2023-24 Toronto Maple Leafs General Discussion

[L K]

[Hidden in here is the sad truth about Gio....]

Keefe not scratching Giordano for a single playoff game this year has to be up there on his list of all-time blunders. Dude was one of the teams worst players in both series'. Holl took all of the heat for that pairs struggles against Tampa but he was arguably just as bad if not worse. It's even more crazy considering how under-utilized Gustafsson was.

I actually wondered if a new GM might have a little more of a ruthless attitude toward Giordano in his final year, but considering Treliving has a relationship with him too that likely won't be the case. I feel like we say this ever year with our vets and it doesn't end up happening because players hate to sit, but the Leafs seriously need to do some hardcore load management with Gio this season.

It's too bad because for most of the regular season he was really good.  It was pretty clear that his body couldn't keep up with the long season + playoffs and Keefe not giving him more rest was a huge mistake.  He didn't need to sit for weeks at a time, they just needed to not have him playing every back to back.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

It's too bad because for most of the regular season he was really good.  It was pretty clear that his body couldn't keep up with the long season + playoffs and Keefe not giving him more rest was a huge mistake.  He didn't need to sit for weeks at a time, they just needed to not have him playing every back to back.

Yeah I mean it's weird heading into playoffs Brodie, McCabe, Holl, and Giordano were all actually playing really well while the Rielly-Schenn pair looked like the bigger question mark. We saw the reverse of that in the playoffs.

 

[archie holdsworth]

I can't say I'm happy with Keefe's apparent return, but I will give Treliving the benefit of the doubt, because who is out there now that would be an obvious upgrade? Treliving may as well keep the fire the coach card in his pocket for now.

Last summer was the time to hire a new coach.

 

[ZBBM]

Changing the subject, MLHS has the first of two should-they-stay-or-go UFA analyses up:

https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2023/06/17/toronto-maple-leafs-ufas-holl-schenn-acciari-aston-reese-gusafsson/

https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2023/06/19/toronto-maple-leafs-ufas-oreilly-bunting-kampf-and-kerfoot/
Follow up article (i.e. the gooder ones)

The long and short of it: of the 9 UFAs MLHS analyzed, only one, Acciari, was a want-him-bad.  The rest were no's, mehs, or (ROR's case), yesses if a bargain signing.  In other words, MHLS is plumping for a major roster turnover.  (They would have begun with Keefe.)

 

[cabber24]

I can't say I'm happy with Keefe's apparent return, but I will give Treliving the benefit of the doubt, because who is out there now that would be an obvious upgrade? Treliving may as well keep the fire the coach card in his pocket for now.

Last summer was the time to hire a new coach.

I interpret it as self-protection as well. He can now essentially fire 2 coaches before people start looking at him.
Anyway, I am still on team run-it-back. I am skeptical they can get better trading any of the core. I would love to be surprised but I doubt I will be. Holl gone will help. Don't dislike the guy but he was definitely over casted. Taking that option away from Keefe makes a Keefe coached team better.

 

[herman]

https://twitter.com/BabayevShumi/status/1672275730497953797
Semyon Der-Arguchintsev's new agency reports he is in demand! but he wants to be in Toronto!

 

[ZBBM]

https://twitter.com/BabayevShumi/status/1672275730497953797
Semyon Der-Arguchintsev's new agency reports he is in demand! but he wants to be in Toronto!

Any chance he ever makes the big club?

 

[Guilt Trip]

https://twitter.com/BabayevShumi/status/1672275730497953797
Semyon Der-Arguchintsev's new agency reports he is in demand! but he wants to be in Toronto!

Any chance he ever makes the big club?

He's a long shot but the guy has some good tools. I've liked watching him play and his game has gotten better every year. I wouldn't mind seeing him get a good look.

 

[herman]

Elite brain and hands; Adam Brooks, Nick Abruzzese come to mind as template comparables that aren?t as skilled but have the same limitations. Won?t do anything wrong decision-making-wise (other than maybe overpassing?) but might not have the speed/physical gifts to assert their will on the NHL game without significant linemate help.

If he stays in the system, maybe he gets a partial 2-season run at like 27-29 years old (a la Carter Verhaeghe, one hopes). Perpetual tweener because there is always going to be someone better in a top-6 role and someone bigger and stronger in a bottom-6 role.

[youtube]mXdjCFZPrcQ[/youtube]

 

[herman]

https://twitter.com/devin_heroux/status/1673055642360193026

 

[ZBBM]

https://twitter.com/devin_heroux/status/1673055642360193026

Two thumbs up.

 

[L K]

I'm surprised at how little Leafs news there has been since Treliving took over.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I'm surprised at how little Leafs news there has been since Treliving took over.

I figured we'd see some player movement at this point but it's always been a pretty real possibility that not a single one of our UFAs return for one reason or another. Or at the very least don't return until they check what their options are on July 1st.

 

[Zee]

https://twitter.com/devin_heroux/status/1673055642360193026

Burkie has been a consistent supporter on this, good on him.

 

[herman]

https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2023/06/26/core-four-offseason-series-the-auston-matthews-contract/

This here is probably the reason most other moves this offseason are relatively on hold. Getting clarity, even on the ballpark of where Matthews' next cap hit lands, will inform the plans around future signings and transactions.

