Goaliedave31
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Goaliedave31 said:When we are talking about whether or not our stars are as good as or better than other teams stars, one thing that is important to keep in mind is that throughout the team's history, no matter how successful or not the team has been, our stars have never been quite as good as theirs, with a few exceptions. Since 1937-38, when Gord Drillon won the league scoring championship, no Leaf has won it. Sittler and Gilmour came close, but that's it. I believe that for long time fans, or those well aware of the team's past, this is a constant thorn in the side. Here we are, in 2019, and our best are pretty good, but not in the way McDavid, Draisaitl, McKinnon, Ovechkin, and a select few others are. Until a Leaf dominates the league in the way that these players do, we will never be satisfied with our best guys just being 'pretty good".
Frycer14 said:Last I checked, he's got the same number of points this season as Connor Brown.
Bullfrog said:herman said:I think one of the reasons people lust after the stars on other teams is that they only catch the highlights and those players feature prominently largely in positive light visually and in commentary.
On the home team, our stars are watched regularly with invested expectations regularly enough that their strengths are taken for granted and flaws are magnified. Once that little seed of disappointment germinates, confirmation bias fuels the rest.
The appearance of trying doesn't necessarily equate to effective.
Thanks herman. I think this is a good observation.
Goaliedave31 said:When we are talking about whether or not our stars are as good as or better than other teams stars, one thing that is important to keep in mind is that throughout the team's history, no matter how successful or not the team has been, our stars have never been quite as good as theirs, with a few exceptions. Since 1937-38, when Gord Drillon won the league scoring championship, no Leaf has won it. Sittler and Gilmour came close, but that's it. I believe that for long time fans, or those well aware of the team's past, this is a constant thorn in the side. Here we are, in 2019, and our best are pretty good, but not in the way McDavid, Draisaitl, McKinnon, Ovechkin, and a select few others are. Until a Leaf dominates the league in the way that these players do, we will never be satisfied with our best guys just being 'pretty good".
Nik Bethune said:Frycer14 said:Last I checked, he's got the same number of points this season as Connor Brown.
You should probably check again.
herman said:Heck, Nylander/Marner outpaced MacKinnon's ELC years. I don't know that they hit his current level in their primes, but this team has three of these kids with lots of runway left.
Nik Bethune said:herman said:Heck, Nylander/Marner outpaced MacKinnon's ELC years. I don't know that they hit his current level in their primes, but this team has three of these kids with lots of runway left.
They're 22, 22 and 23. The idea that anyone is having serious discussions about trading any of them right now because of what they aren't yet is just mind blowing.
herman said:Nik Bethune said:Frycer14 said:Last I checked, he's got the same number of points this season as Connor Brown.
You should probably check again.
LMAO
Nylander is currently outscoring every member of the senators
CarltonTheBear said:Gonna be fun to re-visit that at the end of the season. Brown had a hot start, congrats to him. But he just recently snapped a 16-game goalless drought and has 5 points in his last 16 games.
Nik Bethune said:Nylander is playing at a 30 goal/60 point pace. Brown is playing at a 9 goal/48 point pace.
bustaheims said:Nik Bethune said:Nylander is playing at a 30 goal/60 point pace. Brown is playing at a 9 goal/48 point pace.
And, in his last 16 games, he has 8 goals and 13 points. That's a 41 goal, 67 point pace.
Definitely back on track, and well ahead of Connor freaking Brown's 1 goal and 5 points in his last 16.
Frank E said:I'm saving this quote...
Nik Bethune said:Frank E said:I'm saving this quote...
For reference if you ever decide to try a fact based argument?
Frank E said:So I find it funny that we're using projections based on shortened periods of time to define "Nylander is back", or "has arrived".
Frank E said:Really Nik? Settle down.
I'm saving it because I think over the years (as busta has been around for the entirety of Nylander's pro career) we've seen Nylander go through stretches of very inconsistent play. So I find it funny that we're using projections based on shortened periods of time to define "Nylander is back", or "has arrived".
I was using facts there above with the totals YTD of their production. I expect some kudos for that. Big ones.
bustaheims said:Frank E said:Really Nik? Settle down.
I'm saving it because I think over the years (as busta has been around for the entirety of Nylander's pro career) we've seen Nylander go through stretches of very inconsistent play. So I find it funny that we're using projections based on shortened periods of time to define "Nylander is back", or "has arrived".
I was using facts there above with the totals YTD of their production. I expect some kudos for that. Big ones.
I mean, it's 20% of the season I'm looking at, and I'm also not saying he's going to hit the totals he's on pace for in that time-or that Brown is going to stay that terrible (though, I'd say that's more likely). It's more to suggest that his play recently shows that, at the very least, he's performing at a level similar to his first two seasons on the team, and is possibly going to exceed his previous career totals.
herman said:Goaliedave31 said:When we are talking about whether or not our stars are as good as or better than other teams stars, one thing that is important to keep in mind is that throughout the team's history, no matter how successful or not the team has been, our stars have never been quite as good as theirs, with a few exceptions. Since 1937-38, when Gord Drillon won the league scoring championship, no Leaf has won it. Sittler and Gilmour came close, but that's it. I believe that for long time fans, or those well aware of the team's past, this is a constant thorn in the side. Here we are, in 2019, and our best are pretty good, but not in the way McDavid, Draisaitl, McKinnon, Ovechkin, and a select few others are. Until a Leaf dominates the league in the way that these players do, we will never be satisfied with our best guys just being 'pretty good".
Matthews is technically in that conversation, but he has played restrained minutes these first 3 seasons, marred by injury, and didn't get the playoff rope that the other names mentioned do. Just a simple cut of the data by rates and it paints a pretty clear picture that we've got a good one. He's 22 and keeping pace with (and/or exceeding) age-equivalent/era-adjusted production.
bustaheims said:herman said:Goaliedave31 said:When we are talking about whether or not our stars are as good as or better than other teams stars, one thing that is important to keep in mind is that throughout the team's history, no matter how successful or not the team has been, our stars have never been quite as good as theirs, with a few exceptions. Since 1937-38, when Gord Drillon won the league scoring championship, no Leaf has won it. Sittler and Gilmour came close, but that's it. I believe that for long time fans, or those well aware of the team's past, this is a constant thorn in the side. Here we are, in 2019, and our best are pretty good, but not in the way McDavid, Draisaitl, McKinnon, Ovechkin, and a select few others are. Until a Leaf dominates the league in the way that these players do, we will never be satisfied with our best guys just being 'pretty good".
Matthews is technically in that conversation, but he has played restrained minutes these first 3 seasons, marred by injury, and didn't get the playoff rope that the other names mentioned do. Just a simple cut of the data by rates and it paints a pretty clear picture that we've got a good one. He's 22 and keeping pace with (and/or exceeding) age-equivalent/era-adjusted production.
Matthews is 100% in that conversation. Since he's entered the league, only 5 players have scored more goals, and only 2 have scored at a better goals per game rate. Hard to argue that wouldn't qualify as "dominating the league."