Unofficial 2013-2014 Armchair GM Thread

[Corn Flake]

I hate to disagree with anything you suggest bustaheims as I usually need your opinion and knowledge with things I am trying to figure out with the team or league but in regards to Fraser he isn't the slowest dman in the league or even on the Leafs but he is one of the best fighters in the NHL that played as a regular roster player.  I can't think of any roster player in the Eastern Conference that he couldn't hold his own against.  That simple fact allows guys like Orr to be sat and replaced with the Komarovs and Frattins.  So I am in cabber24's camp of keeping Fraser as the clear #6 dman.

Fraser's slowness is more between his ears than on the ice. He doesn't make great decisions out there - with or without the puck. He started the season well, but, as it went on, it became pretty clear that he's not good enough to be a regular on the type of team we want the Leafs to be. As for his fighting abilities - not only should that be pretty much at the bottom of the list of reasons to consider keeping a player on the roster, the last place I want the team's designated tough guy to be in on the blueline. I don't want one of the team's 6 defencemen in the box for 5 minutes on a regular basis. If the Leafs feel the need to carry a heavy, that player should be a forward. It's much easier to manage being down a forward than it is to do so down a defenceman. Unless the team plans on dressing 7 defencemen every night, Fraser's fighting ability is nowhere close to enough to keep him in the lineup, as far as I'm concerned.

Mostly agree on him between the ears. I'm ok with Fraser as a #6, logging 12'ish mins a night against weaker lines.  The problem becomes if there is an injury in the top 4, then suddenly he's up playing minutes he shouldn't be.

So that pretty much means he's a 6/7 guy who can rotate in vs. more physical teams.  Probably not any higher in the lineup than that.

I would keep O'Byrne over Fraser. You lose the fighting but he is a better player - but again no higher than a #6.

 

[Corn Flake]

Boyd Gordon - Defensive play in the bottom 6.  Wins his faceoffs.  Strong penalty killer.  He would be a clone of Jay McLement essentially and being able to play both of them would almost guarantee a strong faceoff presence in the defensive zone at critical times.

Good call. This is a name that came up via twitter to me yesterday. I didn't realize he was UFA. Exactly the type of player we need in the bottom six and one of those physical guys who negates the need to dress a goon every night. Not huge but a physical guy.  He's a better skater than McClement from what I remember.

Clarkson... I think the biggest asset he brings is unpredictability.  I wouldn't pin him for more than 20 goals but he's a bit of a nut job, much like Tucker used to be, and I think we need more of that up front.  The price tag though could be just stupid.  The Leafs have two highly physical guys in Devane and Broll coming along nicely.  They won't produce offense but they can play and will bring a dimension of physicality that again negates the need for goons who can't play. I would be tempted to wait for them and spend the $5 mil on a centre.

 

[bustaheims]

I would keep O'Byrne over Fraser. You lose the fighting but he is a better player - but again no higher than a #6.

Depending on salary, I'd agree - but, all things considered, the Leafs really have 5 guys locked in on the blueline for next year until/unless trades are made. They really shouldn't be keeping either Fraser or O'Byrne if they're hoping for an upgrade back there.

 

[Corn Flake]

Speaking of GM'ing is anybody else a bit concerned that MLSE jettisoned Burke over what might have been attitude or personality conflicts while he was right in the middle of building this team?

I mean I was a critic of some of his moves as well, but he did put the team on this trajectory overall.  However we still need some big pieces, can Nonis do as good a job putting together the rest of the puzzle as Burke could have?  The concern is that he can't and then we're looking back at another big 'what if' down the road.

Nonis effectively put together the Canucks team that went to the finals.  He also refused to trade their top kids for rentals.  He knows how to build a contender.  Gillis has done a good job screwing it up since then.

 

[Corn Flake]

I would keep O'Byrne over Fraser. You lose the fighting but he is a better player - but again no higher than a #6.

Depending on salary, I'd agree - but, all things considered, the Leafs really have 5 guys locked in on the blueline for next year until/unless trades are made. They really shouldn't be keeping either Fraser or O'Byrne if they're hoping for an upgrade back there.

