Contracts for the Big-3

[Highlander]

IMO the Leafs need to weed this out of Nylander now while he is still young.  Teach him a lesson.  And if he's a primadonna cancer in the locker room, get rid of him.  The Leafs can to just fine for the $7 million they would be paying Nylander.  $7 million will buy them a damn good player.  Perhaps one that is not so defensively flawed and so small.  Or a guy that's a team player and brings out the best in the people around him as opposed to the worst.

You disappeared for 3 months and in your first 3 posts back you 1) posted completely unsubstantiated rumours that there's off-ice issues that were the reason Matthews didn't get picked to wear a letter, 2) called a players dad a "douche", and 3) called Nylander a "primadonna cancer".

Super glad you're back dude. I don't know how we survived without you.

I have chosen to stay away from what is largely a negative forum.  You clearly prefer your echo chamber and you can't stand hearing opinions that differ from your own.  That is a clear sign of insecurity about yourself.

I'm not going to bother wasting my time substantiating what I have posted.  There is evidence out there.  I read the news and multiple forums daily.  And quite frankly I don't give a flying **** what you think of me.

I am no psychoanalyst, but your choice of moniker on this site may point towards your insecurity about yourself. Look in the mirror Buddy before you include me in any of your stupid blanket statements. I don't find this site negative, everyone is entitled to there wrong opinion is an old saying. Lighten up, its only hockey, I just lost two good friends in their early 60's, one hit by a drunk while he was riding a bike, and the other fell over with a Heart  attack last week. Life is whats important Sickbeast.  Sports is a diversion

 

[lc9]

I got no problem with Nylander wanting as much as he can get.  Also appreciate Dubas trying to sign Willy for the contract that best fits the need of the leafs. 

This will get resolved sooner than later.

 

[Kin]

I got no problem with Nylander wanting as much as he can get.  Also appreciate Dubas trying to sign Willy for the contract that best fits the need of the leafs. 

Well, and that's the thing that still needs to be centred. People keep trying to make this about Nylander wanting a certain amount of money based on what is one reported rumour about what his camp is asking(which, even if true, may just be a negotiating position)

But as has been repeated, people keep ignoring the issue of term. Even if people want to argue that Nylander has some responsibility to sign with the Leafs at a certain amount, there's no possible rationale for saying that Nylander has to sign for a certain amount and for the length of term the Leafs want.

My personal guess is that whatever people think is the right number for Nylander from 6 even up to the 8ish reported, he'd probably sign a deal for that amount depending on the term. The issue is them trying to figure out a long term number that both satisfies the team's interest in managing the cap but also Nylander's interest in not selling his future growth short.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

It's easy to say this now that it's dragged on a bit, but I had a feeling that there'd be a touch of fanbase blowback. Unfortunately, the first major contract being negotiated is the one directly after Tavares' signing, in which he took slightly under market to make it work for the leafs, setting the tone. Now, each of the players are "expected" to do the same.

 

[sickbeast]

IMO the Leafs need to weed this out of Nylander now while he is still young.  Teach him a lesson.  And if he's a primadonna cancer in the locker room, get rid of him.  The Leafs can to just fine for the $7 million they would be paying Nylander.  $7 million will buy them a damn good player.  Perhaps one that is not so defensively flawed and so small.  Or a guy that's a team player and brings out the best in the people around him as opposed to the worst.

You disappeared for 3 months and in your first 3 posts back you 1) posted completely unsubstantiated rumours that there's off-ice issues that were the reason Matthews didn't get picked to wear a letter, 2) called a players dad a "douche", and 3) called Nylander a "primadonna cancer".

Super glad you're back dude. I don't know how we survived without you.

I have chosen to stay away from what is largely a negative forum.  You clearly prefer your echo chamber and you can't stand hearing opinions that differ from your own.  That is a clear sign of insecurity about yourself.

