Kessel traded to Penguins
- Thread starter GhostofPotvin29
- Start date
Nik the Trik said:
I was about to post the same thing. All he needs to be considered a better than average source is to have trained, played, talked, travelled, etc...with the guy. Not saying he's a 100% source (lots of disclaimers to avoid major details), it's not isolated.
I can think of 4 teams that made the playoffs this past season and ended up out because they couldn't score when it counted. Those teams are Montreal, the Blues, the Islanders and the Predators. Would a top level scorer like Kessel put one of those teams over the top? I have to think there's a good chance he would.
Any of those teams could have found a way to make a Kessel trade happen. The Islanders, Blues and Predators have the cap space available today for such a trade. The Predators have over $20 million in cap space. The Habs could have talked the Leafs into taking on soon to expire contracts like Markov's if they wanted Kessel.
Those are just a few teams that come to mind. You could put the Wild in there, though they don't currently have the cap space for a Kessel contract. Then there are the teams that need a scorer to jump a level, or the teams that need a core re-adjustment.
None of that happened, though. Why? That's a good question. In the end, I think the Leafs just took the offer that was on the table. If a team other than the Penguins wanted Kessel, they had their chance.
Any of those teams could have found a way to make a Kessel trade happen. The Islanders, Blues and Predators have the cap space available today for such a trade. The Predators have over $20 million in cap space. The Habs could have talked the Leafs into taking on soon to expire contracts like Markov's if they wanted Kessel.
Those are just a few teams that come to mind. You could put the Wild in there, though they don't currently have the cap space for a Kessel contract. Then there are the teams that need a scorer to jump a level, or the teams that need a core re-adjustment.
None of that happened, though. Why? That's a good question. In the end, I think the Leafs just took the offer that was on the table. If a team other than the Penguins wanted Kessel, they had their chance.
Kin
New member
corsi fenwick said:
I don't know where you're getting your info re: the Blues but what I have on the Blues says they're nowhere close to being able to fit Kessel under the cap. Likewise, with a team like the Islanders, you're looking at a team that in the next year is going to have to be handing out a bunch of pretty significant contracts whether it's to RFA(Strome, Nelson) or UFA(Okposo)
So just looking at a team's cap situation right now maybe isn't the best way to judge these things. Teams are going to be looking at the cap in the short and long-term and really I don't know how many of those teams are good fits for Kessel. The Preds have a ton of cap space, sure, but they also have a bunch of good young players who will be looking to negotiate decent sized deals in the next year or two and probably have an internal budget aside from the cap.
But more than just looking at whether or not Kessel is a good fit for those teams, you have to look at those teams and decide if they really have the pieces the Leafs would need to make that deal. You're talking about teams with some pretty thin prospect bases there or a team like the Islanders whose best pieces are probably a step above what could have been reasonably expected for Kessel. Would we be much happier with a trade centered around Ivan Barbashev or Kevin Fiala or Jacob De La Rose?
Nik the Trik said:
One site I checked on for info on the Blues cap space had them as having around $14 million available. On reading your reply, I checked another site that had them at just over $1000. So, a bit of a discrepancy there. I'd have to guess the latter is more accurate. I'm not sure what the go-to site is these days. Cap Geek used to be dependable.
But anyway, I buy what you are saying in that I think Kessel's contract is the main factor in what prevented most teams from getting seriously involved with a trade. I stay out of discussions about other team's prospects, because I really don't follow that side of it much at all. I get that teams make a priority in re-signing their own top players and fill in the roster with their own prospects and some UFAs.
Even so, I just found it a bit odd that it seems to have been only the Penguins in the picture when it came down to trading for Kessel. Maybe it's not that odd, though. The NHL seems to be going through some kind of shift this off-season in terms of teams dealing with players contracts.
Trading Kessel was apparently pretty high on the Leafs to-do list and I'm glad the trade happened.
Wendel's Fist
New member
What I find hilarious about this trade is how the Leafs were suddenly the team "under pressure" to make a move.
Pittsburgh fired their gm and coach last year when they didn't make a dent in the playoffs. Suddenly they're cool as a cucumber when they did the same thing this year? They were desperate for a Phil Kessel type.
Was there a better winger available at the time of the trade.............free agent or otherwise?
People in Pittsburgh are amazed at how little they had to give up and people here and trying to shine a turd.
Let's see............the Pittsburgh Penguins need to win right now because their window on that is closing, and losing early in the playoffs, with the best player in hockey every year, probably shouldn't happen more. Something needs to change and it can't be coach and gm this time.
The Toronto Maple Leafs have no need to win for the next 3 years at least...................................................MUST TRADE KESSEL IMMEDIATELY!!!!!!!!!!!!! CANNOT GO PAST JULY 1st!!