Probably, yep.  5? Oh right you are ok with keeping Liles, right?  I just don't see it.  His role is way too diminished. With Gardiner and Franson's emergence,  Rielly + others with speed & puck handling on the horizon, I think he's an expensive 3rd pairing guy at best. 

 

[bustaheims]

Why dont we just get 15 puck moving offensive dman and forget about defense all together? The team your suggesting would be quite small and un-intimidating. The team needs stay at home minute crunchers responsible in their own end... Frasor's +/-. You cannot have to many guys filling the same role.

Just because guys can skate with the puck doesn't make them non-physical or not intimidating - both Phaneuf and Frason are big guys that skate well and hit hard. Mobility on the backend is extremely important. The best defence is getting the puck out of the zone without giving it away. That's what guys who can move the puck bring. Gunnarsson's not exactly small either, and he's a defence first guy that can move the puck well. He's a better player than Fraser on every level except for fighting.

 

[Corn Flake]

Why dont we just get 15 puck moving offensive dman and forget about defense all together? The team your suggesting would be quite small and un-intimidating. The team needs stay at home minute crunchers responsible in their own end... Frasor's +/-. You cannot have to many guys filling the same role.

Just because guys can skate with the puck doesn't make them non-physical or not intimidating - both Phaneuf and Frason are big guys that skate well and hit hard. Mobility on the backend is extremely important. The best defence is getting the puck out of the zone without giving it away. That's what guys who can move the puck bring. Gunnarsson's not exactly small either, and he's a defence first guy that can move the puck well. He's a better player than Fraser on every level except for fighting.

Jay Bo is another example of this.  He hits a lot, carries the puck very well and skates like the wind.. obviously not a fighter but plays a physical game.  He would have been the perfect, huge upgrade needed on defense.  Too bad that didn't happen as the price was stupid cheap. 

I don't think fighters on your blue line is a good idea anyway. Losing a d-man for 5 mins is never a good thing, even if he's your #6.

 

[bustaheims]

Probably, yep.  5? Oh right you are ok with keeping Liles, right?  I just don't see it.  His role is way too diminished. With Gardiner and Franson's emergence,  Rielly + others with speed & puck handling on the horizon, I think he's an expensive 3rd pairing guy at best.

The Leafs don't have a cap issue next season, and, when he was back in the lineup, the team looked much better - not solely because of him, but, at least, partially. Having mobile guys who can move the puck calmly is important, and Liles can do that. He's really not a buyout candidate this summer as the Leafs can easily manage his cap hit and have a need for a guy like him on their 3rd pairing. Rielly, realistically, is still a year or two away from making the club, so, as far I'm concerned, he's not really even a consideration right now. I don't want him on the team unless he show's he's already ready to be a top 3 guy. I don't see any of the prospects really being ready for full time duty next season.

 

[cabber24]

Why dont we just get 15 puck moving offensive dman and forget about defense all together? The team your suggesting would be quite small and un-intimidating. The team needs stay at home minute crunchers responsible in their own end... Frasor's +/-. You cannot have to many guys filling the same role.

Just because guys can skate with the puck doesn't make them non-physical or not intimidating - both Phaneuf and Frason are big guys that skate well and hit hard. Mobility on the backend is extremely important. The best defence is getting the puck out of the zone without giving it away. That's what guys who can move the puck bring. Gunnarsson's not exactly small either, and he's a defence first guy that can move the puck well. He's a better player than Fraser on every level except for fighting.

I simply don't think a team with Gunner, Phaneuf, Franson, Liles, and Gardiner is physical, intimidating, or defensively minded enough. They need more balance, more physical, more defensively minded dman to complement the offensive type dman. RC obviously felt the same way based on who was sitting in the press box this year. To many cooks in the kitchen.

 

[Corn Flake]

Let's put money on the Flames doing something incredibly stupid with their pick this year and be right there when he does.

