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Game 63: Panthers @ Maple Leafs 7:00PM - The turnaround game.

pnjunction said:
So almost 300 games in Schenn is still a giveaway machine.  Wilson sucks but a coach can't and shouldn't be teaching expensive NHL d-men how to not skate away and leave the puck behind, or how to not get stripped in front of our net. How many more brutal giveaways until we start to think it's just not going to work out?

I think I'd like to see Schenn perform under another coach's system before running him out of town.
 
Bonsixx said:
pnjunction said:
So almost 300 games in Schenn is still a giveaway machine.  Wilson sucks but a coach can't and shouldn't be teaching expensive NHL d-men how to not skate away and leave the puck behind, or how to not get stripped in front of our net. How many more brutal giveaways until we start to think it's just not going to work out?

I think I'd like to see Schenn perform under another coach's system before running him out of town.

I think the Marlies coach would be good for that....when can he start?
 
Bonsixx said:
pnjunction said:
So almost 300 games in Schenn is still a giveaway machine.  Wilson sucks but a coach can't and shouldn't be teaching expensive NHL d-men how to not skate away and leave the puck behind, or how to not get stripped in front of our net. How many more brutal giveaways until we start to think it's just not going to work out?

I think I'd like to see Schenn perform under another coach's system before running him out of town.
Me too but I'm not sure how it helps with those bone-headed blunders.

The only thing I can think of is that if our forwards were more available for passes then the d-men would have an easier time getting rid of it quicker. One poster noted that the forwards were way way up on the first goal.
 
Phaneuf, schenn, Komisarek, MacArthur, Grabovski, Kulemin, Lombardi, Connolly, Liles have all been turning in horrible performances almost every night.
 
Deebo said:
Phaneuf, schenn, Komisarek, MacArthur, Grabovski, Kulemin, Lombardi, Connolly, Liles have all been turning in horrible performances almost every night.

that sounds about right and I think Liles has been the best of those bunch and Connolly the absolute worst IMO
 
If you take a look at the entire season as a whole I'd say Schenn has been the most disappointing followed closely by Connolly and Kulemin.  Those are 3 players we came into the season HEAVILY relying on and all 3 have been terrible.  Not even average... Well, well below.  Just brutal really.

I'm not even going to touch on the goaltending.

Not to mention poor performances from Lombardi, and Komisarek but we knew coming into this season they were going to suck anyways.

 
Yeah, Schenn, Kulemin, either one really.

Problem is Schenns screwing up sooo bad he's costing us goals.  He's terrible on the pk, brutal in his own end, etc.  The guys best year was his rookie year, then 2 out of the next 3 have been extremely dissaponting.

If I were GM he'd be gone so fast in the summer it would make your head spin.

Kulemin has always bugged me because I don't actually see any skill in him.  He's basically a guy that's good at "getting in the way."
 
Erndog said:
If you take a look at the entire season as a whole I'd say Schenn has been the most disappointing followed closely by Connolly and Kulemin.  Those are 3 players we came into the season HEAVILY relying on and all 3 have been terrible.  Not even average... Well, well below.  Just brutal really.

If we're going to be honest right now, Schenn is playing like a bust.  Not saying he can't turn it around--he's young after all. 
But from the beginning, he's had limited tools at his disposal and limited upside as a result.  If basic positioning, skating, and puck-handling all need serious work, it starts to become prudent to ask whether he can even be a 4th defenseman in this league. Right now he looks like a 6th or 7th at best.
 
Strangelove said:
Erndog said:
If you take a look at the entire season as a whole I'd say Schenn has been the most disappointing followed closely by Connolly and Kulemin.  Those are 3 players we came into the season HEAVILY relying on and all 3 have been terrible.  Not even average... Well, well below.  Just brutal really.

If we're going to be honest right now, Schenn is playing like a bust.  Not saying he can't turn it around--he's young after all. 
But from the beginning, he's had limited tools at his disposal and limited upside as a result.  If basic positioning, skating, and puck-handling all need serious work, it starts to become prudent to ask whether he can even be a 4th defenseman in this league. Right now he looks like a 6th or 7th at best.

How does a guy like that get picked 5th overall?
 
Chazz-Micheal Liles said:
Strangelove said:
Erndog said:
If you take a look at the entire season as a whole I'd say Schenn has been the most disappointing followed closely by Connolly and Kulemin.  Those are 3 players we came into the season HEAVILY relying on and all 3 have been terrible.  Not even average... Well, well below.  Just brutal really.

If we're going to be honest right now, Schenn is playing like a bust.  Not saying he can't turn it around--he's young after all. 
But from the beginning, he's had limited tools at his disposal and limited upside as a result.  If basic positioning, skating, and puck-handling all need serious work, it starts to become prudent to ask whether he can even be a 4th defenseman in this league. Right now he looks like a 6th or 7th at best.

