• For users coming over from tmlfans.ca your username will remain the same but you will need to use the password reset feature (check your spam folder) on the login page in order to set your password. If you encounter issues, email Rick couchmanrick@gmail.com

2024-25 Toronto Maple Leafs General Discussion

herman said:
Cathal Kelly writes sports columns now?

If Marner is exercising his full rights to not negotiate during the season and also veto any potential trades, then the Leafs are exercising their full rights to ask him whenever something comes up. The front office has a job to do to make the team better. Doing their job to explore options and avenues does not constitute 'playing games' with the player. Not publicly mollifying a pending UFA in the midst of an organizational crisis after failure does not constitute 'playing games' with the player.

If Marner is truly discombobulated by standard operating procedures in team management and media, then he is in the wrong line of work and definitely chose the wrong representative.
Click to expand...
The Leafs effectively abdicated those rights practically when they handed Marner a NMC for his final 2 seasons on his current deal. All decisions come through Marner except whether the Leafs accept the final number on a deal should Marner allow it to get that far.

Marner was agreeable to discussions last spring. But did not get the priority commitment from Treliving that Matthews and Nylander did. Their leading playoff scorer since his arrival got baked in the media without the Leaf management coming to his defense for weeks. Leafs management mumbled about seeing what they could get for him in a trade and got the media all worked up over that. Leafs management's handling of the situation over the summer created the media circus that Marner did not appreciate.

Marner resolved to not talk about his contract with the media during the season so he could focus on playing hockey and not be a distraction for his team. He supported his agent and Treliving having discussions during the season to try to work something out - just as he had last spring.

Stirring up the media circus with the Rantanen deal is on Leafs management. That contradicted what Marner wanted both in terms of his consistent desire to play for the Leafs, to not accept a trade - especially with his pregnant wife - and to not have a distraction during the season. Sure, Leafs management broke no laws doing it but they obviously upset the player significantly as his voice trembled in response to the media.

You can spin it a thousand ways: the next contract as a UFA is Marner's decision ultimately. Leafs management are about to find out in 15 weeks or so if it was smart to upset the guy who is going to make that decision - as they have much of the last year - and could leave for nothing while he is in his prime.

Why should Marner want uproot his pregnant wife to go to Carolina, who are lower in the standings and notoriously cheap, when he could pick from nearly any of 32 NHL destinations for maximum dough 15 weeks from now and see this season through with his pals on the Leafs?

That was a downright shortsighted, stupid stunt for Leafs management to pull - oblivious to what Marner has expressed and his circumstances.
 
ZBBM said:
This debate about whether to let Marner walk is beyond ridiculous.

You cannot replace a player that good. He's the kind of player you dream for years about getting.

The Leafs odds of winning a Cup by running back this Core 4 are higher than the Core 3 + whatever player(s) they sign with Marner's cap space. End of story.
Click to expand...
Exactly this. I have seen far more games this year that Marner has stood out than Matthews - PK, PP, incredible set-ups etc
 
cw said:
The Leafs effectively abdicated those rights practically when they handed Marner a NMC for his final 2 seasons on his current deal. All decisions come through Marner except whether the Leafs accept the final number on a deal should Marner allow it to get that far.

Marner was agreeable to discussions last spring. But did not get the priority commitment from Treliving that Matthews and Nylander did. Their leading playoff scorer since his arrival got baked in the media without the Leaf management coming to his defense for weeks. Leafs management mumbled about seeing what they could get for him in a trade and got the media all worked up over that. Leafs management's handling of the situation over the summer created the media circus that Marner did not appreciate.

Marner resolved to not talk about his contract with the media during the season so he could focus on playing hockey and not be a distraction for his team. He supported his agent and Treliving having discussions during the season to try to work something out - just as he had last spring.

Stirring up the media circus with the Rantanen deal is on Leafs management. That contradicted what Marner wanted both in terms of his consistent desire to play for the Leafs, to not accept a trade - especially with his pregnant wife - and to not have a distraction during the season. Sure, Leafs management broke no laws doing it but they obviously upset the player significantly as his voice trembled in response to the media.

You can spin it a thousand ways: the next contract as a UFA is Marner's decision ultimately. Leafs management are about to find out in 15 weeks or so if it was smart to upset the guy who is going to make that decision - as they have much of the last year - and could leave for nothing while he is in his prime.

Why should Marner want uproot his pregnant wife to go to Carolina, who are lower in the standings and notoriously cheap, when he could pick from nearly any of 32 NHL destinations for maximum dough 15 weeks from now and see this season through with his pals on the Leafs?

