2016-17 Centennial Leafs General Team Discussion

[CarltonTheBear]

Can I beat the Matt Martin dead horse a minute:

I was sitting on this all week but...what the heck sort of cheap shots is having Matt Martin preventing again? Guys run our goalie, Take knee on knee shots at Matthews...the retaliation was what exactly? I know that when they were desperate for a win you didn't want to risk a long shorthanded situation just for payback but the hits themselves are pretty good proof that just having a fighter around doesn't stop those things.

None. Zero. Zilch. Anybody thinking otherwise is incredibly naive and living in a dream world. And yes, that includes Babcock if he feels that way. I don't really care how harsh that sounds.

 

[Guilt Trip]

Best case scenario.. Kap or Leivo with Matthews and Hyman on the 4th instead of Martin..

 

[herman]

https://twitter.com/JeffVeillette/status/851469313785647104
www.twitter.com/JeffVeillette/status/851469313785647104

and then when you calculate how much cap space per point per 60 each player took up, it'll show the delicious value rating.

 

[herman]

https://twitter.com/undefined/status/851493564823597056
www.twitter.com/undefined/status/851493564823597056

Matthews maxed out his cap hit due to bonuses (thanks to that empty netter for 40). Still can hit the Calder trophy bonus, but it won't count against the cap hit.

 

[Deebo]

https://twitter.com/undefined/status/851493564823597056
www.twitter.com/undefined/status/851493564823597056

Matthews maxed out his cap hit due to bonuses (thanks to that empty netter for 40). Still can hit the Calder trophy bonus, but it won't count against the cap hit.

I thought it was 2M for finishing top 10 in goals and 212,500 for getting 20 goals.

 

[Britishbulldog]

Can I beat the Matt Martin dead horse a minute:

I was sitting on this all week but...what the heck sort of cheap shots is having Matt Martin preventing again? Guys run our goalie, Take knee on knee shots at Matthews...the retaliation was what exactly? I know that when they were desperate for a win you didn't want to risk a long shorthanded situation just for payback but the hits themselves are pretty good proof that just having a fighter around doesn't stop those things.

None. Zero. Zilch. Anybody thinking otherwise is incredibly naive and living in a dream world. And yes, that includes Babcock if he feels that way. I don't really care how harsh that sounds.

In hockey I would prefer the refs to address a shot to our goalies' head that knocks the goalie out of the game with an appropriate punishment and our players stay disciplined.  There should NEVER be a need for revenge in a sport.

Revenge only escalates things but if the authorities don't handle things then vigilante justice is sometimes the only way to go.  I just wouldn't want any Leaf to go after Sestito.  Go after a different player on the ice when he is on the bench.

I have never played a sport with the mindset of getting the perpetrator...I don't even live life that way.


To your point though Nik.  Even though I have been a proponent in the past to goons being on the Leafs it is clear that it has been no deterrent to cheap shots...at all!

 

[L K]

https://twitter.com/JeffVeillette/status/851469313785647104
www.twitter.com/JeffVeillette/status/851469313785647104

and then when you calculate how much cap space per point per 60 each player took up, it'll show the delicious value rating.

What I interpret from that graph is that Matt Martin is pretty much as valuable as Kadri  8)

 

[McGarnagle]

Can I beat the Matt Martin dead horse a minute:

I was sitting on this all week but...what the heck sort of cheap shots is having Matt Martin preventing again? Guys run our goalie, Take knee on knee shots at Matthews...the retaliation was what exactly? I know that when they were desperate for a win you didn't want to risk a long shorthanded situation just for payback but the hits themselves are pretty good proof that just having a fighter around doesn't stop those things.

None. Zero. Zilch. Anybody thinking otherwise is incredibly naive and living in a dream world. And yes, that includes Babcock if he feels that way. I don't really care how harsh that sounds.

