Bruins @ Leafs - Jan. 12th, 7:00pm - CBC, TSN 1050

[azzurri63]

Was at the game last night, it looked like a tight one but I saw a couple clear difference makers. 2 horrible turn overs committed by #22, and #51 stung us. The Bruins don't give much. The other thing is, while the stats show the number of hits being fairly even, it certainly didn't look at way. This team continues to push us around and many Leaf players appear intimidated.

I wish the Leafs would play teams like these with a little more of an edge. It's frustratingly painful to watch. #43 seems a mere shadow of his former self. Maybe a Simmonds, a Schenn or a Marlie with some grit call up is in order.

Thanks.That's exactly what I get watching on tv.
Said it last night Bruin players have their way with us because there is no push back.
No one on this team strikes fear into anyone.
Leafs other than Tavares which was a huge addition don't get me wrong have done nothing over the last number of years to address that.
Management must see things the same as others on here who don't think that's still an intricate part of success especially come playoff time.

 

[Guilt Trip]

I didn't notice who it was on the 3rd goal, just that it was not not good.

Why are we not allowed to bring up bad Gardiner defensive zone plays?  Because he has good offense?

We're absolutely allowed to bring up bad Gardiner plays. It would be nice, however, if we also mentioned his good plays which significantly outnumber his bads. The difference in number is so significant, you might even say that he contributes to the success of the team.

While Jake does make good plays, he also makes bad plays most games. He's not a rookie anymore and even tho his mistakes don't always cost the team, thanks to Freddie, he keeps making the same mistakes over and over again. And before anyone starts, he's not a whipping boy. Hainsey gets blasted for his crap as do Zaitsev and the others. My biggest issue with Jake is not so much the giveaways, even tho he's real good at it at times. It's the total out of position, not boxing your guy out, not being physical, letting the other guy get the puck first stuff that drives me nuts. It's like his brain shuts off and he's lost out there at times. His defensive play is not good enough, it just isn't.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

People make it seem like we got swept.

People around here make it seem like we're fighting for Jack Hughes

:

I totally see now why you claimed not to get it in the PP thread the other day.  Apparently this is your go-to move.

What do you mean? I'd think I'm pretty wise not to get into a hockey intelligence conversation with someone that wants to demote Patrick Marleau? For who?

I've explained the shortcomings of this team. I've also explained that you, among others, are severely overreacting after every loss. What more is there to say?

Perhaps I'm a different type of fan. I don't tend to get too emotional after a loss or a win. Perhaps playing hockey my whole life did it to me. I'm not sure, but really, I have a hard time blaming every loss on the goalie, or the coach, or the refs...Losses happen, the next day you wake up and move on with your life. That's what the players do. Should we as fans not do the same.

 

[dekedastardly]

Thanks. That's exactly what I get watching on tv.  Said it last night Bruin players have their way with us because there is no push back. No one on this team strikes fear into anyone.

Not that he's the toughest in league, but games like these make me wonder why Matt Martin had to go. He lands one or two big hits, and suddenly opposition players have a little fear in the back of their minds. Just like the Leafs do when they have to face a Tom Wilson type.

The other thing is, the Leafs aren't getting (and capitalizing on) powerplays. There seems to be not near enough battle to them, or its a matter of them just rolling over for physically intimidating teams like these.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

We need more truculence!

 

[Guilt Trip]

Thanks. That's exactly what I get watching on tv.  Said it last night Bruin players have their way with us because there is no push back. No one on this team strikes fear into anyone.

Not that he's the toughest in league, but games like these make me wonder why Matt Martin had to go. He lands one or two big hits, and suddenly opposition players have a little fear in the back of their minds. Just like the Leafs do when they have to face a Tom Wilson type.

The other thing is, the Leafs aren't getting (and capitalizing on) powerplays. There seems to be not near enough battle to them, or its a matter of them just rolling over for physically intimidating teams like these.

Leafs were 1 for 2 on the PP last night. Matt Martin isn't good enough to play on this team and he certainly isn't putting the fear into anyone on Boston's 4th line because that's who he'd play against. If the Leafs weren't going into the corners, or front of the net, I could see your point.

 

[dekedastardly]

Leafs were 1 for 2 on the PP last night. Matt Martin isn't good enough to play on this team and he certainly isn't putting the fear into anyone on Boston's 4th line because that's who he'd play against. If the Leafs weren't going into the corners, or front of the net, I could see your point.

Yes. They got a PP goal last night. What was that, the 1st in 6 games? It looked a lot better, hopefully we see more of the same. Dunno, he and Mitch seemed to be good buddies, maybe some of that chemistry translates on ice, maybe not.

It's neither here nor there, I'm just saying, you insert the guy on a few shifts here and there to answer the bell. A little push back. The way I see it, the current line up doesn't have that answer - the bigger teams know, and exploit it.