How does a guy like that get picked 5th overall?

many high picks are impact players at the lower levels but for some reason it doesn't always  translate to the NHL.  The key for scouts is trying to determine if the player can perform at or near the same level in the NHL.  it's not easy
 
I'm sick as a dog and missed large parts of the game, so maybe that's why I haven't seen Dion Phaneuf play a good shift of hockey in weeks.  What the hell is the matter with that guy?  No defense, no leadership, -3 in his last 5 games, and -6 overall this season.  3 points tonight, but still +/- 0, and I put at least 2 goals allowed entirely on his shoulders - he even put one in himself.

This team of youngsters badly needs leadership and they just aren't getting it.
 
Well, with Burke saying there were so few sellers and so many buyers, I was thinking selling a player or two was the right move.  I can't say this game changed my mind.
 
itsgametime said:
Chazz-Micheal Liles said:
Strangelove said:
Erndog said:
If you take a look at the entire season as a whole I'd say Schenn has been the most disappointing followed closely by Connolly and Kulemin.  Those are 3 players we came into the season HEAVILY relying on and all 3 have been terrible.  Not even average... Well, well below.  Just brutal really.

If we're going to be honest right now, Schenn is playing like a bust.  Not saying he can't turn it around--he's young after all. 
But from the beginning, he's had limited tools at his disposal and limited upside as a result.  If basic positioning, skating, and puck-handling all need serious work, it starts to become prudent to ask whether he can even be a 4th defenseman in this league. Right now he looks like a 6th or 7th at best.

How does a guy like that get picked 5th overall?

many high picks are impact players at the lower levels but for some reason it doesn't always  translate to the NHL.  The key for scouts is trying to determine if the player can perform at or near the same level in the NHL.  it's not easy
Indeed we have the gift of hindsight here but it's probably really hard to predict how well these players will develop their skills, and limitations, at the NHL level. I have to think Schenn was not known for bricking so hard at the junior level, predicting which players will regress is probably harder than picking the ones who will progress..

However these issues were known before Burke handed him that fat contract last summer.  For the money on a defensive guy we should be getting one of the most dependable #4 guys in the league and Schenn has not been that even at his best.  What is it with Burke and overpaying underachieving defensemen?
 
what a load of horse dung

?I think the trade deadline is hard on players, but I think it?s murder on players in Toronto,? Burke said Monday. ?And we just had a serious debate whether next year we?re going to do this 10 days earlier so the players can relax.?
 
Chazz-Micheal Liles said:
Strangelove said:
Erndog said:
If you take a look at the entire season as a whole I'd say Schenn has been the most disappointing followed closely by Connolly and Kulemin.  Those are 3 players we came into the season HEAVILY relying on and all 3 have been terrible.  Not even average... Well, well below.  Just brutal really.

If we're going to be honest right now, Schenn is playing like a bust.  Not saying he can't turn it around--he's young after all. 
But from the beginning, he's had limited tools at his disposal and limited upside as a result.  If basic positioning, skating, and puck-handling all need serious work, it starts to become prudent to ask whether he can even be a 4th defenseman in this league. Right now he looks like a 6th or 7th at best.

How does a guy like that get picked 5th overall?

Don't forget, the Leafs played him as an 18 year old.  That was probably a mistake.
 
Significantly Insignificant said:
Chazz-Micheal Liles said:
Strangelove said:
Erndog said:
If you take a look at the entire season as a whole I'd say Schenn has been the most disappointing followed closely by Connolly and Kulemin.  Those are 3 players we came into the season HEAVILY relying on and all 3 have been terrible.  Not even average... Well, well below.  Just brutal really.

If we're going to be honest right now, Schenn is playing like a bust.  Not saying he can't turn it around--he's young after all. 
But from the beginning, he's had limited tools at his disposal and limited upside as a result.  If basic positioning, skating, and puck-handling all need serious work, it starts to become prudent to ask whether he can even be a 4th defenseman in this league. Right now he looks like a 6th or 7th at best.

How does a guy like that get picked 5th overall?

Don't forget, the Leafs played him as an 18 year old.  That was probably a mistake.

Add Luke to a long list of players set back by the Leafs playing them too soon. They certainly have a team history of this.
 
Schenn is sub-par in both skating and decision making. Those two weaknesses together magnify his issues, because he can't rely on his skating to compensate for his mistakes, like Gardiner for example can do a lot of the time. And he doesn't have the poise or see the ice well like Gunnarsson, so his poor skating is constantly being exposed.

You have to hope that he puts some extra work on his skating, and that his decision making starts to progress as he gains experience.
 

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