Jets @ Leafs - Mar. 9th, 7:00pm - TSN4, Fan 590

[Zee]

On aggregate, I agree. He's mostly been average. His numbers are somewhat skewed from his first 2 starts - he hasn't been as bad as they look, and those 2 games still have a outlying influence on them. He, in fact, has a .910 sv% since - so, not, that's not too much to ask of Andersen. It's what he's provided over his last 17 starts. My issue is more with the blame he gets for individual goals that, frankly, he shouldn't shoulder the majority (or, in a few cases, any meaningful amount) of the blame for.

I mean everyone can play the select sample size game. If you take out Andersen's first 5 games his Sv% is .905. If you look at just his last 6 games he's at .890.

But even if we just stick to that .910 number, that's still just 23rd among goalies in that time frame. A $5mil starting goalie with those numbers, combined with his awful numbers in the 2nd half of last season, simply shouldn't be immune to criticism.

Bro-hug

 

[Frank E]

I think the plan was to get Campbell into a lot more games this season to see if he's got another gear.

 

[bustaheims]

But even if we just stick to that .910 number, that's still just 23rd among goalies in that time frame. A $5mil starting goalie with those numbers, combined with his awful numbers in the 2nd half of last season, simply shouldn't be immune to criticism.

No one is saying he shouldn't be. It's just that criticism should be fair and balanced, and not place undue blame on him for plays where he's ultimately the victim of poor decisions or mistakes made by his teammates. Overall, he hasn't played well. He's been pretty average as starting goalies go. It's the nitpicking over individual goals where, in many cases, I find the criticism to unfair and the kneejerk reaction to focusing the blame on Andersen is something that needs to be called out.

 

[herman]

https://twitter.com/NHL/status/1369446069189419011
Really nice solo effort by Hyman (what a finish), but he definitely could not have done it without Nathan Beaulieu going for that hit because he though Kyle Connor had Hyman covered, as if it was his first time playing with Kyle Connor lol.

Engvall has limited creativity on offence despite his heavy shot (and his scoring curse), but he is very good at going to the net to present an option/distraction.

 

[bustaheims]

https://twitter.com/mirtle/status/1369693127276175364

Andersen's (and the team's) biggest issue is on the PK. He hasn't been good there, and the guys in front of him haven't been all that helpful.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

Yeah, lost in all of the complaining that is a game the Leafs win most nights.  Unfortunately the last three games they have faced some really standout goaltending. 

Hellebuyck is always able to do things like he did last night.
Thatcher Demko is in the middle of a 5 game stretch where he has put up:
1.20 GAA .963 SV%

Its hard to win when the goalie on the other end stands on their head.  The Leafs weren't at their best in the Vancouver games although I would say that again, even in the first Vancouver game their legs fell off part way through the game and Demko stood tall before that bizarre positioning goal from Hutchinson really killed them and Vancouver took momentum moving forward off that.

They had a lot of great scoring chances, many of them from in close in the dirty areas so it wasn't like they were just being cute with the puck all game and struggled because of it.

You are very correct. As herman said above, if Toronto cashes in on even a couple of those chances in the second period, the game is 4-1 Toronto with 7 minutes to play in the 2nd period. Completely different game. Throw in a half a$$ed karate kick by Matthews and a horrible line change and suddenly it's 3-2 Winnipeg.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

I wasn't able to watch the whole game, but I did catch like 3-4* scoring chances that easily could have gone in and changed the narrative of this game. It's a bit tough when the Leafs control the OZ, make like 5 good plays** to get into scoring position but the thing breaks down at play #6 because the puck is on the stick of the 3rd fiddle.

* Nylander to Kerfoot (let's aim for the pad!), Nylander to Hyman (6 on 5), Matthews to Marner (pucks are hard to lift!), Mikheyev getting stickchecked in front of the open net

Of course once the Leafs lose the puck after a flurry of chances, the Jets always seemed to squeak something through on the other end. It's deflating to see your efforts come up empty and even worse to see it go in on your net right away. Feels like a 2019-Hutchinson performance.

