Marner as I had first presumed, but rather his left hip is planted against Mr. Marner's right hip. The moment of force Mr. Marner generates does not lift Mr. Krug's centre of mass, but rather displaces Mr. Krug's left leg up, and the hinging of the hip and the leg continuing to travel above its normal plane of motion levers Mr. Krug's centre of gravity behind his remaining base of balance. Thus, Mr. Krug is thrown to the ice back and to the left.

 

[Heroic Shrimp]

https://twitter.com/RLeesam/status/988573355375673344

The camera cuts up at exactly the wrong moment, but it still strikes me that Marner's stick is between Krug's legs, and as he pulls it forward, he just happens to turn the blade behind Krug's right heel.  It certainly adds up when you look at how hard and fast Krug goes down.

If you don't mind, I will take this as an invitation to continue presenting formal arguments for this play.

Ladies and gentlemen of the forums, at Mr. Shrimp's prompting and out of respect for his keen eye, I have delved deeper into this video capturing the moment when Mr. Mitch Marner was waylaid from behind by Mr. Torey Krug, in which an ensuing scuffle resulted in Mr. Krug thrown to the ice.

Mr. Shrimp contends that while it appears that Mr. Marner hoisted Mr. Krug into the air by the strength of his lower body, he surmises that Mr. Marner aided Mr. Krug's fall by way using his stick behind the skate of Mr. Krug to lever him to the ice.

In my quest to uncover the truth of the matter, I have discovered that Mr. Shrimp is actually correct! [pause for gasps] There was indeed a trip! However, [pause for effect], it was not a trip by way of Mr. Marner's stick!

Exhibit A: At the beginning of the video clip referenced above, as I presented earlier, Mr. Marner's stick is held against the ice in front of Mr. Krug's right skate. As all know from basic kinematics, if a stick was used to trip a player, the direction of motion of the fall would be in the direction of the falling player's centre of gravity traversing over the point of contact with the stick. In layterms, a stick in front of a player's skate would yield a fall forward, while a stick behind the skate would yield a fall backwards. As evidenced by the video, Mr. Krug falls back and to the left.

Exhibit B: Note Mr. Krug's body position at the intiation of his fall. His right leg, ostensibly the one that would be tripped by Mr. Marner's stick, remains on the ice, while his left leg is the first indication that he has lost balance, leading to his fall back and to the left.

Exhibit C: Mr. Marner's moment of force is directed in a single direction: upwards. Mr. Krug had heretofore been draped across Mr. Marner's shoulders, right hand braced upon the back of Mr. Marner's head, but the bulk of his centre of gravity is outside of Mr. Marner's body column. Mr. Marner's movement should not have been able to throw Mr. Krug to the ice if it was a hoisting as I had first surmised.

So what truly caused Mr. Krug's fall?

Ladies and gentlemen of the forum, I refer you back to Exhibit B: Mr. Krug's left leg. At the beginning of the video, Mr. Krug's left leg is not astride Mr. Marner as I had first presumed, but rather his left hip is planted against Mr. Marner's right hip. The moment of force Mr. Marner generates does not lift Mr. Krug's centre of mass, but rather displaces Mr. Krug's left leg up, and the hinging of the hip and the leg continuing to travel above its normal plane of motion levers Mr. Krug's centre of gravity behind his remaining base of balance. Thus, Mr. Krug is thrown to the ice back and to the left.

You're right that it's not Marner's stick!  Fuller video angle here at around 0:06.  Looks a little slew-footy, but you're likely right that it's more Marner's upper leg that is pushing up on Krug's left leg/hip.  Either way, totally accidental and also totally intentional.