Western Conference Final: San Jose vs. St. Louis

[herman]

They could also just assign a video ref who can also make on-ice calls.

 

[bustaheims]

They could also just assign a video ref who can also make on-ice calls.

I'm not sure adding more officials will help, considering the current calibre of officiating in the league. Set a time limit on how far back a review can look, and how long it can take to come to a decision, and let the refs who are already there figure it out. The clear plays will (hopefully) be called right, and the borderline plays won't slow down the game so much.

 

[cabber24]

I don't know, I think San Jose is just cashing in all their built-up Karma at once. They literally feel destined to win.

 

[Guilt Trip]

They could also just assign a video ref who can also make on-ice calls.

I'm not sure adding more officials will help, considering the current calibre of officiating in the league. Set a time limit on how far back a review can look, and how long it can take to come to a decision, and let the refs who are already there figure it out. The clear plays will (hopefully) be called right, and the borderline plays won't slow down the game so much.

Craig Button has what I think is a great idea. Every team has 2 challenges during a game and they can challenge anything. High sticks, major/minor penalties etc. Win it, it costs you the challenge. Lose it, penalty for delay of game.
Another solution would be to allow the war room to call down to the box and say yes or no to a goal, especially in the late stages of a game and certainly in OT.
And while we're on changes...lose the shootout and keep playing 3 on 3...lol

 

[Guilt Trip]

I don't know, I think San Jose is just cashing in all their built-up Karma at once. They literally feel destined to win.

Maybe but let's not forget the Blues got a favourable call during the game. The puck over the glass was clearly a penalty and by not calling it, it had an effect on the game. San Jse is def cashing in on their gifts.

 

[L K]

The easiest solution to this problem is to just make hand passes legal. I can't think of a single reason why it shouldn't be.

The league should really go through the rule book point by point and do a thorough review of everything in it to see if anything can be updated/changed. There are rules in there that are decades old that can be changed that wouldn't change the game in any way really (like getting rid of the stupid 2 minutes for bleeding rule).

Seems like a fair point.  You can kick the puck to another player, just not kick it into the net.  You can hand pass the puck to a player, just not hand pass it into the net.  Fixes the problem on this one pretty easy.

 

[Frank E]

The easiest solution to this problem is to just make hand passes legal. I can't think of a single reason why it shouldn't be.

The league should really go through the rule book point by point and do a thorough review of everything in it to see if anything can be updated/changed. There are rules in there that are decades old that can be changed that wouldn't change the game in any way really (like getting rid of the stupid 2 minutes for bleeding rule).

Seems like a fair point.  You can kick the puck to another player, just not kick it into the net.  You can hand pass the puck to a player, just not hand pass it into the net.  Fixes the problem on this one pretty easy.

Just playing devil's advocate here, but wouldn't that lead to some entry strategies of launching pucks at speed into upper areas of players, where which injury concerns might be something?

It's OK, you can just say "You're right, Frank"...or also, "You're super smart, Frank."

 

[OldTimeHockey]

I don't like the idea that because a referee messes up a call the rule should just be thrown out. It's not like a game is blown because of a missed hand pass happens often. I can't think of ever seeing it before. I'm sure it's happened, but I don't personally know when.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Just playing devil's advocate here, but wouldn't that lead to some entry strategies of launching pucks at speed into upper areas of players, where which injury concerns might be something?

But... why?

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I don't like the idea that because a referee messes up a call the rule should just be thrown out. It's not like a game is blown because of a missed hand pass happens often. I can't think of ever seeing it before. I'm sure it's happened, but I don't personally know when.

I'm saying the rule should be thrown out because it's pretty pointless. The fact that it's a hot topic now just gives a good reason to re-examine it's purpose. There's lot of ways that the NHL could streamline it's rulebook and doing so would probably have a positive effect on the flow of the game. Generally speaking the less whistles the better.

 

[bustaheims]

I'm saying the rule should be thrown out because it's pretty pointless. The fact that it's a hot topic now just gives a good reason to re-examine it's purpose. There's lot of ways that the NHL could streamline it's rulebook and doing so would probably have a positive effect on the flow of the game. Generally speaking the less whistles the better.

Agreed. Nothing wrong with reviewing the rules every so often to see what works, what still makes sense, and what doesn?t.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

I don't like the idea that because a referee messes up a call the rule should just be thrown out. It's not like a game is blown because of a missed hand pass happens often. I can't think of ever seeing it before. I'm sure it's happened, but I don't personally know when.

I'm saying the rule should be thrown out because it's pretty pointless. The fact that it's a hot topic now just gives a good reason to re-examine it's purpose. There's lot of ways that the NHL could streamline it's rulebook and doing so would probably have a positive effect on the flow of the game. Generally speaking the less whistles the better.

I don't disagree with that. My concern would be that you would now have judgement calls by referees of whether or not the guy controls the puck with his hand. Whether he closes his hand on the puck...etc; Currently, it's black and white. "Did he pass the puck with his hand? Yes? Dead play." I think they'd have to be very careful on how they worded a rule that allowed hand passes.

I know that it's allowed in the defensive zone, but a messed up call on a play when you're in your own zone doesn't necessarily lead to what we saw two nights ago. I personally do not look forward to an NHL where players can grab the puck out of the air and throw it behind their back to the player in front of the net for the tap in. That's basketball. Not hockey.