** Don't get me started on Marner's shot selection

When I first turned on the game, Kerfoot was just buzzing. I thought, wow, look at him go. So much energy. Then he put the puck in a real stupid spot trying to force a pass and it completely halted the momentum. I thought, oh well that was just one shift. it then happened again on the next shift. Brain dead. Marner is guilty of the same thing when he's off.

Giving away the puck between the top of the circles and the blueline in the offensive zone is almost as dangerous as doing the same in your own zone. I realize that this team is playing a possession game. I've even defended some of the giveaways. But, please for the love of god, put the puck into smart places when you do decide to move it.

That seems to be Kerfoot's limitation, and its probably a really reasonable reminder that he really is a 3rd line player.  He does so many good things but then just isn't able to finish plays.  Playing a decent chunk of the season with Nylander and Tavares hes on pace for around 35 points over 82 games this year.

Yeah, he's limited for sure. He is definitely a 3rd liner and in those instances, you want him to funnel the puck to the net, not try to be Mitch Marner or William Nylander. He doesn't have the touch or the vision.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

On aggregate, I agree. He's mostly been average. His numbers are somewhat skewed from his first 2 starts - he hasn't been as bad as they look, and those 2 games still have a outlying influence on them. He, in fact, has a .910 sv% since - so, not, that's not too much to ask of Andersen. It's what he's provided over his last 17 starts. My issue is more with the blame he gets for individual goals that, frankly, he shouldn't shoulder the majority (or, in a few cases, any meaningful amount) of the blame for.

I mean everyone can play the select sample size game. If you take out Andersen's first 5 games his Sv% is .905. If you look at just his last 6 games he's at .890.

But even if we just stick to that .910 number, that's still just 23rd among goalies in that time frame. A $5mil starting goalie with those numbers, combined with his awful numbers in the 2nd half of last season, simply shouldn't be immune to criticism.

There's a difference between criticism and blame.

Side Note: I also have a real issue with Sv% being used as a number to judge goalies on (again, probably my bias)

 

[OldTimeHockey]

But even if we just stick to that .910 number, that's still just 23rd among goalies in that time frame. A $5mil starting goalie with those numbers, combined with his awful numbers in the 2nd half of last season, simply shouldn't be immune to criticism.

No one is saying he shouldn't be. It's just that criticism should be fair and balanced, and not place undue blame on him for plays where he's ultimately the victim of poor decisions or mistakes made by his teammates. Overall, he hasn't played well. He's been pretty average as starting goalies go. It's the nitpicking over individual goals where, in many cases, I find the criticism to unfair and the kneejerk reaction to focusing the blame on Andersen is something that needs to be called out.

Amen. Goalies are always the easy, immediate scapegoat.

 

[dappleganger]

 

[Guilt Trip]

But even if we just stick to that .910 number, that's still just 23rd among goalies in that time frame. A $5mil starting goalie with those numbers, combined with his awful numbers in the 2nd half of last season, simply shouldn't be immune to criticism.

No one is saying he shouldn't be. It's just that criticism should be fair and balanced, and not place undue blame on him for plays where he's ultimately the victim of poor decisions or mistakes made by his teammates. Overall, he hasn't played well. He's been pretty average as starting goalies go. It's the nitpicking over individual goals where, in many cases, I find the criticism to unfair and the kneejerk reaction to focusing the blame on Andersen is something that needs to be called out.

Amen. Goalies are always the easy, immediate scapegoat.

Agreed x2.

 

[bustaheims]

But even if we just stick to that .910 number, that's still just 23rd among goalies in that time frame. A $5mil starting goalie with those numbers, combined with his awful numbers in the 2nd half of last season, simply shouldn't be immune to criticism.

No one is saying he shouldn't be. It's just that criticism should be fair and balanced, and not place undue blame on him for plays where he's ultimately the victim of poor decisions or mistakes made by his teammates. Overall, he hasn't played well. He's been pretty average as starting goalies go. It's the nitpicking over individual goals where, in many cases, I find the criticism to unfair and the kneejerk reaction to focusing the blame on Andersen is something that needs to be called out.

Amen. Goalies are always the easy, immediate scapegoat.