Considering what he gave away his star players for, I would imagine that 6th overall pick is probably worth a bag of curly fries to him.  The top 3 teams are walking away with franchise players.  Getting close might be worth it.

 

[hap_leaf]

Nonis needs to stay the course with accumulating draft picks and finding the gems within the organization.
For me, Kadri and Colborne simply have to fit the bill as our future top centers.  You give them all the time and coaching required and don't give up on them or trade for some UFA for huge money. 
Similar in the defensive end: you don't give up on Gardiner, Rielly and Reimer.
These guys will be the core for years and when the time is right, you fill in the blanks with a few UFA for a meaningful Cup run.

 

[Champ Kind]

Mike Smith and Niklas Backstrom are both UFAs this summer.  Both of these goalies have something to give and can be useful to the Leafs going forward.  If I had my druthers, Backstrom signs a Vokoun'esque deal in Toronto for 2 years.

 

[Britishbulldog]

If Nashville wants out from under Weber's contract I'm sending a brinks truck to David Poile's door.

It'd be nice to have that rock back there on defense. It seems like all the good teams do.

They need a lot of help in Nashville. Maybe we can oblige.

Thats exactly the guy I would argue this team needs. I was about to say, if only we had Shea Weber. Somebody to partner with Phaneuf and really , I mean really put the fear into other teams. Anybody that fits that mold. That, and a decent center to win faceoffs but who knows how well Colbourne will turn out.

Like sampson and others have commented, the Leafs need only a couple of players.

I have a hard time to remain as realistic as some of you folks here but I will try a bit.

1)The biggest need is a defenseman to pair with Phaneuf.  Weber's contract was structured by Philadelphia in such a way to make it very difficult for Nashville to cover it financially for the first 6 years. That is the ONLY reason a franchise stud defenseman like him would be even remotely considered available.  He is the only player I REALLY would like to see on the Leafs and would trade ANYONE to get him. Since Pominville got Buffalo a 1st pick, 2nd pick and 2 decent prospects, Grabovski is probably worth around the same. Grabovski (or the assets received in trading him) would most likely have to be included with Liles and Toronto's 1st 2014 + a top Marlie dman as the starting base for the package to get Weber. 

2)The forward I would like to get would be Chris Stewart (surprise, surprise) as he is ALSO on a team with financial constraints and he is young enough.  Unfortunately, Kulemin would most likely have to be in the package going the other way though.  Although Clarkson is a UFA and can be added without any assets lost I believe he is too much of a wildcard for huge salary he could demand.  I think that CF's comparison to Tucker is quite accurate as he gets emotional at the wrong times and has gotten rocked fighting real fighters which neutralizes that part of his game.

****that is where I would be content....but if possible:

3)If the trade options were still available, I would look into CF's idea and try to get E Johnson from Colorado to pair with Gardiner since it is 99.99% fact that Seth Jones is going to Colorado as the 1st pick overall.

I also suspect that Carlyle will want a super heavyweight in the lineup and Orr will get re-signed because of that fact even though he is useless as a hockey player.

I hear ya bustaheims regarding Fraser's decision making but he adds something to the defense NO ONE else does, whether on the Leafs, Marlies or even all the prospects.  I am sticking in Fraser's corner. 


JVR-Grabovski (or Bozak)-Kessel
Lupul-Kadri-Stewart
Frattin-Colborne-Marlie
Komarov-McClement-Orr
McLaren

Weber-Phaneuf
Gardiner-Holzer (or E Johnson)
Fraser-Franson
x

Riemer
x

Lastly, after drinking the blue cool aid I would wonder if San Jose gets beaten by LA again this year if they would be willing to move 34 year old Thornton for a 'Iginla' type trade which was a couple of decent ECAC prospects and a high draft pick.... especially since through the regular season and now the playoffs San Jose's 4 top scorers are all natural centers?  Thornton might have 3 - 4 seasons left in him which would shelter Colborne on the 3rd line for a couple of years and dropping Kadri to 2nd line.