 

[Bender]

Leafs were 1 for 2 on the PP last night. Matt Martin isn't good enough to play on this team and he certainly isn't putting the fear into anyone on Boston's 4th line because that's who he'd play against. If the Leafs weren't going into the corners, or front of the net, I could see your point.

Yes. They got a PP goal last night. What was that, the 1st in 6 games? It looked a lot better, hopefully we see more of the same. Dunno, he and Mitch seemed to be good buddies, maybe some of that chemistry translates on ice, maybe not.

It's neither here nor there, I'm just saying, you insert the guy on a few shifts here and there to answer the bell. A little push back. The way I see it, the current line up doesn't have that answer - the bigger teams know, and exploit it.

Why not go after Colton Orr Frazer McLaren while you're at it. Didn't David Clarkson also have that sandpaper that we so desperately need right now? [emoji848]

Quite frankly that type of player isn't going to provide secondary scoring right now. Instead of replacing our players with downgrades we need to find a way to get them going and scoring. We are overly reliant on JT and Marner right now with very little secondary scoring from Kadri, Matthews, Nylander, and to a lesser extent (because old) Marleau. Having out scoring more evenly spread is the biggest issue right now.

Moneypuck had the score at 4-2 Leafs based on chances. Clearly we are underperforming out expected goals, therefore getting secondary scoring from the players above is to me, beyond getting Andersen back (because we've played  almost 10 games with a third string goalie), is the most important thing for this team right now.

 

[dekedastardly]

Kadri has done next to nothing all year long, imo. Matthews and Nylander get pushed around in these games, that's my point.  A little grit could go a long way in creating some much needed breathing room for our skill guys.

 

[skrackle]

The type of grit the Leafs need isn't the old school Colton Orr-type 4th liner. That's nothing against Orr. I thought he did a great job in a specific role on a Leafs team that was going nowhere at that time.

The Leafs could really use a player like Matthew Tkachuk. Someone that puts some fear into the opposition and is a scoring threat. He's not leaving Calgary anytime soon, so who might be available now that could fill that role? Michael Frolik? Wayne Simmonds? Are they the right fit and what do they cost?

The bigger need is the defense. It has not been sufficiently addressed yet and it remains the Leafs weakness.

I think the Leafs window is just starting to open. There are significant problems for management to solve and cap issues are looming, but the core is very young and very talented. The main pieces for success are in place. Development-wise, I don't think they are there yet. Another 1st round loss would not surprise me. There are roster issues to be solved and they haven't learned how to win in the playoffs yet. The upcoming playoffs should tell a pretty good story of where the Leafs are now and where they need to get to.

 

[Bender]

The type of grit the Leafs need isn't the old school Colton Orr-type 4th liner. That's nothing against Orr. I thought he did a great job in a specific role on a Leafs team that was going nowhere at that time.

The Leafs could really use a player like Matthew Tkachuk. Someone that puts some fear into the opposition and is a scoring threat. He's not leaving Calgary anytime soon, so who might be available now that could fill that role? Michael Frolik? Wayne Simmonds? Are they the right fit and what do they cost?

The bigger need is the defense. It has not been sufficiently addressed yet and it remains the Leafs weakness.

I think the Leafs window is just starting to open. There are significant problems for management to solve and cap issues are looming, but the core is very young and very talented. The main pieces for success are in place. Development-wise, I don't think they are there yet. Another 1st round loss would not surprise me. There are roster issues to be solved and they haven't learned how to win in the playoffs yet. The upcoming playoffs should tell a pretty good story of where the Leafs are now and where they need to get to.

really don't see much of being "pushed around" as it is Matthews being focused on defensively more, Nylander not being ready (obviously) and Kadri is basically snakebitten (who is also our sandpaper btw). I think for Matthews it's about being better in a few more aspects of the game like transition and D and for him to develop into a better two way player. Similar to Nylander but his compete level isn't always there and it's got to go up. Also Kadri's problem isn't about being pushed around either.

It'd be great to have a Matthew Tkachuk type,  (Kadri being closest comparable I guess) but we don't have that and won't get that without giving up a similar asset.

Even if I did see them as being pushed around (because I really don't see it) I don't think it would be a function of them being unable to hang with more naturally gritty players. Grit can be taught and is exactly what Babcock is referring to about playing heavy. This is why he likes Zach Hyman so much.

At the end of the day the only thing that matters is scoring more than the other guy. Whether that's whatever type of player we need as a defining factor, fine, that may be true. But what's also true is Tampa's one of the (of not the) smallest team in the league, also the most skilled and is running away with the points lead. So to me that tells me players like Matthews and Nylander can be tenacious on the puck without being pigeon holed into whatever type of player you're thinking of.

Agree with you on a lot of other points, but this isn't the team's final iteration. It's a work in progress, even the mighty Bolts last year lost to Washington, so to me there's always room for improvement despite what kind of regular season you might have, and maybe something happens at the deadline that really pushes the team forward.