Grabovski Bought Out

[GhostofPotvin29]

Ha, his comments about Carlyle are awesome, and echo what a number of people were upset about all season.  Just as on the ice, he's an emotional guy.

 

[Kin]

As far as I know, no one on this board is an NHL GM. So, why would we know?

Why would anyone? Why would Nonis let that slip? Why would he enter into trade negotiations saying so? There's no benefit to Nonis saying so to other GMs. So this assumption that he did, that he entered into these negotiations tipping his cards barely deserves a response.

And while we might not be NHL GMs we do tend to hear things. Nobody was surprised by Bryzgalov's buyout or Komisarek's.

Well, I've said before I'm reserving judgment on the move's broader implications until I see them: we'll need to see the plan at center. If the money and term are less than Grabbo and the production the same, great. If the money and term are similar and the production better, great. I've a plenty open mind about replacing Grabovski.

As I've said elsewhere I think the Leafs may have already found that replacement in Bolland. I think there's a very legitimate chance they go into next year with Bolland and Kadri as the top 2 centers and use free agency to find a third if that. The options out there at center suck so I can absolutely understand it if Nonis plans on waiting a while before springing that plan into action.

But, yeah, I've been a bit strident in my views, which might make Nonis and Carlyle occasional collateral damage... As to whether Nonis is a drooling moron, too soon to say. Since the first bunch of moves this season when he cleared roster space, I've not really liked what he's done, other than the Bolland trade.

Again, I'm fine with anyone not liking a move. I've not liked plenty of moves GMs have made over the years. I didn't and still don't like the Kessel trade for instance. That said whenever someone would come along and say "Stupid Burke, why didn't he think to protect those draft picks" I'd tell them they were the dopes for thinking he hadn't. Burke made the deal in front of him and wouldn't have been able to make it with the picks protected.

Likewise, Nonis tried to trade Grabo. He didn't do it with flop sweat and a stammer. He didn't beg someone to give him a 7th so he wouldn't have to buy him out. He shopped him, his value was nil, he bought him out. Think that sucks all you want, give whoever you want crap for why you think Grabo's value was nil but let's not start pretending that these guys can't quite crack it the way we can.

 

[mr grieves]

Ha, his comments about Carlyle are awesome, and echo what a number of people were upset about all season.  Just as on the ice, he's an emotional guy.

Liked this:

67Sound ‏@67sound 4m
Grabbo deserves a proper goodbye. You played your ass off, demolished the Habs & Bruins, saluted fans & called Carlyle an idiot. I love you.

Aaaaand he bit Habs.

 

[Kin]

Now that'd mean we've gone from the team deciding to give Grabbo away after a 48 game season to giving him away after a 5-game slump.

Except it wasn't just that and you know it. He stunk all year on the power play and he wasn't playing with Kulemin and McClement then. He had lots of opportunities to play better and he didn't. He had a bad year. Now, did the team overreact to that bad year? Maybe. But it doesn't change what it was.

And it worked. After that slump you're talking about, when Grabo got bumped down, the Leafs who were 5-5 went 21-12-5 the rest of the way. So, stupid line up decision or not, Carlyle had some capital here and if he really thought that Grabs should be in the bottom 6 then it didn't make sense to keep him at his salary.

 

[Rebel_1812]

Ha, his comments about Carlyle are awesome, and echo what a number of people were upset about all season.  Just as on the ice, he's an emotional guy.

I have to think this is one of the reasons he was shown the door.  Many players get moved due to off ice issues.  Perhaps Grabbo said some things like this about the coach that got them in the playoffs.  Not smart.  That fact that he is a biter might have been a factor too ;-)

 

[mr grieves]

Now that'd mean we've gone from the team deciding to give Grabbo away after a 48 game season to giving him away after a 5-game slump.

Except it wasn't just that and you know it. He stunk all year on the power play and he wasn't playing with Kulemin and McClement then. He had lots of opportunities to play better and he didn't. He had a bad year. Now, did the team overreact to that bad year? Maybe. But it doesn't change what it was.

Well, whether it was a bad 5 games or a bad 48 games, we're both talking about rather small sample sizes with which to evaluate players. If Grabbo gets bought out of his contract for his last 70 games, I wonder if it makes sense to sign Kadri to a Mike Richards contract on the strength of his small sample.