That was a downright shortsighted, stupid stunt for Leafs management to pull - oblivious to what Marner has expressed and his circumstances.
Click to expand...
Stunt? You've got to be joking. This is 100% kid gloves nonsense, always has been and always will be. Everything that isn't perfect upsets the Marner camp and his agent. Nylander got the same crap as Marner for ages and not once did he come off like he'd been slighted. If Marner walked at the end of the season and we find out Carolina had asked for Marner in a trade and Tre didn't ask him you absolutely know he'd be destroyed for that decision.

But as I said, everything is an affront to Marner and his camp unless they 100% acquiesce. It's always been that way since Matthews got ELC signing bonuses and Marner didn't.
 
Bender said:
Stunt? You've got to be joking. This is 100% kid gloves nonsense, always has been and always will be. Everything that isn't perfect upsets the Marner camp and his agent. Nylander got the same crap as Marner for ages and not once did he come off like he'd been slighted. If Marner walked at the end of the season and we find out Carolina had asked for Marner in a trade and Tre didn't ask him you absolutely know he'd be destroyed for that decision.

But as I said, everything is an affront to Marner and his camp unless they 100% acquiesce. It's always been that way since Matthews got ELC signing bonuses and Marner didn't.
Click to expand...

In 15 weeks, Marner can go wherever he wants. Why would he want to curtail that option, go to Carolina now and leave his pregnant wife behind or take her away from her family?
The broken record that has been playing since last spring is that he will not agree to a trade period. He is going to finish this season with his buddies on the Leafs whether Leafs management likes that or not. Leafs management gave up the right to have any say in that matter years ago. That is the way it is. Leafs management trying to pretend it is something else is futile.
This isn't kid gloves. He jackhammered that message out repeatedly. Treliving is too thick to pick up on it.
And he was emphatic that he did not want his contract to be a distraction for his team. His agent and the Leafs could kick around contract ideas. But a media circus was not on the menu.

They have upset the player, his family and his teammates. They'll be lucky if they get a chance to pay for it in dollars.
His agent is going for the bidding war now. No quarter.

They're flirting with losing a top 5 or so scorer in the league for nothing with few UFA options to make that up and 3 seasons after this for Matthews window.

Basically, Marner is a UFA with a NMC. He has been since the end of last season. He's holding all the cards except for the cheques someone will sign. If it were July 1st, would it be a good strategy to upset or piss off a UFA just before you tried to sign him? That is what they are doing - just 15 weeks ahead of schedule.

Stupid is as stupid does.
 
Last edited:
I still think this is overblown. This is what was report that Friedman stated:
"
The Hurricanes had wanted Mitch Marner, the Leafs did NOT offer him. The Leafs had went to Marner and said that their priority was to sign him but Carolina was calling about him.

Marner was not willing to waive his trade clause because he wants to remain with the Maple Leafs."

This isn't exactly throwing Marner to the wolves.

I think this has little to no impact on the negotiations or Marner's desire to stay. His agent will play hard ball no matter what and will likely push for him to be the highest paid player in the league (depending on term). If he signed a full 8-year extension, I wouldn't be shocked to see that happen.
 
cw said:
...

Basically, Marner is a UFA with a NMC. He has been since the end of last season. He's holding all the cards except for the cheques someone will sign. If it were July 1st, would it be a good strategy to upset or piss off a UFA just before you tried to sign him? That is what they are doing - just 15 weeks ahead of schedule.

Stupid is as stupid does.
Click to expand...
How has any of this changed? Marner's always been in full control here; he's far and away the best free agent available. He's going to ask for more money because his feelings got hurt? I'm 100% positive his agent has asked for him to be the highest paid player in the league. 100%.
 
cw said:
In 15 weeks, Marner can go wherever he wants. Why would he want to curtail that option, go to Carolina now and leave his pregnant wife behind or take her away from her family?
The broken record that has been playing since last spring is that he will not agree to a trade period. He is going to finish this season with his buddies on the Leafs whether Leafs management likes that or not. Leafs management gave up the right to have any say in that matter years ago. That is the way it is. Leafs management trying to pretend it is something else is futile.
This isn't kid gloves. He jackhammered that message out repeatedly. Treliving is too thick to pick up on it.
And he was emphatic that he did not want his contract to be a distraction for his team. His agent and the Leafs could kick around contract ideas. But a media circus was not on the menu.

They have upset the player, his family and his teammates. They'll be lucky if they get a chance to pay for it in dollars.
His agent is going for the bidding war now. No quarter.

They're flirting with losing a top 5 or so scorer in the league for nothing with few UFA options to make that up and 3 seasons after this for Matthews window. One of the 6 UFA options that might have been available has PED problems.

