Allaire won't be back

[WalterSobchak]

It maybe possible he has lined up another job already.

I can't make out who he is blaming, either Wilson/Carlyle, or the 10 headed management beast running the show..

The 4 page pullout in the Sun today made him out to being Brutus stabbing Burke in the back..

 

[Bullfrog]

I'm surprised a bit as I've always argued against the fact that Allaire was unwavering in style because, surely, he must be flexible. If Burke is to believed, apparently it's ture that Allaire didn't alter his techniques.

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

I'm surprised a bit as I've always argued against the fact that Allaire was unwavering in style because, surely, he must be flexible. If Burke is to believed, apparently it's ture that Allaire didn't alter his techniques.

Yeah if it got to the stage that they had to intervene then I think perhaps one of the goalies complained about something and that's why there was an intervention of sorts from the coaching staff.

 

[Derk]

I suppose we will never know the full story. Sounds like it is already a game of "he said, he said".

 

[CarltonTheBear]

No loss here. Bring in Eddie the Eagle he was
a reflex goalie who grew old playing the game and adapted and grew into a very good positional goalie. Plus the Eagle was coached by the best goalie Russia had to offfer

The goalie coach they're rumoured to be looking at, Rick St. Croix, was Eddie's goalie coach in Dallas when they won the Cup in '99.

 

[895]

I have said on many occasions that he was useless but many of you defended him because the team appeared to have his back still.  You couldn't see his style was outdated and ruining promising youngster after promising youngster.  I bet Toskala was still good for a few years had he not been ruined by Allaire. 

I'm sorry to come on here and blast you but many of you lack common sense and the ability to see past public facades.  You can't read between the lines apparently.  It was clear as day that he was useless.  I was afraid that Burke couldn't see it...but luckily it seems he doesn't want to go out a loser quite yet. 

There may be hope yet for Burkie.

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

Every young goalie in the system sang his praises and cited him as the reason they signed with Toronto, so don't try and use hindsight to toot your own horn.

 

[bustaheims]

I bet Toskala was still good for a few years had he not been ruined by Allaire. 

Toskala's last season as a Leaf was Allaire's first in the organization. Allaire had absolutely nothing to do with Toskala being terrible - he was terrible long before Allaire was hired. He played all of 26 games as a Leaf after Allaire joined the club.

 

[#1PilarFan]

I don't think you make it as far as he did without a firm grasp of the fundamentals. Style is probably the least relevant factor in the makeup of a goalie. Allaire has coached some pretty great goalies, but I wonder if Allaire's success has more to do with them than it does with him.

Well, Hasek's career would suggest that you can go pretty far regardless of how erratic you play. For the record, I don't know what Cujo, or even Hasek, knows about fundamentals, but they didn't really seem to apply them terribly well. Does that make either one of them a bad coach? Not at all. But it seems to me that mediocre to terrible players - the ones who are only in professional hockey because of a dedication to fundamental hockey and self-sacrifice - are the ones who make the best coaches.

 

[bustaheims]

One thing people seem to like to overlook when it comes to Allaire is that he wasn't just the goalie coach for the parent club, he was the goalie coach for the entire organization. That means he had a hand in Scrivens' and Owuya's impressive seasons in the minors, and he had been working with Reimer before he came up in 10-11 and had the excellent 2nd half with the Leafs that gave us hope in him. He wasn't totally useless.

Obviously, there was some issues there and the team wasn't happy with him/he wasn't happy with the team, but, at the same time, one coach can only do so much and can only get so far with the talent he's been given the opportunity to work with. I highly doubt Allaire was a significant factor in the Leafs' goaltending issues. At the very least, talent and health were more significant factors than he was, never mind team defence, structure, etc. It was obviously time for the two parties to move on, but, let's not try to hang too much of the team's failings on him.

 

[caver]

I have said on many occasions that he was useless but many of you defended him because the team appeared to have his back still.  You couldn't see his style was outdated and ruining promising youngster after promising youngster.  I bet Toskala was still good for a few years had he not been ruined by Allaire. 