I do wonder what other cases there are of giving up on talent this quickly, for this small a sample of work... Jiri Tlusty? Alex Steen? Steve Sullivan? Grabbo made it to his UFA contract, so that's at least some progress I suppose.

 

[BrownRolo]

Any idea if someone could pick up Grabbo off waivers for half his cap hit and the Leafs would be stuck with the other half?

Nevermind..that only applies if they were to recall him and then someone claimed him.

 

[cabber24]

Holy big reaction batman!

I honestly kind of just shrugged my shoulders at this one.

His contract was generally viewed as a bad one... they had the opportunity to get out of it and they did. Good luck Grabo! and good luck to Toronto and the cap space!

 

[Kin]

I do wonder what other cases there are of giving up on talent this quickly, for this small a sample of work... Jiri Tlusty? Alex Steen? Steve Sullivan? Grabbo made it to his UFA contract, so that's at least some progress I suppose.

I think the fact that Grabo is nearing 30 is probably more relevant to their consideration of him going forward than whatever similarities you might think he has to a bunch of guys in their early 20's.

And I think it's pretty clear from the comments being made by Grabo that this wasn't a case of Grabo simply playing himself into Carlyle's doghouse. Clearly there's a clash there and realistically Grabo wasn't going to be a big part of Carlyle's line-up going forward. Disagree with the wisdom there if you want but Nonis did have to deal with the situation in front of him.

 

[cabber24]

Way to ruin my holiday, Nonis.

What a supremely stupid move.  Liles (who I happen to think is OK FWIW) would have been the guy to buy out because of Gardiner and Rielly coming on.

I just hope they aren't building the team according to whether or not Carlyle "likes" a player because you never know how long he'll be the coach.

You know that these are professionals right?  This is a performance based business, and Carlyle will be judged on his record.  Secondly, if Nonis was such a Grabbo proponent, he could have kept him and told Carlyle to "deal with it."

That's exactly my point.  Nonis should have told Carlyle just that, if indeed Carlyle was drumming to get rid of him.  And if Carlyle didn't get along with Grabovski or whatever, then the both of them should just deal with it. 

Grabovski was put into a checking role this year -- everybody knows that.  He did what he was asked to do, so in terms of performance he delivered, as far as I'm concerned, even though he wasn't being used to best advantage (IMO).

Let's see: played his heart out, did what he was asked, never complained in public (until today of course).  Yep, that's a buyout candidate for you.

I don't care who Nonis brings in to replace Grabs, the fact remains he gave up a valuable player for nothing.  At least he could have tried to trade him.

If nothing else, this is inexcusable.

CAP SPACE and out of a bad contact?

 

[cw]

I get that Grabovski  is upset and is a hot head but he really should have taken the high road here. 

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Normally, I agree wholeheartedly. But in this particular case, it reminded some of Grabbo as a player. When he got knocked down, as he often did, he got back up feisty and charged back into the fray. He doesn't have great command of the language and I think he's wears his heart on his sleeve. So I'm cutting him some slack.

Between the defensive role forced on him, his situation & drop in ice time he was given and his intestine issues (losing weight, etc), I'm prepared to cut him a bit of a mulligan. I do not believe this season fairly represents his ability and it wasn't all his fault.

I think he'll come back and do decently as a 2nd line scoring center.

As for the knock on his not dishing the puck, he is a shooting center. But the offensive chaos the Kulemin-Grabbo-MacArthur line created in transition in seasons past led MacArthur & Kulemin to career highs offensively and I sincerely question that Grabbo doesn't deserve some credit for that.

I just look at the contrast with Komisarek being bought out and Grabovski. Komisarek could have moaned and groaned he wasn't given a shot this season in only 4 games but he acted with class.  Never like when someone burns bridges like that. Grabovski will do fine.

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As a general rule, I tend to not care for mouthy athletes.

Maybe his body won't let him do it any more but if Komisarek played in Toronto with Grabovski's heart, he'd probably still be here. My respect did grow for him in how classy he handled his situation.

