Contracts for the Big-3

[Kin]

Shouldn't a loyal fan put the team before the player?

Fans can act however they like. But if our interest in players is entirely dependant on what they can do for us then we shouldn't expect them to act selflessly on our behalf either.

Because the truth is Leafs fans don't treat the players very well. Which is probably why, as a rule, the Leafs haven't done particularly well in attracting players here. Which repeats the cycle.

But, you know, it's really worked out great the last few decades so I think more of the same is probably the way to go.

 

[sickbeast]

IMO the Leafs need to weed this out of Nylander now while he is still young.  Teach him a lesson.  And if he's a primadonna cancer in the locker room, get rid of him.  The Leafs can to just fine for the $7 million they would be paying Nylander.  $7 million will buy them a damn good player.  Perhaps one that is not so defensively flawed and so small.  Or a guy that's a team player and brings out the best in the people around him as opposed to the worst.

 

[ZBBM]

IMO the Leafs need to weed this out of Nylander now while he is still young.  Teach him a lesson.  And if he's a primadonna cancer in the locker room, get rid of him.  The Leafs can to just fine for the $7 million they would be paying Nylander.  $7 million will buy them a damn good player.  Perhaps one that is not so defensively flawed and so small.  Or a guy that's a team player and brings out the best in the people around him as opposed to the worst.

What a load of utter nonsense. 

 

[CarltonTheBear]

IMO the Leafs need to weed this out of Nylander now while he is still young.  Teach him a lesson.  And if he's a primadonna cancer in the locker room, get rid of him.  The Leafs can to just fine for the $7 million they would be paying Nylander.  $7 million will buy them a damn good player.  Perhaps one that is not so defensively flawed and so small.  Or a guy that's a team player and brings out the best in the people around him as opposed to the worst.

You disappeared for 3 months and in your first 3 posts back you 1) posted completely unsubstantiated rumours that there's off-ice issues that were the reason Matthews didn't get picked to wear a letter, 2) called a players dad a "douche", and 3) called Nylander a "primadonna cancer".

Super glad you're back dude. I don't know how we survived without you.

 

[rdowdall]

IMO the Leafs need to weed this out of Nylander now while he is still young.  Teach him a lesson.  And if he's a primadonna cancer in the locker room, get rid of him.  The Leafs can to just fine for the $7 million they would be paying Nylander.  $7 million will buy them a damn good player.  Perhaps one that is not so defensively flawed and so small.  Or a guy that's a team player and brings out the best in the people around him as opposed to the worst.

Do you currently have a house in your name?  If you do, I have a great deal for you.  I'm going to buy your house from you for $60,000.  Now don't argue about the price, just because you think it's worth more.  This is a learning experience for you.  You need to learn how to sell a home.  If you don't accept my offer, you are a primadonna cancer in the house selling industry for thinking that your house is worth the same as other comparable houses in the market, and I think you should move to another country.

 

[Kin]

Nylander isn't particularly small. He's 6', 190 lbs. That's pretty close to average sized for forwards and roughly the same size as guys like McDavid, Stamkos, Bergeron, etc.

 

[Zee]

Shouldn't a loyal fan put the team before the player?

Fans can act however they like. But if our interest in players is entirely dependant on what they can do for us then we shouldn't expect them to act selflessly on our behalf either.

Because the truth is Leafs fans don't treat the players very well. Which is probably why, as a rule, the Leafs haven't done particularly well in attracting players here. Which repeats the cycle.

But, you know, it's really worked out great the last few decades so I think more of the same is probably the way to go.

How the fans react has 0 impact on whether players come here or not. When you have stable management that can show it knows how to put a team together you attract players. There are fans that turn on you in every city.

 

[rdowdall]

Shouldn't a loyal fan put the team before the player?

Fans can act however they like. But if our interest in players is entirely dependant on what they can do for us then we shouldn't expect them to act selflessly on our behalf either.

Because the truth is Leafs fans don't treat the players very well. Which is probably why, as a rule, the Leafs haven't done particularly well in attracting players here. Which repeats the cycle.

But, you know, it's really worked out great the last few decades so I think more of the same is probably the way to go.

How the fans react has 0 impact on whether players come here or not. When you have stable management that can show it knows how to put a team together you attract players. There are fans that turn on you in every city.

Except for the Islanders fans.  They handled the Tavares decision with grace and dignity.

 

[Kin]

There are fans that turn on you in every city.

I don't think that's true. And they're not as loud about it and, more to the point, fans in a lot of other cities actually wait for a player to do something wrong to turn on them, rather than get mad at player for doing something a lot of other young players do and are under no obligation not to do. Look at some of the vitriol in this thread. You're kidding yourself if you think that's normal. 

But even then, to an extent, you're right that it's not entirely limited to fans here. One of the uglier things about modern sports fandom is how regrettably inhumane it is. Where just about any bad behaviour by players can be justified so long as it doesn't interfere with winning and players can be summarily dismissed the second they aren't exactly to our liking.

Which, you know, again is fine if that's the way someone wants to live their life but fans can't have an entirely transactional relationship with these players and then not expect them to have one with them in return.

 

[Kin]

Except for the Islanders fans.  They handled the Tavares decision with grace and dignity.

This would be a good comparable with the Tavares situation if Islanders fans reacted the way they did only if Tavares hadn't signed with the Leafs but just wanted a little more money than the Islanders were prepared to pay him.

 

[rdowdall]

Except for the Islanders fans.  They handled the Tavares decision with grace and dignity.

This would be a good comparable with the Tavares situation if Islanders fans reacted the way they did only if Tavares hadn't signed with the Leafs but just wanted a little more money than the Islanders were prepared to pay him.