 

[Jimmified]

A lot of you seem to be mentioning E. Johnson
Has he been on the rumor mill?
Even if they draft Seth Jones, wouldn't he be someone the Avs wanna keep to build their D core?
Just asking cause it seems like we'd have to give up a lot to get him.

 

[Corn Flake]

A lot of you seem to be mentioning E. Johnson
Has he been on the rumor mill?
Even if they draft Seth Jones, wouldn't he be someone the Avs wanna keep to build their D core?
Just asking cause it seems like we'd have to give up a lot to get him.

I brought him up initially as a guy I would target.  Nothing in the mill but that doesn't really matter.. usually the mill is 100% BS just like we are.  

Do I think he's attainable? Tough to say but I don't think the Avs can be happy with how he has performed so far. He's not a no.1 d-man. He's a solid 2nd pairing guy who is never going to pan out as initially drafted.  I think behind Phaneuf or even paired with him at times if Dion goes back to the left side, he would do quite well. I wonder if the Avs are a tad bit bitter about how that trade panned out for them and would be ok to move on and build around a younger core that will feature Landeskog and now Seth Jones.

Also, I throw Statsny in as a salary dump.  Not sure what the cap floor is this year but I'm betting the Avs would be happy to be at or close to it.  Leafs could create some package deal to get both players which would be upgrades for the Leafs and salary savings for the Avs.

I'm totally spitballing here, but that's what this thread is for.

 

[Bullfrog]

I'd honestly like to see Grabovski get a chance at the no.1 spot. I'm not at all suggesting he's a no.1 centre, but put him in a position to succeed.

Though I don't really see any big changes coming, I'd be very open to the idea of getting Stastny. Much better play maker and just as good on the draws as Bozak.

 

[Jimmified]

A lot of you seem to be mentioning E. Johnson
Has he been on the rumor mill?
Even if they draft Seth Jones, wouldn't he be someone the Avs wanna keep to build their D core?
Just asking cause it seems like we'd have to give up a lot to get him.

I'm totally spitballing here, but that's what this thread is for.

Well in that case...

Nashville has to pay Shea Weber another $13 million signing bonus on July 1st.
What do you think it'll take to get him off their hands?
A Phaneuf and Weber first pairing sounds very enticing

 

[Corn Flake]

A lot of you seem to be mentioning E. Johnson
Has he been on the rumor mill?
Even if they draft Seth Jones, wouldn't he be someone the Avs wanna keep to build their D core?
Just asking cause it seems like we'd have to give up a lot to get him.

I'm totally spitballing here, but that's what this thread is for.

Well in that case...

Nashville has to pay Shea Weber another $13 million signing bonus on July 1st.
What do you think it'll take to get him off their hands?
A Phaneuf and Weber first pairing sounds very enticing

Yes. Yes it does. 

Price tag to acquire Weber though?  Biiiig.  I get saving the Preds $13 mil is a good thing but they are in good shape ownership wise so are they that desperate to save money but lose their franchise player?

 

[Heroic Shrimp]

A lot of you seem to be mentioning E. Johnson
Has he been on the rumor mill?
Even if they draft Seth Jones, wouldn't he be someone the Avs wanna keep to build their D core?
Just asking cause it seems like we'd have to give up a lot to get him.

I'm totally spitballing here, but that's what this thread is for.

Well in that case...

Nashville has to pay Shea Weber another $13 million signing bonus on July 1st.
What do you think it'll take to get him off their hands?
A Phaneuf and Weber first pairing sounds very enticing

Yes. Yes it does. 

Price tag to acquire Weber though?  Biiiig.  I get saving the Preds $13 mil is a good thing but they are in good shape ownership wise so are they that desperate to save money but lose their franchise player?

The possible wild card is whether or not Weber has quietly asked for a trade.  No reports that he has that I know of, but he's playing there under a long contract he signed to play with another team.  It's always possible he wants out, and before July 1 would be the ideal time to move him.  I'd read he doesn't have a NTC, is this true?

I doubt he gets traded, but you never know...

 

[Jimmified]

Offer sheets can't include NTC's so no, he doesn't have one