I think Grabbo loved playing here. And he's an emotional guy who left it all on the ice many, many nights. He's getting married in Toronto today. English is not his native tongue - he struggles with it. Now put yourself in his spot: out of the blue, the day before his wedding he's bought out and the media phones him up within a few minutes of it happening. The fact that he cut loose as he did suggests that he really cared - which is not entirely a bad thing to confirm or see.

It's not a perfect world and it probably would have been better if he'd said nothing - like Komisarek. But I can't help but have some sympathy for how he's feeling, his circumstances and how it went down. Komisarek knew months in advance. Can you imagine what it will be like for him to face his wedding guests today? "Uh honey, we'll have to hold off on the honeymoon while we settle this UFA thing because in a few days, there will be almost no cap money and few choices available for next season. Oh and we're going to have to relocate to some other city before September - I just don't know where yet. But I'm sure everyone will have a great time saying goodbye to us at the wedding today."

It's part of the business and he's getting paid a ton of dough to play hockey. Things could be worse.  The guy is just being human caught shortly after it went down and he cared about being a Leaf. It's not all bad to me or I think I can muster a little sympathy in gratitude for his effort.

 

[mr grieves]

I do wonder what other cases there are of giving up on talent this quickly, for this small a sample of work... Jiri Tlusty? Alex Steen? Steve Sullivan? Grabbo made it to his UFA contract, so that's at least some progress I suppose.

I think the fact that Grabo is nearing 30 is probably more relevant to their consideration of him going forward than whatever similarities you might think he has to a bunch of guys in their early 20's.

And I think it's pretty clear from the comments being made by Grabo that this wasn't a case of Grabo simply playing himself into Carlyle's doghouse. Clearly there's a clash there and realistically Grabo wasn't going to be a big part of Carlyle's line-up going forward. Disagree with the wisdom there if you want but Nonis did have to deal with the situation in front of him.

That's true.

I suppose I'm back to not liking the idea of having a coach that doesn't coach to the strengths of his roster but comes in with a system and gives points for being pliable. One wants players to be that, sure... but it's a problem if that's valued to the point where guys like Holzer, Kosta, Orr, Frazer, and McLaren were suiting up as frequently as they were and playing where they were.

You pointed out a few back the record compiled after the first 5 giving Carlyle capital. I certainly agree. And, never thought I'd say this, but I'm wondering whether 2 weeks of playoff hockey was worth it if that taste of success endorses line-up, roster decisions, and systems that led to the team's needing a near-unprecedentedly-high SH% to succeed...   

 

[mr grieves]

I get that Grabovski  is upset and is a hot head but he really should have taken the high road here. 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

Normally, I agree wholeheartedly. But in this particular case, it reminded some of Grabbo as a player. When he got knocked down, as he often did, he got back up feisty and charged back into the fray. He doesn't have great command of the language and I think he's wears his heart on his sleeve. So I'm cutting him some slack.

Between the defensive role forced on him, his situation & drop in ice time he was given and his intestine issues (losing weight, etc), I'm prepared to cut him a bit of a mulligan. I do not believe this season fairly represents his ability and it wasn't all his fault.

I think he'll come back and do decently as a 2nd line scoring center.

As for the knock on his not dishing the puck, he is a shooting center. But the offensive chaos the Kulemin-Grabbo-MacArthur line created in transition in seasons past led MacArthur & Kulemin to career highs offensively and I sincerely question that Grabbo doesn't deserve some credit for that.

I just look at the contrast with Komisarek being bought out and Grabovski. Komisarek could have moaned and groaned he wasn't given a shot this season in only 4 games but he acted with class.  Never like when someone burns bridges like that. Grabovski will do fine.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

As a general rule, I tend to not care for mouthy athletes.

Maybe his body won't let him do it any more but if Komisarek played in Toronto with Grabovski's heart, he'd probably still be here. My respect did grow for him in how classy he handled his situation.

I think Grabbo loved playing here. And he's an emotional guy who left it all on the ice many, many nights. He's getting married in Toronto today. English is not his native tongue - he struggles with it. Now put yourself in his spot: out of the blue, the day before his wedding he's bought out and the media phones him up within a few minutes of it happening. The fact that he cut loose as he did suggests that he really cared - which is not entirely a bad thing to confirm or see.