Maybe I'm alone on this, and I certainly wasn't a big fan of Martin's acquisition, but I never for a second thought that he was acquired to play an "enforcer" role. They wanted a big body to put up a lot of hits to soften up the opposing D, that wouldn't be a massive liability 5 on 5.

He's pretty much done that role. It's up for debate how valuable that role is, and how much cap and term its worth.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Maybe I'm alone on this, and I certainly wasn't a big fan of Martin's acquisition, but I never for a second thought that he was acquired to play an "enforcer" role. They wanted a big body to put up a lot of hits to soften up the opposing D, that wouldn't be a massive liability 5 on 5.

He's pretty much done that role. It's up for debate how valuable that role is, and how much cap and term its worth.

Mike Babcock in January:

On what Matt Martin does that maybe doesn?t show up in the analytics:

Babcock: It?s huge. We don?t get slapped around ever. Last year we got abused. We never get slapped around. Not only is he a good player, he is a great man, and he treats those kids with kindness and with the firm hand of accountability at the same time. He?s a good pro. He lives right. He acts right. He treats his teammates right. He?s got a huge fan in me, I can tell you that. When we first lost [Ben Smith], it was a blow to Marty, too. We didn?t have a center for him. Now that Goat is playing [well] again and he?s got that line going again, they were our best line last night.

https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2017/01/20/mike-babcock-on-martin-marincins-return-seth-griffith-the-value-of-matt-martin-bellletstalk-and-more/

Also, re-reading his Ben Smith comment legit made me laugh out loud.

Hey guys, remember how awful Ben Smith was this season?

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

Carlton, that was the quote I instantly thought of when I was reading McGarnagle's post, I'm just too lazy to go look it up, thanks!

 

[disco]

I love/hate you all. See everyone July 1st/October 7th.

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

Anyone being loaned to the Marlies for the playoffs?

 

[bustaheims]

Anyone being loaned to the Marlies for the playoffs?

Only Soshnikov and Kapanen would be eligible.

 

[herman]

In the end of season presser with Babcock that just concluded, Babcock mentioned that Nylander is not slated to play centre next season, which I believe is music to Bozak's ears.

 

[Kin]

That seems like a very questionable decision.

 

[herman]

That seems like a very questionable decision.

Yes. I'm not a huge fan of it.

Reasons for them to do this:
- Bozak is slightly expensive (4.2M) so playing him to the deadline before expiry lowers the trade threshold.
- He's a Leaf lifer, so far, and still provides that Babcock-dream RH FO prowess; Bozak and Nylander are actually the only RH draw-men right now.
- Matthews + Nylander = a million fire emojis
- maybe they already have a really really good read on Brooks and Bozak is actually gone anyway

Reasons to not do this:
- Develop Nylander into another line driving threat (can't line match'em all); we can always fire emoji it up on the fly
- we have so many wingers
- this is Peak Bozak: max value
- mo' assets

 

[bustaheims]

In the end of season presser with Babcock that just concluded, Babcock mentioned that Nylander is not slated to play centre next season, which I believe is music to Bozak's ears.

Enh. A lot can - and will - change between now and October.

 

[herman]

Enh. A lot can - and will - change between now and October.

That's basically what Lou said when asked about the team's off-season plans. Expansion draft is a wrinkle. Babcock will be semi-scouting the World Championships in any case.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

In the end of season presser with Babcock that just concluded, Babcock mentioned that Nylander is not slated to play centre next season, which I believe is music to Bozak's ears.

Enh. A lot can - and will - change between now and October.

Yeah. I mean it's a little weird that he flat out said no instead being a little more non-committal. But if he said "yes" that's basically telling everybody that Bozak is going to be traded before that happens so I wouldn't have expected that.

 

[bustaheims]

That's basically what Lou said when asked about the team's off-season plans. Expansion draft is a wrinkle. Babcock will be semi-scouting the World Championships in any case.

Makes sense. I really wouldn't read much into what anyone says about the team in the near future. Any comments being made are going to be based on the situation as it is, not as it will be.