And, that isn't to say it isn't sometimes deserved - like that goal on Hutchinson the other night. It's that it shouldn't be the default.

 

[cabber24]

Deserve to Win O'Meter indeed, the eyeball test confirms.

 

[Guilt Trip]

But even if we just stick to that .910 number, that's still just 23rd among goalies in that time frame. A $5mil starting goalie with those numbers, combined with his awful numbers in the 2nd half of last season, simply shouldn't be immune to criticism.

No one is saying he shouldn't be. It's just that criticism should be fair and balanced, and not place undue blame on him for plays where he's ultimately the victim of poor decisions or mistakes made by his teammates. Overall, he hasn't played well. He's been pretty average as starting goalies go. It's the nitpicking over individual goals where, in many cases, I find the criticism to unfair and the kneejerk reaction to focusing the blame on Andersen is something that needs to be called out.

Amen. Goalies are always the easy, immediate scapegoat.

And, that isn't to say it isn't sometimes deserved - like that goal on Hutchinson the other night. It's that it shouldn't be the default.

Agree and when it cames to Freddie last night, I found it ridiculous.

 

[Guilt Trip]

Deserve to Win O'Meter indeed, the eyeball test confirms.

Absolutely no doubt. I said it when it was 4-2. Leafs have been the best team and it isn't close. If they keep playing that way and clean up a few details, they'll win most of their games. I for one can't wait for Muzz to lose that face shield. It's definitely hurting him.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

Deserve to Win O'Meter indeed, the eyeball test confirms.

I for one can't wait for Muzz to lose that face shield. It's definitely hurting him.

Holl has also been off. It's weird how a guy who seemed so confident for the first 2 months of the season now seems a little lost in front of his net. Is this a direct result of Muzzin not being there to clean things up?

 

[bustaheims]

Deserve to Win O'Meter indeed, the eyeball test confirms.

Absolutely no doubt. I said it when it was 4-2. Leafs have been the best team and it isn't close. If they keep playing that way and clean up a few details, they'll win most of their games. I for one can't wait for Muzz to lose that face shield. It's definitely hurting him.

Yup. If they can minimize the sloppy line changes and the cross-ice stretch passes, and keep pushing the pace offensively as they did last night, they're going to be very successful. They're not going to run into goalies playing as well as Hellebuyck did last night all that frequently. On most other nights, it would have been a blowout in the Leafs' favour.

 

[L K]

Deserve to Win O'Meter indeed, the eyeball test confirms.

I for one can't wait for Muzz to lose that face shield. It's definitely hurting him.

Holl has also been off. It's weird how a guy who seemed so confident for the first 2 months of the season now seems a little lost in front of his net. Is this a direct result of Muzzin not being there to clean things up?

He struggled in the games Muzzin was out too.  I think it might be a bit of Holl's play falling back toward the mean of him being very good but not our best defenseman levels of good and Muzzin being the bigger driving force on how good their pairing is. 

 

[Guilt Trip]

Deserve to Win O'Meter indeed, the eyeball test confirms.

I for one can't wait for Muzz to lose that face shield. It's definitely hurting him.

Holl has also been off. It's weird how a guy who seemed so confident for the first 2 months of the season now seems a little lost in front of his net. Is this a direct result of Muzzin not being there to clean things up?

He struggled in the games Muzzin was out too.  I think it might be a bit of Holl's play falling back toward the mean of him being very good but not our best defenseman levels of good and Muzzin being the bigger driving force on how good their pairing is. 

Could also be the dog days of the season as they say. I do agree though, he's better with Muzz and he's been a lil off with the shield.

 

[ZBBM]

If the Leafs are going to insist on running a sub-100% Matthews (who, to be fair, is still better than most of the NHL), then it's time to flip Nylander and Marner.

That's what I said last night.

But I still think they should sit Matthews through the time off next week.  At least get him the hell away from the front of the next except on PPs.  If he gets badly hurt playing in front because he can't shoot from the outside, we'll have a lot bigger problems that arguing how much of Andersen's advanced stats the team has overcome to give Freddie his completely undeserved 12-5-2.