Roman Polak to Leafs

[rdowdall]

So yeah, they traded the guy that looked to be unable to play his role from two years ago, for a guy that can Mark Fraser's role this year.

It just doesn't seem to make a lot of sense if you think that they want to capture an identity that revolved around hitting people and blocking shots and then trade Gunnarsson for someone with fewer hits and blocked shots.

Then we have been sold a bunch of lies.  Dave Nonis has lied to us.  Can you smell that Dave Nonis?  Those are your pants.  They are on fire.

 

[Deebo]

So yeah, they traded the guy that looked to be unable to play his role from two years ago, for a guy that can Mark Fraser's role this year.

It just doesn't seem to make a lot of sense if you think that they want to capture an identity that revolved around hitting people and blocking shots and then trade Gunnarsson for someone with fewer hits and blocked shots.

Last year:

Gunnarsson registered 15 more hits in 8 more games and ~2 more minutes per game.

He also played on a team that allowed more attempts on goal than any other team in league, which would inflate his shot blocking totals in comparison to someone who played for team like the Blues who were among the leagues best in that category.

Last 3 years:

Hits:

Gunnarsson 358.00
Polak         434.00

Blocks:

Gunnarsson 399.00
Polak             350.00

 

[Kin]

Then we have been sold a bunch of lies.  Dave Nonis has lied to us.  Can you smell that Dave Nonis?  Those are your pants.  They are on fire.

Well, no. The trade still makes perfect sense if Nonis thinks that Polak is a better defenseman than Gunnarsson is. It just doesn't seem to fit into the idea that they're trying to rebuild the juggernaut that was the 2013 Maple Leafs.

 

[Bender]

So yeah, they traded the guy that looked to be unable to play his role from two years ago, for a guy that can Mark Fraser's role this year.

It just doesn't seem to make a lot of sense if you think that they want to capture an identity that revolved around hitting people and blocking shots and then trade Gunnarsson for someone with fewer hits and blocked shots.

Wasn't scoring from our backend a big issue last year? No we're getting a bigger body and more sandpaper but less points, hits and blocked shots.

This is insane. I can't believe we still value "lunch pail guys" over guys who work equally as hard but have more facets to their game. Why are they lauded as salt of the earth, higher compete as opposed to more obviously talented players who also work very hard?

I don't get it.

 

[Kin]

Wasn't scoring from our backend a big issue last year? No we're getting a bigger body and more sandpaper but less points, hits and blocked shots.

This is insane. I can't believe we still value "lunch pail guys" over guys who work equally as hard but have more facets to their game. Why are they lauded as salt of the earth, higher compete as opposed to more obviously talented players who also work very hard?

I don't get it.

I don't know how fair that is. By accounts Polak is a pretty good skater and while Gunnar did score more points last year, I really have to think most of that came by virtue playing a lot with Phaneuf and then the top line because if the Leafs scored more than a handful of goals as a result of something Carl Gunnarsson did, I sure as heck don't remember it.

I don't think this trade can be easily categorized as the Leafs wanting more "lunch-pail guys" or is in any way uneven to the point that it should serve as another truncheon to beat management about the head with.

They're probably roughly equal players but Polak hits people good and so Shanahan and co. decided to throw in a couple of almost entirely meaningless assets to get the guy that both teams seemingly prefer. If ever there was a wait and see on a trade, this would be it.

 

[slapshot]

Oh please, people have been high on Gunnarsson for years. He's been the team's best all-around defenceman for the last two, anyway.

That says a lot about the state of this team, doesn't it? Truth is Gunnerson like some have said is nothing more than a 4-5 guys on contender when healthy. Last year, he played more like a 5-6 guy due to hip issues. Nice guy, but both Gardiner and Rielly are passing/past him on the depth chart. Phaneuf when not logging crazy minutes bring more to the table. That leaves Polak, Franson and Gleason for the 4,5,6 spots. Moving one of the kids up in minutes makes total sense, so Gunner was dropping back anyway.

 

[Highlander]

Gleason and now Franson will be gone. I have a feeling Franson and Reimer in some sort of deal with a draft pick to Winterpeg. Prehaps Kane the other way????

 

[Andy007]

Gleason and now Franson will be gone. I have a feeling Franson and Reimer in some sort of deal with a draft pick to Winterpeg. Prehaps Kane the other way????

The other way to where? Certainly not to Toronto for Franson and Reimer.

 

[Andy007]

Oh please, people have been high on Gunnarsson for years. He's been the team's best all-around defenceman for the last two, anyway.

That says a lot about the state of this team, doesn't it? Truth is Gunnerson like some have said is nothing more than a 4-5 guys on contender when healthy. Last year, he played more like a 5-6 guy due to hip issues. Nice guy, but both Gardiner and Rielly are passing/past him on the depth chart. Phaneuf when not logging crazy minutes bring more to the table. That leaves Polak, Franson and Gleason for the 4,5,6 spots. Moving one of the kids up in minutes makes total sense, so Gunner was dropping back anyway.