I agree. In part, I loved Grabbo's rant because it echoed things I've thought about RC's lineup decisions, and wouldn't be out of place on Leafs blogs that I like. I also liked it as an honest response to something that'd chap most of our arses: if your boss cuts your hours then complains your production's down and then -- and very publicly where other potential employers can see your stock being devalued -- dismisses you because your production's down, I'd think you'd -- any self-respecting professional -- would want to say such things (though the professional wisdom of doing so is questionable... but we're fans and who the hell is going to internalize the values of bland managers over fiery labors?). But most of all I liked to see that he would miss the fans and was passionate about wanting to play and win in Toronto.

I mean, can anyone imagine what Bozak's going to say if/when he signs elsewhere to cash in? "Good times, brahs. See u at the XBox live CoD tourney, maybe. L8r."

I get it's a business and all that, but reactions like Grabbo's remind us it's a business people engage in because they've a real passion for it, want to win, want to succeed for fans, etc. If nothing else, that was clear from Grabbo's response.

It's not a perfect world and it probably would have been better if he'd said nothing - like Komisarek. But I can't help but have some sympathy for how he's feeling, his circumstances and how it went down. Komisarek knew months in advance. Can you imagine what it will be like for him to face his wedding guests today? "Uh honey, we'll have to hold off on the honeymoon while we settle this UFA thing because in a few days, there will be almost no cap money and few choices available for next season. Oh and we're going to have to relocate to some other city before September - I just don't know where yet. But I'm sure everyone will have a great time saying goodbye to us at the wedding today."

It's part of the business and he's getting paid a ton of dough to play hockey. Things could be worse.  The guy is just being human caught shortly after it went down and he cared about being a Leaf. It's not all bad to me or I think I can muster a little sympathy in gratitude for his effort.

I'd say it actually worked out pretty well for him. He'll get about $2m for the next 8 years, and he's been released to negotiate a new contract with 29 teams in a weak UFA year. Maybe it'd be a bit sweeter if the cap wasn't coming down, but it sure beats being traded to Dallas.

 

[dappleganger]

He signs in Nashville.

 

[drummond]

To all Nonis apologists that he surely tried as hell to trade Grabbo, but he did not find any takers because of his 5.5M per contract - how come Edmonton managed to trade Shawn Horcoff, who is 5 years older, has exact same cap hit and does have more or less similar numbers as Grabovski...

Btw. if we let MacArthur just walk it is also pure management, or is he also untradable?

 

[hockeyfan1]

May Grabovski prosper wherever he will go.

The thing I liked about Grabbo was him being a 'small' player with a lot of heart,  even if his stats dropped off dramatically.

 

[Jolly good show chaps]

To all Nonis apologists that he surely tried as hell to trade Grabbo, but he did not find any takers because of his 5.5M per contract - how come Edmonton managed to trade Shawn Horcoff, who is 5 years older, has exact same cap hit and does have more or less similar numbers as Grabovski...

Good point.

 

[hockeyfan1]

To all Nonis apologists that he surely tried as hell to trade Grabbo, but he did not find any takers because of his 5.5M per contract - how come Edmonton managed to trade Shawn Horcoff, who is 5 years older, has exact same cap hit and does have more or less similar numbers as Grabovski...

Nonis apologists?  Just a minute...

Nonis indicated that it was tough to figure out what to do with Grabovski.
?This was not an easy decision to make as Mikhail made numerous contributions to our hockey club,? he said in a statement. ?This is a roster move that will give us salary cap flexibility moving forward.?

Source:  Sportsnet

 

[hockeyfan1]

Meanwhile, his agent thinks the Leafs "made a mistake" (to let Grabbo go)...

I?ve been with this kid from the beginning of his pro career and I know what he can do,? Greenstin said Friday. ?He?s a fighter, OK? I believe they made a mistake.?

Source:  Sportsnet

 

[Zee]

To all Nonis apologists that he surely tried as hell to trade Grabbo, but he did not find any takers because of his 5.5M per contract - how come Edmonton managed to trade Shawn Horcoff, who is 5 years older, has exact same cap hit and does have more or less similar numbers as Grabovski...

Btw. if we let MacArthur just walk it is also pure management, or is he also untradable?

Simple. Horcoff's contract is only 2 years as opposed to 4 years which is a lot easier to swallow.