Of all the pending extensions, this is the one you want to leave enough flexibility for, for whichever outcome.

 

[ZBBM]

https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2023/06/26/core-four-offseason-series-the-auston-matthews-contract/

This here is probably the reason most other moves this offseason are relatively on hold. Getting clarity, even on the ballpark of where Matthews' next cap hit lands, will inform the plans around future signings and transactions.

Of all the pending extensions, this is the one you want to leave enough flexibility for, for whichever outcome.

Good article.

My analysis comes down to four words:

His wrist, his wrist.

This past season his signature good-luck-with-this-ya-goalies lacrosse slingshot was essentially gone.  Without it, he goes from stratospheric perennial Rocket candidate to 40-goal guy ? very good, but not transcendent.  Even without that weapon, obviously he can score, but nobody envisioned him as a latter-day Boom Boom Geoffrion when he came into the league.

MLSE surely knows what his physical problem(s) exactly is/are, even if we don't. And Auston knows that they know.  The MLHS story touches fairly lightly on the security angle, but they did highlight the salient point: if he tries to go short on an extension to grab $20+ down the road, he risks quite a lot if his problems compound/deteriorate.

Was last year an aberration or a new, somewhat depressing reality for him?  That, to me, is the key unknown around this negotiating dance will pivot.

 

[archie holdsworth]

https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2023/06/26/core-four-offseason-series-the-auston-matthews-contract/

This here is probably the reason most other moves this offseason are relatively on hold. Getting clarity, even on the ballpark of where Matthews' next cap hit lands, will inform the plans around future signings and transactions.

Of all the pending extensions, this is the one you want to leave enough flexibility for, for whichever outcome.

Good article.

My analysis comes down to four words:

His wrist, his wrist.

This past season his signature good-luck-with-this-ya-goalies lacrosse slingshot was essentially gone.  Without it, he goes from stratospheric perennial Rocket candidate to 40-goal guy ? very good, but not transcendent.  Even without that weapon, obviously he can score, but nobody envisioned him as a latter-day Boom Boom Geoffrion when he came into the league.

MLSE surely knows what his physical problem(s) exactly is/are, even if we don't. And Auston knows that they know.  The MLHS story touches fairly lightly on the security angle, but they did highlight the salient point: if he tries to go short on an extension to grab $20+ down the road, he risks quite a lot if his problems compound/deteriorate.

Was last year an aberration or a new, somewhat depressing reality for him?  That, to me, is the key unknown around this negotiating dance will pivot.

Yes, a very good question. Is the Matthews you are signing the Matthews you want to sign?

What kind of a wrist injury never heals properly? With a young man like Matthews, I can't imagine a year over year injury that just diminishes him going forward, end of story. But I'm not a doctor.

Maybe it's more of an Erik Karlsson (who I hope the Leafs get) situation. A cluster of injuries that the player can recover from. Unless there's something that we are all not aware of, you don't trade Matthews. Late in the season, the wrist seemed to be back, if the timing might have been a bit off. There has been no word of off season wrist surgery this year. I'll take that as a positive.

 

[cabber24]

https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2023/06/26/core-four-offseason-series-the-auston-matthews-contract/

This here is probably the reason most other moves this offseason are relatively on hold. Getting clarity, even on the ballpark of where Matthews' next cap hit lands, will inform the plans around future signings and transactions.

Of all the pending extensions, this is the one you want to leave enough flexibility for, for whichever outcome.

Good article.

My analysis comes down to four words:

His wrist, his wrist.

This past season his signature good-luck-with-this-ya-goalies lacrosse slingshot was essentially gone.  Without it, he goes from stratospheric perennial Rocket candidate to 40-goal guy ? very good, but not transcendent.  Even without that weapon, obviously he can score, but nobody envisioned him as a latter-day Boom Boom Geoffrion when he came into the league.

MLSE surely knows what his physical problem(s) exactly is/are, even if we don't. And Auston knows that they know.  The MLHS story touches fairly lightly on the security angle, but they did highlight the salient point: if he tries to go short on an extension to grab $20+ down the road, he risks quite a lot if his problems compound/deteriorate.

Was last year an aberration or a new, somewhat depressing reality for him?  That, to me, is the key unknown around this negotiating dance will pivot.

This past season his signature good-luck-with-this-ya-goalies lacrosse slingshot was essentially gone.

That whip never did show up this year. Who knows, maybe that will save us some dough when we hopefully resign him. I think he will fully recover, he's young.

 

[cabber24]

If we resign Nylander and Matthews the Leafs will likely have a down year 24/25 until JT is off the books (capped out). I am okay with that if we get to keep Matthews and Nylander.

 

[Guilt Trip]

If we resign Nylander and Matthews the Leafs will likely have a down year 24/25 until JT is off the books (capped out). I am okay with that if we get to keep Matthews and Nylander.

Why would they have a down year? Next season when Matthews and Willy start their new deals, Brodie's 5M and Murray's 4.6M will be gone. They'll still be able to sign ROR Acciari, Sammy and Schenn this off season and  be ok.