If Kessel were a cancer to any team, why in all living hell would Jim Rutherford want him............even with the small percentage of cap off, for 7 more years? Does that sound like something you would take a chance on yourself?
We got reamed on this deal. The longer Kessel was here, the more valuable he became just by his contract getting shorter.
The city of Pittsburgh is loving hockey again. I doubt a smaller move would have did that for them and Rutherford and his upper echelon, know it too.
Can't wait to see how our third liner does though.
Pittsburgh fired their gm and coach last year when they didn't make a dent in the playoffs. Suddenly they're cool as a cucumber when they did the same thing this year? They were desperate for a Phil Kessel type.
Was there a better winger available at the time of the trade.............free agent or otherwise?
People in Pittsburgh are amazed at how little they had to give up and people here and trying to shine a turd.
Let's see............the Pittsburgh Penguins need to win right now because their window on that is closing, and losing early in the playoffs, with the best player in hockey every year, probably shouldn't happen more. Something needs to change and it can't be coach and gm this time.
The Toronto Maple Leafs have no need to win for the next 3 years at least...................................................MUST TRADE KESSEL IMMEDIATELY!!!!!!!!!!!!! CANNOT GO PAST JULY 1st!!
If Kessel were a cancer to any team, why in all living hell would Jim Rutherford want him............even with the small percentage of cap off, for 7 more years? Does that sound like something you would take a chance on yourself?
We got reamed on this deal. The longer Kessel was here, the more valuable he became just by his contract getting shorter.
The city of Pittsburgh is loving hockey again. I doubt a smaller move would have did that for them and Rutherford and his upper echelon, know it too.
Can't wait to see how our third liner does though.
Kin
New member
Wendel's Fist said:
The Penguins were not the only team in the market to improve on the wing. The Stars clearly were, the Capitals clearly were, the Blue Jackets clearly were.
So why didn't any of those teams kick the Leafs door down with significantly better offers for Kessel? Why did the Leafs have one team to negotiate with? With the Leafs willing to eat contracts or retain salary, Kessel only became more valuable. So why the leage-wide indifference?
Wendel's Fist said:
No. But then again I wouldn't have given Alex Semin a 5 year/35 million dollar contract either. I wouldn't have traded what Jim Rutherford did for Jordan Staal or given him the contract he got either.
Looking at the mess the Hurricanes are in right now, I'm really not inclined to look at Jim Rutherford's interest in adding Kessel as being far, far more relevant to Kessel's value than the opinion of all of the other GM's who had little to no interest in him.
Wendel's Fist said:
Leaving aside that this just isn't true, a player hitting his 30's doesn't increase in value, I'm really surprised you don't see the contradiction here.
A star player signed to a reasonable contract is a good thing. A valuable thing. Nobody would ever say "Ryan Getzlaf gets more valuable the fewer years he has left on his deal" because that just isn't true. That's something you say about bad contracts. About players teams want to get rid of.
The Leafs got what they got because other teams just weren't that interested in adding Kessel. You're free to think every other GM in the League was wrong in not wanting to add him, but that wasn't the Leafs' fault and the reality is that it really didn't matter how long they waited, that wasn't going to change.
moon111
New member
The cost for Kessel was two 1st rounders, 1 second rounder. After 5-6 seasons, like a car, he's depreciated somewhat. The Leafs get back a 1st, a player drafted in the 1st, a player drafted in the 2nd... and a 26 year old Spalling and a 3rd. The only criticism I would have goes back to the Leafs falling on their face and the draft pick being so high that they gave up. If only they had done a proper rebuild instead.
Kin
New member
Deebo said:
Maybe. But there were 8 teams Kessel had to accept a trade to and none of them, save the Penguins, made an offer regardless.
But even so, there were reports out there that Kessel would have accepted a trade anywhere the Leafs had asked and while I don't know that I believe that completely I do think that if a team that wasn't on Kessel's list of approved teams made a serious pitch then the Leafs would have listened to it, brought it to him and, if it was an offer they thought was worth pursuing, they would have made it public and brought pressure on Kessel to accept it.
This is an organization, remember, that basically has done everything it could possibly do to hurt Kessel's value and the perception of him around the league. From Leiweke's comments to Horacheck's to the way they made it public they didn't want him around. So if anyone offered something better for Kessel, and remember that Kessel's NTC didn't prevent the Leafs from exploring deals with teams who weren't approved, I fully believe we would have heard about it similarly to how we heard about Rick Nash turning aside the Leafs' interest or Dany Heatley rejecting the trade to Edmonton.