Bruins vs. Maple Leafs - Nov. 2nd, 7:30pm - SNO, TSN 1050

[L K]

Echoing what he's already been said.  We know that dirty players don't fight the OG guys.  Reaves did nothing though.  He didn't throw a hard hit or start a scrum after a whistle.  He's well past being a net negative when it comes to actually playing hockey so his only value is toughness and he doesn't even do that after a teammate gets injured

Get out of the organization.  I'd much rather have Steeves up in his spot.  Or McMann and see if Gregor/McMann/Kampf can become a bit of a feisty but useful 4th line

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Echoing what he's already been said.  We know that dirty players don't fight the OG guys.  Reaves did nothing though.  He didn't throw a hard hit or start a scrum after a whistle.  He's well past being a net negative when it comes to actually playing hockey so his only value is toughness and he doesn't even do that after a teammate gets injured

Get out of the organization.  I'd much rather have Steeves up in his spot.  Or McMann and see if Gregor/McMann/Kampf can become a bit of a feisty but useful 4th line

You can probably a convincing case that Ryan Reaves is the worst NHLer playing regular minutes on a playoff worthy team right now. His one redeeming quality was that he was supposed to make everyone play a little bigger. The first test of that was a complete failure.

 

[L K]

Echoing what he's already been said.  We know that dirty players don't fight the OG guys.  Reaves did nothing though.  He didn't throw a hard hit or start a scrum after a whistle.  He's well past being a net negative when it comes to actually playing hockey so his only value is toughness and he doesn't even do that after a teammate gets injured

Get out of the organization.  I'd much rather have Steeves up in his spot.  Or McMann and see if Gregor/McMann/Kampf can become a bit of a feisty but useful 4th line

You can probably a convincing case that Ryan Reaves is the worst NHLer playing regular minutes on a playoff worthy team right now. His one redeeming quality was that he was supposed to make everyone play a little bigger. The first test of that was a complete failure.

I'd argue it was the second test.  He did nothing in the Florida game after making the statement about how Gudas wouldn't be yelling at Woll if he was around.  Granted Gudas (UFA) and Bennett (injured) weren't there to do anything about but he was a complete non-factor in that game.  Compare that with how Boston spoke and approached their first game against Florida.

 

[rdowdall]

Echoing what he's already been said.  We know that dirty players don't fight the OG guys.  Reaves did nothing though.  He didn't throw a hard hit or start a scrum after a whistle.  He's well past being a net negative when it comes to actually playing hockey so his only value is toughness and he doesn't even do that after a teammate gets injured

Get out of the organization.  I'd much rather have Steeves up in his spot.  Or McMann and see if Gregor/McMann/Kampf can become a bit of a feisty but useful 4th line

You can probably a convincing case that Ryan Reaves is the worst NHLer playing regular minutes on a playoff worthy team right now. His one redeeming quality was that he was supposed to make everyone play a little bigger. The first test of that was a complete failure.

I'd argue it was the second test.  He did nothing in the Florida game after making the statement about how Gudas wouldn't be yelling at Woll if he was around.  Granted Gudas (UFA) and Bennett (injured) weren't there to do anything about but he was a complete non-factor in that game.  Compare that with how Boston spoke and approached their first game against Florida.

I think this just points to the fact that the Leafs don't play that way.  It has nothing to do with them being scared, or not tough.  They just don't want to play the game that way.

 

[Guilt Trip]

I think this just points to the fact that the Leafs don't play that way.  It has nothing to do with them being scared, or not tough.  They just don't want to play the game that way.

Yup. Really who's going to do it that's already here? I expected more from Domi, who can be a greasy player. But seeing him do nothing isn't surprising either.  Bert played a whopping 13 seconds against Ratboy

 

[bustaheims]

It?s almost like focusing on actually winning the game makes finding an opportunity to take a run at someone and put your team down a man for a possible 5 minute PK a bad strategy. If there?s an opportunity, sure, but going looking for it is just asking for more trouble than any sort of actual retribution. Quite frankly, that?s what rats like Marchand want - to get teams looking for vengeance instead of looking for wins. You give in to that and you?ve already lost, and you?re not going to get any satisfaction.

 

[ZBBM]

Bert played a whopping 13 seconds against Ratboy

So some of this is on Keefe.  He also didn't send Reaves out even though Marchand stayed on the ice for another shift after he broke all of Liljegren's bones below the waist.

 

[ZBBM]

It?s almost like focusing on actually winning the game makes finding an opportunity to take a run at someone and put your team down a man for a possible 5 minute PK a bad strategy. If there?s an opportunity, sure, but going looking for it is just asking for more trouble than any sort of actual retribution. Quite frankly, that?s what rats like Marchand want - to get teams looking for vengeance instead of looking for wins. You give in to that and you?ve already lost, and you?re not going to get any satisfaction.

It's a game in October.  You are trying to send a message that they'll remember for the next 3 meetings and maybe the playoffs.  And, for me anyway, it's not about taking runs at Ratty.  If nobody else is capable of doing it, send Reaves out and tell him to make a clean hit if and when he opportunity arises.

 

[Guilt Trip]

Bert played a whopping 13 seconds against Ratboy

So some of this is on Keefe.  He also didn't send Reaves out even though Marchand stayed on the ice for another shift after he broke all of Liljegren's bones below the waist.

Agree.

 

[cabber24]

I am pissed off about that play. I would like to see both Marchand's knees bent the other way. That guy is their captain? Really?

