2024-25 Toronto Maple Leafs General Discussion
- Thread starter herman
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Guilt Trip
Well-known member
I thought so. I have seen it discussed but did not understand where they were coming from.
herman
Well-known member
If I recall correctly, the only way cap space can accrue while a team is in LTIR is if they somehow bring their cap down below the actual cap ceiling (as if no one was injured). Which is not a likely scenario to ever happen since you need to replace an injured roster slot.
The only way the Leafs might benefit cap-wise from moving Matthews to LTIR is if he was expected to be down the entire regular season, in which case the Leafs would have 13M+ of LTIR room to use on other uninjured players, and then reactivate Matthews for the postseason when the cap is no longer counted (a la Vegas with Mark Stone and Tampa with Kucherov). But it costs assets to get 13M worth of players if we aren't calling up the farm, and there are limited SPC slots, and not having Matthews the whole season probably puts us into fighting for a Wild Card slot territory, and there's no guarantee Matthews is coming back effective and at game speed.
I've been a little surprised that a jaw injury from training camp has kept Mermis out for this long... until I read the details about it in here and jesus christ it sounded bad.
bustaheims
Well-known member
Virtually zero.
L K
Well-known member
You only accrue cap space when you are below the salary cap. If your total salary is below 88M you accrue cap space every day you are below it.
There are 192 days in the NHL season. If you are 1M under the cap then every day the team would accrue (1M/192 days)*Number of days below the cap. So if the team was under the cap by 30 days the team would accrue 156K in additional cap space to acquire a player.
When you are on LTIR you have the ability to go over the cap by the amount they would otherwise be over the cap. If you start right at the cap, you get the full contract value over the cap. So if the Leafs were right on 88M, Matthews on LTIR would give them 13.2M in LTIR cap space. If the team was 5 million below the cap when Matthews went on LTIR they would only get 8.2M in cap space because you only get to go over the cap by the amount of salary that would push you over 88M. That's why teams that are going to go into LTIR try to get as close to the cap as possible. It just gives you more roster flexibility when calling players up.
LTIR only helps you acquire players mid-season/at the deadline when they are going to be out through the end of the regular season because the salary cap stops after the regular season. The standard Vegas/Mark Stone or Tampa/Kucherov situations where they didn't play until Game 1 of the postseason.
So in a hypothetical scenario where Matthews was going to miss the entire season. They would have his 13.25M in cap space to use. They could go and bring Kadri back (7M) and add Mackenzie Weegar (6.25M) and then just activate Matthews for Game 1 after the season ended. Their technical salary would then be 101.25M in Game 1 but the cap doesn't exist at that point.
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Mermis was always depth. I don't think he had a chance to bump anyone even before his injury but he especially isn't going to bump Timmins/Benoit/Hakanpaa with how they have played so far this year.
There are 192 days in the NHL season. If you are 1M under the cap then every day the team would accrue (1M/192 days)*Number of days below the cap. So if the team was under the cap by 30 days the team would accrue 156K in additional cap space to acquire a player.
When you are on LTIR you have the ability to go over the cap by the amount they would otherwise be over the cap. If you start right at the cap, you get the full contract value over the cap. So if the Leafs were right on 88M, Matthews on LTIR would give them 13.2M in LTIR cap space. If the team was 5 million below the cap when Matthews went on LTIR they would only get 8.2M in cap space because you only get to go over the cap by the amount of salary that would push you over 88M. That's why teams that are going to go into LTIR try to get as close to the cap as possible. It just gives you more roster flexibility when calling players up.
LTIR only helps you acquire players mid-season/at the deadline when they are going to be out through the end of the regular season because the salary cap stops after the regular season. The standard Vegas/Mark Stone or Tampa/Kucherov situations where they didn't play until Game 1 of the postseason.
So in a hypothetical scenario where Matthews was going to miss the entire season. They would have his 13.25M in cap space to use. They could go and bring Kadri back (7M) and add Mackenzie Weegar (6.25M) and then just activate Matthews for Game 1 after the season ended. Their technical salary would then be 101.25M in Game 1 but the cap doesn't exist at that point.
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Mermis was always depth. I don't think he had a chance to bump anyone even before his injury but he especially isn't going to bump Timmins/Benoit/Hakanpaa with how they have played so far this year.
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bustaheims
Well-known member
Just one more wrinkle about LTIR - if you're acquiring a player while you're into LTIR, you need to be able to fit their entire cap hit into your LTIR space, not a pro-rated one based on how much of the season has played out.
Ozzie
Member
Question that always baffles me.... why is it that when Matthews or Reilly or Marner is gone in the regular season the Leafs put up incredible records?
This run without Matthews is up there with the incredible play when Reilly was out for injury and also suspension.
It doesn't look like Matthews gone impedes the ability to place in top 3 in Atlantic.
Is this strong rationale for splitting the forward talent amongst 3 lines and give Marner, Matthews and Nylander each their own line and let them battle out for ice time?
Guru Tugginmypuddah
Well-known member
Try it for 82 games and see how it plays out.
bustaheims
Well-known member
These have basically always been for shorter stints. Much easier to weather the storm for a few weeks than for months at a time.
Also, as I pointed out a few weeks back, their record without Marner is noticeably worse than their record with him.
Ozzie
Member
Yes always better to have the wealth of talent then not have it........ it just seems to point to "too many cooks in the kitchen"..... just like the dry spell of PP1 before Matthews injury revealing the issue.
And indicating it may be better to divide up the talent amongst 3 lines.