I'm not going to lie.  I just wanted to be a part of the conversation and I was looking for attention.

 

[IJustLurkHere]

Shouldn't a loyal fan put the team before the player?  Every dollar overspent on Nylander is one not available for others. I hope Dubas sticks to his guns while he has all of the leverage.

Welcome to Toronto, home of the most loyal fan base around!

If Dubas had all the leverage, Nylander would already have signed.

Interesting idea that being a fan means supporting the guy in the suit over the guy in the jersey. Personally im a hockey obsessive who knows the cap situation, but I don?t tune in for the math.

 

[Frank E]

I think you can support both management and players...it's not like anyone is forcing fans to take a side here.

 

[Zee]

There are fans that turn on you in every city.

I don't think that's true. And they're not as loud about it and, more to the point, fans in a lot of other cities actually wait for a player to do something wrong to turn on them, rather than get mad at player for doing something a lot of other young players do and are under no obligation not to do. Look at some of the vitriol in this thread. You're kidding yourself if you think that's normal. 

But even then, to an extent, you're right that it's not entirely limited to fans here. One of the uglier things about modern sports fandom is how regrettably inhumane it is. Where just about any bad behaviour by players can be justified so long as it doesn't interfere with winning and players can be summarily dismissed the second they aren't exactly to our liking.

Which, you know, again is fine if that's the way someone wants to live their life but fans can't have an entirely transactional relationship with these players and then not expect them to have one with them in return.

It's way more cut throat now due to the hard cap. Fans get upset at players if they're perceived to be "too greedy" and won't fit into a nice salary structure within their own team. Back in the day with no cap you could easily just say "pay player X what he's worth to keep this great team together you cheap team".

Of course it's on management to make the right decisions on players, but if you have a bunch of stars that get market value in salary, you'll also have a bunch of guys making under a million to balance it out. The cap has made it easy for fans to blame players cause the fans see the limit of the cap and know they can only afford so many stars.

But as to players choosing a destination I think the order is:

1) most money
2) chance to win
3) other factors (family, lifestyle etc)

 

[Bates]

No one can force anyone to sign , that's not how leverage works. Dubas has the leverage on length and amount of contract. 

Shouldn't a loyal fan put the team before the player?  Every dollar overspent on Nylander is one not available for others. I hope Dubas sticks to his guns while he has all of the leverage.

Welcome to Toronto, home of the most loyal fan base around!

If Dubas had all the leverage, Nylander would already have signed.

Interesting idea that being a fan means supporting the guy in the suit over the guy in the jersey. Personally im a hockey obsessive who knows the cap situation, but I don?t tune in for the math.

 

[Zee]

No one can force anyone to sign , that's not how leverage works. Dubas has the leverage on length and amount of contract. 

Shouldn't a loyal fan put the team before the player?  Every dollar overspent on Nylander is one not available for others. I hope Dubas sticks to his guns while he has all of the leverage.

Welcome to Toronto, home of the most loyal fan base around!

If Dubas had all the leverage, Nylander would already have signed.

Interesting idea that being a fan means supporting the guy in the suit over the guy in the jersey. Personally im a hockey obsessive who knows the cap situation, but I don?t tune in for the math.

Nylander has few options. Once he starts missing cheques he'll want to sign. Hopefully it's resolved before that point though

 

[sickbeast]

IMO the Leafs need to weed this out of Nylander now while he is still young.  Teach him a lesson.  And if he's a primadonna cancer in the locker room, get rid of him.  The Leafs can to just fine for the $7 million they would be paying Nylander.  $7 million will buy them a damn good player.  Perhaps one that is not so defensively flawed and so small.  Or a guy that's a team player and brings out the best in the people around him as opposed to the worst.

You disappeared for 3 months and in your first 3 posts back you 1) posted completely unsubstantiated rumours that there's off-ice issues that were the reason Matthews didn't get picked to wear a letter, 2) called a players dad a "douche", and 3) called Nylander a "primadonna cancer".

Super glad you're back dude. I don't know how we survived without you.

I have chosen to stay away from what is largely a negative forum.  You clearly prefer your echo chamber and you can't stand hearing opinions that differ from your own.  That is a clear sign of insecurity about yourself.

I'm not going to bother wasting my time substantiating what I have posted.  There is evidence out there.  I read the news and multiple forums daily.  And quite frankly I don't give a flying **** what you think of me.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

I remember there was some article out there awhile back about how a few players didn't like Micheal Nylander much, but never read anything about William being bad in the room or anything like that.

Edit - found the article. Don't know the author's credibility.

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/big-read-maple-leafs-risked-drafting-william-nylander/

 

[Zee]

I remember there was some article out there awhile back about how a few players didn't like Micheal Nylander much, but never read anything about William being bad in the room or anything like that.

Edit - found the article. Don't know the author's credibility.

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/big-read-maple-leafs-risked-drafting-william-nylander/

I remember the talk about Nylander's character around the time he was drafted but I also remember that Shanahan had a personal connection in that he knows Michael Nylander and he knew William from when he was younger and didn't think there were any character issues to worry about. There's no doubt that Shanahan would also be involved in the big contract decisions so I'm confident this will be resolved amicably.

 

[Kin]

But as to players choosing a destination I think the order is:

1) most money
2) chance to win
3) other factors (family, lifestyle etc)

I'm not saying I disagree with the order here, I'm saying the order is the way it is in part because players appreciate that the nature of the business is that they're the only ones who will take their own interests to heart.

So Nylander, in sitting out to try and get the contract he wants, isn't revealing "poor character" or other garbage as has now been said multiple times in this thread. He's just looking after his own interests which is understandable given the way fans and team management will look after theirs. This stalemate doesn't say anything about Nylander that it doesn't also say about Dubas.