I'm not going to bother wasting my time substantiating what I have posted.  There is evidence out there.  I read the news and multiple forums daily.  And quite frankly I don't give a flying **** what you think of me.

I am no psychoanalyst, but your choice of moniker on this site may point towards your insecurity about yourself. Look in the mirror Buddy before you include me in any of your stupid blanket statements. I don't find this site negative, everyone is entitled to there wrong opinion is an old saying. Lighten up, its only hockey, I just lost two good friends in their early 60's, one hit by a drunk while he was riding a bike, and the other fell over with a Heart  attack last week. Life is whats important Sickbeast.  Sports is a diversion

LOL you ask me not to include you and then you say something negative.

 

[Highlander]

negative and positive are just part of the same electron, don't know what I said had a negative charge unless talking about real life is negative to you. Loss is part of life.
Just trying to put some things in perspective to the beast who may be sick.

 

[Zee]

It's easy to say this now that it's dragged on a bit, but I had a feeling that there'd be a touch of fanbase blowback. Unfortunately, the first major contract being negotiated is the one directly after Tavares' signing, in which he took slightly under market to make it work for the leafs, setting the tone. Now, each of the players are "expected" to do the same.

It's the issue every team faces. Unless you can convince stars to take slightly less, or you get a guy long term who then over performs on his deal (see Kadri), you're really in tough when trying to keep a great set of players together.  I get the whole argument that players should get as much as they can, the owners are super rich and the players deserve more money since they're the product, but the reality of the cap is what it is. Unless the union can get a better deal next cba with players able to make more money overall, this is going to be a problem for a long time.

 

[IJustLurkHere]

No one can force anyone to sign , that's not how leverage works. Dubas has the leverage on length and amount of contract. 

Shouldn't a loyal fan put the team before the player?  Every dollar overspent on Nylander is one not available for others. I hope Dubas sticks to his guns while he has all of the leverage.

Welcome to Toronto, home of the most loyal fan base around!

If Dubas had all the leverage, Nylander would already have signed.

Interesting idea that being a fan means supporting the guy in the suit over the guy in the jersey. Personally im a hockey obsessive who knows the cap situation, but I don?t tune in for the math.

Nylander has few options. Once he starts missing cheques he'll want to sign. Hopefully it's resolved before that point though

Nylander may not have many options, but it?s not like the leafs do either.... it?s not like Tyler Ennis is a feasible replacement.Sign, trade, sit - those are the scenarios, and trade or sit are just as bad for the Leafs - who want to win - as they are for Nylander.

Leverage is not a zero sum game.

 

[Kin]

It's the issue every team faces. Unless you can convince stars to take slightly less, or you get a guy long term who then over performs on his deal (see Kadri), you're really in tough when trying to keep a great set of players together.  I get the whole argument that players should get as much as they can, the owners are super rich and the players deserve more money since they're the product, but the reality of the cap is what it is.

But the players didn't want the cap. So why criticize them for not putting their own interests as secondary to the system that super-rich teams chose?

 

[rdowdall]

The funny thing is that a term of two years makes sense from the standpoint that Marleu's contract cones off the books and by then Marner and Matthews would be resigned.  I think the Matthews deal is going to be the easiest of the three.  After that Marner and Nylander fall somewhere under there based on their performances. 

 

[sickbeast]

So what happens if the Leafs can't sign Nylander?  Is he free to sign with another team?

 

[Deebo]

He can sign an offersheet with any team right now, the Leafs would have the option to match the offer or accept draft pick compensation.

 

[Zee]

It's the issue every team faces. Unless you can convince stars to take slightly less, or you get a guy long term who then over performs on his deal (see Kadri), you're really in tough when trying to keep a great set of players together.  I get the whole argument that players should get as much as they can, the owners are super rich and the players deserve more money since they're the product, but the reality of the cap is what it is.

But the players didn't want the cap. So why criticize them for not putting their own interests as secondary to the system that super-rich teams chose?