 

[hockeyfan1]

Well, this is what the rulebook states:

Clearly, the referees blew it and the NHL has taken action:

[tweet]1129150997081731072[/tweet]

 

[hockeyfan1]

What else would it not be...

?It just crushes the game,? said one longtime player who is considered among the most knowledgeable of hockey people. ?There?s a complete lack of consistency.?

https://theathletic.com/980820/2019/05/16/sharks-controversial-winner-latest-example-of-nhls-officiating-crisis/

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I don't disagree with that. My concern would be that you would now have judgement calls by referees of whether or not the guy controls the puck with his hand. Whether he closes his hand on the puck...etc; Currently, it's black and white. "Did he pass the puck with his hand? Yes? Dead play." I think they'd have to be very careful on how they worded a rule that allowed hand passes.

I know that it's allowed in the defensive zone, but a messed up call on a play when you're in your own zone doesn't necessarily lead to what we saw two nights ago. I personally do not look forward to an NHL where players can grab the puck out of the air and throw it behind their back to the player in front of the net for the tap in. That's basketball. Not hockey.

There already is a separate penalty for closing your hand on the puck so I don't think it would change whether or not the refs need to differentiate between the two.

 

[bustaheims]

I don't disagree with that. My concern would be that you would now have judgement calls by referees of whether or not the guy controls the puck with his hand. Whether he closes his hand on the puck...etc; Currently, it's black and white. "Did he pass the puck with his hand? Yes? Dead play." I think they'd have to be very careful on how they worded a rule that allowed hand passes.

I know that it's allowed in the defensive zone, but a messed up call on a play when you're in your own zone doesn't necessarily lead to what we saw two nights ago. I personally do not look forward to an NHL where players can grab the puck out of the air and throw it behind their back to the player in front of the net for the tap in. That's basketball. Not hockey.

There already is a separate penalty for closing your hand on the puck so I don't think it would change whether or not the refs need to differentiate between the two.

Yeah. That's already a judgment call they have to make - and, quite frankly, one that maybe they should enforce more stringently than they have been.

The line here is easy - knocked down/batted out of the air? Good play. Grabbing the puck out of the air/having in your hand for more a 1/10 of a second, closed glove or not/throwing the puck? That's a penalty.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

I don't disagree with that. My concern would be that you would now have judgement calls by referees of whether or not the guy controls the puck with his hand. Whether he closes his hand on the puck...etc; Currently, it's black and white. "Did he pass the puck with his hand? Yes? Dead play." I think they'd have to be very careful on how they worded a rule that allowed hand passes.

I know that it's allowed in the defensive zone, but a messed up call on a play when you're in your own zone doesn't necessarily lead to what we saw two nights ago. I personally do not look forward to an NHL where players can grab the puck out of the air and throw it behind their back to the player in front of the net for the tap in. That's basketball. Not hockey.

There already is a separate penalty for closing your hand on the puck so I don't think it would change whether or not the refs need to differentiate between the two.

That's great. But currently, both result in a blown whistle. Missing a penalty is one thing. Missing a blatant glove pass that leads to a goal that ends a Conference final is another.

Like I said, I have no issue with them removing the glove pass rule if they can get it right. As we've seen, they don't seem to get it right often.

Make any goal reviewable and all the problems are solved.

 

[Oracle]

I don't disagree with that. My concern would be that you would now have judgement calls by referees of whether or not the guy controls the puck with his hand. Whether he closes his hand on the puck...etc; Currently, it's black and white. "Did he pass the puck with his hand? Yes? Dead play." I think they'd have to be very careful on how they worded a rule that allowed hand passes.

I know that it's allowed in the defensive zone, but a messed up call on a play when you're in your own zone doesn't necessarily lead to what we saw two nights ago. I personally do not look forward to an NHL where players can grab the puck out of the air and throw it behind their back to the player in front of the net for the tap in. That's basketball. Not hockey.

There already is a separate penalty for closing your hand on the puck so I don't think it would change whether or not the refs need to differentiate between the two.

That's great. But currently, both result in a blown whistle. Missing a penalty is one thing. Missing a blatant glove pass that leads to a goal that ends a Conference final is another.

Like I said, I have no issue with them removing the glove pass rule if they can get it right. As we've seen, they don't seem to get it right often.

Make any goal reviewable and all the problems are solved.

I don't know if I've seen all the angles, but from what I did see they were all from behind, a review probably wouldn't have changed the call on the ice since you can't actually see the glove hit the puck. What if it was a forearm pass? Or elbow? Would that be good? Of course if there are better angles that I haven't seen, then, never mind.

Edit: Just youtubed it, it was glove pass. Never mind.
Edit edit: Although, it may have grazed Boumeester's leg. Don't know if the refs made that case.

 

[Guilt Trip]

This series could actually be over now. Blues win 5-0 to go up 3-2 in the series. Sharks look done.

 

[Andy007]

I don't think I'll ever understand the NHL. You have playoff games like Game 2 Leafs/Bruins where it's a WWE free-for-all and literally anything is allowed and then you have games like this where STL has 8(!) power plays. The lack of consistency is astounding.