Basically, Marner is a UFA with a NMC. He has been since the end of last season. He's holding all the cards except for the cheques someone will sign. If it were July 1st, would it be a good strategy to upset or piss off a UFA just before you tried to sign him? That is what they are doing - just 15 weeks ahead of schedule.

Stupid is as stupid does.
Click to expand...
Everything that is a perceived affront to Marner is and has always been the Leafs' fault and can always be spun in that direction. Darren Ferris and the Marner camp have always held all the cards and anything except complete and utter cowtowing of Marner is unacceptable in their eyes. Marner could be given a matching salary to AM34 and it still wouldn't be enough because the only thing that matters is maximizing every dollar. Not confirming your options is an utterly ridiculous way to run a hockey team and I understand Marner's potential thought of wanting to leave, but if this is where the line gets drawn then good lord, he doesn't want to be here anyway.
 
cw said:
In 15 weeks, Marner can go wherever he wants. Why would he want to curtail that option, go to Carolina now and leave his pregnant wife behind or take her away from her family?
The broken record that has been playing since last spring is that he will not agree to a trade period. He is going to finish this season with his buddies on the Leafs whether Leafs management likes that or not. Leafs management gave up the right to have any say in that matter years ago. That is the way it is. Leafs management trying to pretend it is something else is futile.
This isn't kid gloves. He jackhammered that message out repeatedly. Treliving is too thick to pick up on it.
And he was emphatic that he did not want his contract to be a distraction for his team. His agent and the Leafs could kick around contract ideas. But a media circus was not on the menu.

They have upset the player, his family and his teammates. They'll be lucky if they get a chance to pay for it in dollars.
His agent is going for the bidding war now. No quarter.

They're flirting with losing a top 5 or so scorer in the league for nothing with few UFA options to make that up and 3 seasons after this for Matthews window. One of the 6 UFA options that might have been available has PED problems.

Basically, Marner is a UFA with a NMC. He has been since the end of last season. He's holding all the cards except for the cheques someone will sign. If it were July 1st, would it be a good strategy to upset or piss off a UFA just before you tried to sign him? That is what they are doing - just 15 weeks ahead of schedule.

Stupid is as stupid does.
Click to expand...
OMG, it's a business. It's nothing personal. Dubas' daycare is closed.
 
Bullfrog said:
How has any of this changed? Marner's always been in full control here; he's far and away the best free agent available. He's going to ask for more money because his feelings got hurt? I'm 100% positive his agent has asked for him to be the highest paid player in the league. 100%.
Click to expand...
Exactly. If doing your due diligence is a way to "piss off" players then I don't know what to tell literally everyone working in the NHL. I still think Tre gets absolutely roasted if it comes out there was a potential deal on the table and Marner walks anyway. If Marner walks it's 100% going to be spun on the Leafs aggrieving Marner's camp vs. the camp wanting to maximize every single cent at the cost of the fanbase's perception of Marner.
 
Also I will add, don't we think this was partially informed by Tre's previous experience dealing with Tkachuk and Gaudreau? Brad wanted to sign Gaudreau and Gaudreau also said he wanted to sign in Calgary only to have him not do so in the end. He also confirmed Tkachuk's non interest in re-signing and shipped him to Florida. If you don't explore your options because it is a perceived affront to your player and camp then to me clearly anything can and will be used against the team in the negotiation. Would we be shocked if Darren Ferris said "We said we wanted to wait to negotiate unt we hoped Bradtil after the season finished, bu would prove he had interest in our player by meeting our ask before the season started" because I wouldn't be.
 
Bender said:
Stunt? You've got to be joking. This is 100% kid gloves nonsense, always has been and always will be. Everything that isn't perfect upsets the Marner camp and his agent. Nylander got the same crap as Marner for ages and not once did he come off like he'd been slighted. If Marner walked at the end of the season and we find out Carolina had asked for Marner in a trade and Tre didn't ask him you absolutely know he'd be destroyed for that decision.

But as I said, everything is an affront to Marner and his camp unless they 100% acquiesce. It's always been that way since Matthews got ELC signing bonuses and Marner didn't.
Click to expand...
I’m genuinely asking, but when has Marner actually came out and said he was slighted? Or complained?

I’m asking because I’ve never heard him actually say anything in that manner, just articles, or tweets or insiders.

I’m not saying it’s not true, I just personally have not seen him actually say anything in that manner.
 
Joe S. said:
I’m genuinely asking, but when has Marner actually came out and said he was slighted? Or complained?

I’m asking because I’ve never heard him actually say anything in that manner, just articles, or tweets or insiders.

I’m not saying it’s not true, I just personally have not seen him actually say anything in that manner.
Click to expand...
Marner hasn’t, but his agent has:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1093126787687686145
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top