Cause I'm a Leafs fan and want the best team possible under the current system. If that means players don't get as much as they should then so be it. As a normal person I can't even fathom the amount of money the stars get cause it's more than me or my entire family will earn in a lifetime.    I realize the current system isn't fair for the players but there's nothing I can do about it so I just want the Leafs to have the best team they can.

 

[Kin]

I realize the current system isn't fair for the players but there's nothing I can do about it so I just want the Leafs to have the best team they can.

So the system isn't fair for them but rather than blame the people who locked them out to unilaterally impose that system in order to protect their billions you're going to blame the people being exploited because they aren't willing to be exploited further for your own interests?

Well if that isn't the last 150 years of capitalism in a nutshell I don't know what is.

 

[Zee]

I realize the current system isn't fair for the players but there's nothing I can do about it so I just want the Leafs to have the best team they can.

So the system isn't fair for them but rather than blame the people who locked them out to unilaterally impose that system in order to protect their billions you're going to blame the people being exploited because they aren't willing to be exploited further for your own interests?

Well if that isn't the last 150 years of capitalism in a nutshell I don't know what is.

What would rather I do? Stop watching hockey in protest?

?\_(ツ)_/?

 

[Kin]

What would rather I do? Stop watching hockey in protest?

Or watch hockey but not blame William Nylander for trying to do the best thing for himself in the unfair system that the teams designed?

Or, and bear with me here because I'm going to go to some weird places, watch hockey but rather than look at things primarily through the lens of wins and losses that you ultimately have no control over but rather invest in it as a communal enterprise where the value is in the familial and friendly bonds that a shared passion can give a sense of structure and tradition to? Where players are seen as temporary parts of that community whose well being we care for beyond whether or not they can serve our own immediate interests? All the while still caring about the outcomes as a secondary concern?

 

[Zee]

What would rather I do? Stop watching hockey in protest?

Or watch hockey but not blame William Nylander for trying to do the best thing for himself in the unfair system that the teams designed?

Can you point to anywhere in this thread where I "blame" Nylander or any player asking for money?

 

[Kin]

What would rather I do? Stop watching hockey in protest?

Or watch hockey but not blame William Nylander for trying to do the best thing for himself in the unfair system that the teams designed?

Can you point to anywhere in this thread where I "blame" Nylander or any player asking for money?

You've lost me a bit. When I said:

So why criticize them for not putting their own interests as secondary to the system that super-rich teams chose?

You didn't say "I'm not doing that" or "Nobody is doing that" you said:

Cause I'm a Leafs fan and want the best team possible under the current system.

So when i reply with "Maybe don't do that" you now say "I'm not". But I didn't say you were. If you look back to what started this I said: 

So Nylander, in sitting out to try and get the contract he wants, isn't revealing "poor character" or other garbage as has now been said multiple times in this thread.

So this line of discussion isn't about you, I wasn't referring to the people who, in this thread, have said negative things about Nylander personally and insulted his family for the unforgivable crime of *checks notes* not having signed a contract with a team he's under no obligation to sign a contract with.

 

[sickbeast]

He can sign an offersheet with any team right now, the Leafs would have the option to match the offer or accept draft pick compensation.

Do the Leafs have the option of cutting bait?  $7 million per season is a lot of money.  How much does Kadri make?  It's really not far off at all from the $11 million Tavares makes.

 

[Zee]

He can sign an offersheet with any team right now, the Leafs would have the option to match the offer or accept draft pick compensation.

Do the Leafs have the option of cutting bait?  $7 million per season is a lot of money.  How much does Kadri make?  It's really not far off at all from the $11 million Tavares makes.

Kadri only makes $4.5 and is on a great deal. Next season both Gardiner and Hainsey are up so that adds up to $7M. Of course you'd have to replace them with 2 guys on ELCs...if Dermott can replace Gardiner and maybe Lilegejren makes the jump next season they might be able to do it.