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2011 Blue Jays/MLB Thread

Sarge said:
hile far from perfect, I think Daddy should be considered a semi-decent way to project son.
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Which is fine but you can't say that and then stick your head in the sand about the fact that Cecil didn't have a single year of even a 2.0 WAR after the age of 28.
 
Saint Nik said:
The guy wasn't hitting well enough to be taking up at-bats regardless of position.
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I honestly don't think I can agree with that statement. I mean, I know we tend to be slaves to advancement metrics and all, but, when I look at his raw totals for those years, I don't see a guy who was just scraping by. His HR totals were still very good (factoring in the fact he missed almost 80 games between 94 and 95), he was still driving runs home, etc. He was starting to slow down, no doubt, and he was obviously no longer an elite bat, but he was still a productive bat.
 
Busta Reims said:
I honestly don't think I can agree with that statement. I mean, I know we tend to be slaves to advancement metrics and all, but, when I look at his raw totals for those years, I don't see a guy who was just scraping by.
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But you have to take in the contexts of the offensive totals of the era, the park factors and the reality of what's expected from a 1B offensively and balance the totals against the outs being made. Tons of runs were being scored and a lot of really crappy ballplayers were putting up big numbers. Fielder, in '96, rates below guys like Scott Stahoviak, Julio Franco and John Jaha.
 
Busta Reims said:
Trolloc said:
Suprised they didn't stick with Molina if this was the best they could do.
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I'm sure they tried to re-sign Molina, but, he chose to leave for TBay.
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I'd actually be pretty surprised if they did try to re-sign him. They still get a supplemental draft choice for him and I have to believe that they value that a little more than the difference between Molina and the Jeroloman/Mathis combo.
 
Fanatic said:
Sarge said:
... and maybe Pujols too?  :o At least that's the hot rumour right now.
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Where is this a hot rumour?
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ESPN... Seems the Cards are still the favs and the only other team to have a serious chance (currently) is Miami.

Jim Bowden: If the Marlins offer 9 x 27 and the Cards don't move off their offer...Pujols will sign with Marlins
 
Buster_ESPNBuster Olney
View of some officials: Blue Jays will be among teams taking biggest hit with new labor agreement, because of shift in revenue sharing.
 
Deebo said:
Buster_ESPNBuster Olney
View of some officials: Blue Jays will be among teams taking biggest hit with new labor agreement, because of shift in revenue sharing.
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Yeah, just reading that now... I wonder just how bad that hit could be. i.e, enough to be a game-changer in terms of how much Roger's spends on players? This I don't know so I'm not getting all bent out of shape over it at this point. 
 
Deebo said:
Buster_ESPNBuster Olney
View of some officials: Blue Jays will be among teams taking biggest hit with new labor agreement, because of shift in revenue sharing.
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It's not great but it's hard to argue with the logic there. A team in a market the size of Toronto shouldn't be a low revenue team. Rogers has let them become that in part because of their great deal on the Dome and ignoring the fact that the place, well, sucks.
 
Buster_ESPN: Brewers indicating to others they are pretty much out on Prince Fielder, and are moving on. [via Twitter]

The market is probably much bigger than a couple of teams but with that said,  things just got a little more interesting.
 
Busta Reims said:
While that's true, his OPS+ in those seasons were 113, 111 and 108 - so, he was still a slightly above average bat through those years, he just really should not have been in the field at all.
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Another guy who might not be so crazy to look at as a comparable is Mo Vaughn. He posted an OPS of .980, .993, .866, and .864 at the age of 29, 30, 31, and 32 respectively.  And, like Cecil (probably more so) was still a big threat at the plate. I honestly don't believe any team signing Prince will have to worry much years 1-5. Question is, how many years past that do you want to waste? Know what I mean? 
 
Sarge said:
Another guy who might not be so crazy to look at as a comparable is Mo Vaughn. 
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His last season of a +2.0 WAR was at 30 so, yeah, you're pretty much making the case against Fielder. These guys see their value fall off a cliff at 30.
 
And to put that in some perspective, Lyle Overbay only failed to put up a +2.0 WAR once in his entire Blue Jay career.
 
Vaughn's oWAR was 1.7 and 1.7 at the age of 31 and 32. He averaged a .865 OPS, hit around .275 and slammed 69 HRs, collecting 225 RBI in those 2 years. I don't know. Seems like pretty strong numbers to me. 
 
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