Reaves is overpaid and has term and we don't really need him to play so yes, he should chase him around the ice and get suspended if need be. That is literally why he's here. Screw winning the game, this team has a meek, pushover reputation and they have attempted to address that and they do nothing?

 

[azzurri63]

For all those up in arms about Reaves not ?taking action? (who I?m in I way defending, was he ever on the ice at the same time as Marchand? I?m assuming not because Boston has last change.

And has Marchand ever been taken to task by anyone? Some of you make this sound like this is a leafs problem, but he?s been a slippery weasel for his entire career and seems that no team ever does anything to him.

You're right about Reaves v. Marchand specifically. I didn't expect anyone to go out there and beat the snot out of him. And quite frankly even if they did aside from making some fans feel better it wouldn't have changed anything: Lily would still have been hurt and Marchand would still continue to gleefully attempt to injure his peers until his miserable career ends. It's also why the argument that Bennett would have never attempted to injure Knies in the playoffs if Reaves was in the line-up was and always has been foolish.

But, like, nothing from Reaves after that? He doesn't have to go after Marchand, or even try and hurt another player to get some pound of flesh, but he can't throw a 4th liner through the boards at some point? He can't grab a guy after a whistle in a scrum and just throw him around a little bit? Ditto for guys like Bertuzzi and Domi who were supposed to provide that stuff? And as ZBBM said if you aren't going to react with that sort of toughness you can at least beat them on the scoreboard and aside from a 2-minute offensive outburst the team in general kind of acted like that game meant nothing to them. It's tough to not be a little disappointed in that as a fan.

I think the issue with the Leafs team that is hard to reconcile is that there is a belief that there is enough talent on this team to win a cup, but that in order for that to happen, things have to align properly.

That doesn't mean that things don't have to align properly for other teams, but maybe there are less things that need to align.  If we look at things at a very high level and take Vegas as a use case, the only thing they needed to have align for them last year was their goaltending.  That was the only question that they needed to have answered.  Sure there were all the other questions that every team needs to answer, like health, and if guys don't get cold or play up to their ability, but the only real question mark they had as a team was would the goaltending be able to make the saves that they needed them to make.  There offensive depth was good, they had game breakers, and their 6 defensemen were among the best in the league.  So chances were that they were going to win a fair amount of games if the goaltending didn't let them down.

It's like the reverse of the Leafs though.  There are questions about the defense, there are questions about the offensive depth, and there are questions about the goaltending.  Sure, if all those things align, the Leafs could win a cup because they know they have the top end talent part to compete with other teams. 

This is what leads to most of the arguments on here about the team, because both sides are right with their assumptions.  The people who want to look at the positive side, like Guilt Trip, can point to the core of Reilly, Matthews, Nylander, Marner, and Tavares and say it's a really good core, probably one of the best cores in the league.  And if you have a strong core, you will make the playoffs, and once you are in the playoffs, you have a chance to win.  That core could win a cup.  Hell Karlsson dragged the Ottawa Senators to the conference finals pretty much by himself.  The Leafs have 4 players that are capable of that kind of dominance.

However, those that want to look at the negative side of things, like Azzuri63, also have a point.  This team has weaknesses, and probably more weaknesses than other teams that get papered over because of the strength of the core.  If the core doesn't produce, or has a bad game, or has bad luck, or is outperformed by the players on the other team, there isn't anything there for the team to fallback on.  There isn't enough depth/defensive structure/goaltending to overcome that. 

So is it possible for this team to win a cup?  I would say yes, it is possible.  Is it likely? That's where I have a hard time coming up with a number.  I think it's more likely than some other teams, but I don't think I would put them in the same category as Vegas, New Jersey, Colorado, or Carolina. 

All of this is just a really long winded way of saying that both sides are right, which is why the arguments persist.

Azzuri won't be happy until the team goes 82-0 and 16-0 in the playoffs lol.

Incorrect all I want is a consistent effort every night. Too many nights off for some especially the ones being paid handsomely. Also a little more backbone something that has and still is with this team. Irks me to no end seeing shit like Bennetts hit on Knies and the hit on Lilly last night by POS Marchand and nobody stepped in. Team is a disgrace. There are some on here who think the team is not as good as advertised and there are some on here who just look at results and think there are no reasons for concern. I'll stand by what I believe and unless there are some trades made and a change in the direction in this team we will be complaining again of an early exit come spring.

 

[azzurri63]

Just watched Kypreos and Bourne show from earlier today and Nick is 100% correct what happened last night or should I say what didn't happen is completely unacceptable and has been going on for years. The 2 points shouldn't have mattered when Reaves was on the ice with Marchand when the game was tied. He said who cares about the 2 points at that point. He's absolutely 100% correct. Bourne says something will happen down the road. Kypreos says this has been like this for a very long time and is a very big problem and nothing is going to happen. Suspension would have been worth it. Something even if he had trailed him along the ice and chirped him and let him know his time will come would have been better than what was shown. Some of you are going to say that's not the answer. All I say is what we've been seeing the last 5-6 years from this coward of a team is not the answer. This isn't the first time. Teams take liberty on our players because they know they have nothing to fear.

 

[azzurri63]

https://youtu.be/_BnUJ9JYkoU


Rosehill cares more about this team than this core.

 

[cabber24]

It?s quite obvious that play triggered the fan base because we seen it so many times before. It?s a kick in the balls to the fans to see that display after the signing and cap allocation to address exactly this. WTF? It?s a bad look from the bottom to the top of the organization and they?re all wearing it today. The Leafs are meek and you can get away with what ever you want against them and they will not do a thing about it. It?s a fact.