Why would Franson, Polak or Gleason supplant Gunnarsson? Just because you said he played like a 5-6 d-man last year? He had the best plus-minus on the defence, and he played top pairing minutes against the other team's top players.

Anyway my response that you are quoting was in regards to Nik's insinuation that most people in this thread only value Gunnarsson now that he's been traded.

 

[Kin]

Anyway my response that you are quoting was in regards to Nik's insinuation that most people in this thread only value Gunnarsson now that he's been traded.

Which is not what I was insinuating, now that we're clearing things up.

 

[mr grieves]

They're probably roughly equal players but Polak hits people good and so Shanahan and co. decided to throw in a couple of almost entirely meaningless assets to get the guy that both teams seemingly prefer. If ever there was a wait and see on a trade, this would be it.

Depends how much Gunnarsson benefitted from playing with Phaneuf, how much Polak's partner dragged him down. Gunnarsson did pretty well limiting what Crosby, Moulson, Krejci, Turris (and others he played against frequently) could do. Polak seems to have had trouble against Jamie McGinn, Vernon Fiddler, and Bryan Bickell.

 

[Kin]

Depends how much Gunnarsson benefitted from playing with Phaneuf, how much Polak's partner dragged him down. Gunnarsson did pretty well limiting what Crosby, Moulson, Krejci, Turris (and others he played against frequently) could do. Polak seems to have had trouble against Jamie McGinn, Vernon Fiddler, and Bryan Bickell.

I think you might be down the rabbit hole.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Oh please, people have been high on Gunnarsson for years. He's been the team's best all-around defenceman for the last two, anyway.

That says a lot about the state of this team, doesn't it? Truth is Gunnerson like some have said is nothing more than a 4-5 guys on contender when healthy. Last year, he played more like a 5-6 guy due to hip issues. Nice guy, but both Gardiner and Rielly are passing/past him on the depth chart. Phaneuf when not logging crazy minutes bring more to the table. That leaves Polak, Franson and Gleason for the 4,5,6 spots. Moving one of the kids up in minutes makes total sense, so Gunner was dropping back anyway.

Why would Franson, Polak or Gleason supplant Gunnarsson? Just because you said he played like a 5-6 d-man last year? He had the best plus-minus on the defence, and he played top pairing minutes against the other team's top players.

Anyway my response that you are quoting was in regards to Nik's insinuation that most people in this thread only value Gunnarsson now that he's been traded.

I think generally Gunnarsson was viewed as a dependable, quietly effect d-man who was valuable but who was playing 1st pairing minutes that he shouldn't have been playing.  I could see him being more effective in a different role.

 

[Andy007]

Anyway my response that you are quoting was in regards to Nik's insinuation that most people in this thread only value Gunnarsson now that he's been traded.

Which is not what I was insinuating, now that we're clearing things up.

"
There's really nothing that increases a Maple Leafs' value more than getting traded away from the club. "

So you mean you weren't insinuating but blatantly stating?

 

[Kin]

Anyway my response that you are quoting was in regards to Nik's insinuation that most people in this thread only value Gunnarsson now that he's been traded.

Which is not what I was insinuating, now that we're clearing things up.

"
There's really nothing that increases a Maple Leafs' value more than getting traded away from the club. "

So you mean you weren't insinuating but blatantly stating?

No, I mean there's a difference between fans generally overvaluing players after they've been traded with not valuing them at all while they're here.

 

[rdowdall]

Then we have been sold a bunch of lies.  Dave Nonis has lied to us.  Can you smell that Dave Nonis?  Those are your pants.  They are on fire.

Well, no. The trade still makes perfect sense if Nonis thinks that Polak is a better defenseman than Gunnarsson is. It just doesn't seem to fit into the idea that they're trying to rebuild the juggernaut that was the 2013 Maple Leafs.

If only they hadn't run in to the X-Men..........Wait a second.  I didn't use the word juggernaut......

 

[Chev-boyar-sky]

Gleason and now Franson will be gone. I have a feeling Franson and Reimer in some sort of deal with a draft pick to Winterpeg. Prehaps Kane the other way????

How about to the Isles for a decent piece?

 

[mr grieves]

Depends how much Gunnarsson benefitted from playing with Phaneuf, how much Polak's partner dragged him down. Gunnarsson did pretty well limiting what Crosby, Moulson, Krejci, Turris (and others he played against frequently) could do. Polak seems to have had trouble against Jamie McGinn, Vernon Fiddler, and Bryan Bickell.

I think you might be down the rabbit hole.

Just ExtraSkater's list of most-seen opponents and stats for how productive those players are vs. Gunnarsson and Polak.

 

[93forever]

Pierre MaGuire liked the Leafs picking up Polak.  Maguire says he is a hard hitter who blocks shots which means he sucks if the quote came from Maguire.

 

[Redleaf]

Gunnarsson fans (like myself) won't like this...

http://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/2014/6/30/5856516/carl-gunnarsson-vs-roman-polak