I really want to see Knies Matthews Domi drive the first line for a stretch. The elite guys sometimes exude ambivalence on stacked lines but Domi and Knies seem to pump up AM34.
Remember that amazing goal against Boston in Game 2 of the playoffs when Domi lobbed it to a charging Matthews? That was Matthews signature of combining a football catch and hockey. I think I watched that goal like 20 times it was so sick.
And indicating it may be better to divide up the talent amongst 3 lines.
I really want to see Knies Matthews Domi drive the first line for a stretch. The elite guys sometimes exude ambivalence on stacked lines but Domi and Knies seem to pump up AM34.
Remember that amazing goal against Boston in Game 2 of the playoffs when Domi lobbed it to a charging Matthews? That was Matthews signature of combining a football catch and hockey. I think I watched that goal like 20 times it was so sick.
I think we see a bunch of this in preseason for example. Players on the fringes want to make the NHL. They make a gargantuan effort to do so - their life's effort to date is on the line. Some have a great preseason and make the club (ie Nick Robertson this year). But that gargantuan effort is not sustainable. Eventually, they come back to the pack - along the lines of a rookie who hits a wall after half the season.
A few injuries give players lower in the line up or on the fringes a shot. Over the short term, they can suck it up and overachieve hoping to secure more ice time. But like an imbalance in nature, things have a way of balancing out. The occasional player sticks after getting the opportunity but the majority fall back.
Other circumstances are probably at play: goalie gets hot, special teams start to click, stretch of weaker or injured competition, opposing coach has lost the room, etc.
A few injuries give players lower in the line up or on the fringes a shot. Over the short term, they can suck it up and overachieve hoping to secure more ice time. But like an imbalance in nature, things have a way of balancing out. The occasional player sticks after getting the opportunity but the majority fall back.
Other circumstances with teams are probably at play: goalie gets hot, special teams start to click, stretch of weaker or injured competition, opposing coach has lost the room, etc. There often isn't a simple explanation of one factor. But you do hear coaches and players using the word "consistency" a lot. They all can relate to witnessing spurts of excellence but they know it is the players who do it all season who will prevail.
During the 7-1 run without Matthews, they have had great goaltending, improvement in special teams, a stretch of weaker competition (6 of 8 teams in the bottom half of the league) and a team (Boston) where the coach may have lost the room.
A few injuries give players lower in the line up or on the fringes a shot. Over the short term, they can suck it up and overachieve hoping to secure more ice time. But like an imbalance in nature, things have a way of balancing out. The occasional player sticks after getting the opportunity but the majority fall back.
Other circumstances are probably at play: goalie gets hot, special teams start to click, stretch of weaker or injured competition, opposing coach has lost the room, etc.
I think we see a bunch of this in preseason for example. Players on the fringes want to make the NHL. They make a gargantuan effort to do so - their life's effort to date is on the line. Some have a great preseason and make the club (ie Nick Robertson this year). But that gargantuan effort is not sustainable. Eventually, they come back to the pack - along the lines of a rookie who hits a wall after half the season.
A few injuries give players lower in the line up or on the fringes a shot. Over the short term, they can suck it up and overachieve hoping to secure more ice time. But like an imbalance in nature, things have a way of balancing out. The occasional player sticks after getting the opportunity but the majority fall back.
Other circumstances with teams are probably at play: goalie gets hot, special teams start to click, stretch of weaker or injured competition, opposing coach has lost the room, etc. There often isn't a simple explanation of one factor. But you do hear coaches and players using the word "consistency" a lot. They all can relate to witnessing spurts of excellence but they know it is the players who do it all season who will prevail.
During the 7-1 run without Matthews, they have had great goaltending, improvement in special teams, a stretch of weaker competition (6 of 8 teams in the bottom half of the league) and a team (Boston) where the coach may have lost the room.
McMann (+6)-Tavares(+7)-Marner(+6) seem to be playing well together. Berube likes them. Marner & McMann are #1 and #3 on the team in takeaways/60. Marner's been scoring 2 pts per game in their last 7 wins. Tavares looks rejuvenated (1 ppg, 59.7 faceoff win%). McMann's laying out some hits.Yes always better to have the wealth of talent then not have it........ it just seems to point to "too many cooks in the kitchen"..... just like the dry spell of PP1 before Matthews injury revealing the issue.
And indicating it may be better to divide up the talent amongst 3 lines.
I really want to see Knies Matthews Domi drive the first line for a stretch. The elite guys sometimes exude ambivalence on stacked lines but Domi and Knies seem to pump up AM34.
Remember that amazing goal against Boston in Game 2 of the playoffs when Domi lobbed it to a charging Matthews? That was Matthews signature of combining a football catch and hockey. I think I watched that goal like 20 times it was so sick.
Knies-Matthews-Domi had some playoff success. Not a bad line to try.
That leaves Pacioretty when he returns on the left wing to give the 3rd line muscle and some scoring.
I wonder about "William, your brother is on the bubble. If you were able to play center with him, you'd have to help cover for his and your weakness in defensive play. Wanna give it a shot?"
I think that line would score some.
The question would be: "can they check?"
Probably not but defense can be learned ...
bustaheims
Well-known member
They only gave up 9 even strength goals in that stretch
They allowed 4 not at even strength but scored 16 not at 5 on 5.
I can't think of a coach in the world who wouldn't take that - they nearly doubled their opponents goals.
3.13 GFA vs 1.63 GAA (assuming 60 min game for simple numbers)
That's their plus goal differential +12 for the season in those 8 games. They were 0 before.
Naturally, there are still things to work on.