I'm sorry to come on here and blast you but many of you lack common sense and the ability to see past public facades.  You can't read between the lines apparently.  It was clear as day that he was useless.  I was afraid that Burke couldn't see it...but luckily it seems he doesn't want to go out a loser quite yet. 

There may be hope yet for Burkie.

Don't worry about your "blast". I'm sure it will be understood by most people for just what it is. This site is for entertainment and friendly discussion. It has members that are casual fans as well as some that are very knowledgeable about hockey. But unless you are in upper management in the NHL I doubt you have any sense that the rest are lacking. Often there are opposing views here but they part of the banter, not a reason to criticize. 

 

[bustaheims]

But it seems to me that mediocre to terrible players - the ones who are only in professional hockey because of a dedication to fundamental hockey and self-sacrifice - are the ones who make the best coaches.

That's true. You can't coach talent or athleticism into someone, and the guys who already have talent  or athleticism often have a hard time imparting their wisdom on others, because, well, it was their talent/athleticism more than their fundamentals/style that got them as far as they went.

 

[Corn Flake]

One thing people seem to like to overlook when it comes to Allaire is that he wasn't just the goalie coach for the parent club, he was the goalie coach for the entire organization. That means he had a hand in Scrivens' and Owuya's impressive seasons in the minors, and he had been working with Reimer before he came up in 10-11 and had the excellent 2nd half with the Leafs that gave us hope in him. He wasn't totally useless.

Obviously, there was some issues there and the team wasn't happy with him/he wasn't happy with the team, but, at the same time, one coach can only do so much and can only get so far with the talent he's been given the opportunity to work with. I highly doubt Allaire was a significant factor in the Leafs' goaltending issues. At the very least, talent and health were more significant factors than he was, never mind team defence, structure, etc. It was obviously time for the two parties to move on, but, let's not try to hang too much of the team's failings on him.

True, and I think the key is that it's not like he was a bad goalie coach - he clearly was able to mold Reimer, Gus and Scrivens pretty well, along with several prominent goalies in the past, but I think what the problem became was being so rigid with the style, NHL level opponents figured out how to beat it and the lack of willingness to adjust meant that he was just going to keep teaching the style/system that had been solved long ago. 

Maybe Allaire's style was good enough to get these guy to where they are but it isn't good enough to work at the NHL level. 

 

[rdowdall]

One thing people seem to like to overlook when it comes to Allaire is that he wasn't just the goalie coach for the parent club, he was the goalie coach for the entire organization. That means he had a hand in Scrivens' and Owuya's impressive seasons in the minors, and he had been working with Reimer before he came up in 10-11 and had the excellent 2nd half with the Leafs that gave us hope in him. He wasn't totally useless.

Obviously, there was some issues there and the team wasn't happy with him/he wasn't happy with the team, but, at the same time, one coach can only do so much and can only get so far with the talent he's been given the opportunity to work with. I highly doubt Allaire was a significant factor in the Leafs' goaltending issues. At the very least, talent and health were more significant factors than he was, never mind team defence, structure, etc. It was obviously time for the two parties to move on, but, let's not try to hang too much of the team's failings on him.

True, and I think the key is that it's not like he was a bad goalie coach - he clearly was able to mold Reimer, Gus and Scrivens pretty well, along with several prominent goalies in the past, but I think what the problem became was being so rigid with the style, NHL level opponents figured out how to beat it and the lack of willingness to adjust meant that he was just going to keep teaching the style/system that had been solved long ago. 

Maybe Allaire's style was good enough to get these guy to where they are but it isn't good enough to work at the NHL level.

Shawn Simpson, ex scout for the Maple Leafs is a host on the Team 1200 these days.  He says that Allaire is pretty rigid when it comes to his style.  Some goalie coaches just build on what goalie already does.  Allaire is not that type of goalie coach.  You play his blocking style.

 

[KW Sluggo]

Nice little cat fight going on now between Allaire & Burke.

 

[Zee]

I wasn't a fan of Allaire after hearing Gustavsson in a post game comment on how "Frankie wouldn't be happy" with the way he saved a certain chance. Instead of relying on the butterfly he used his athleticism to make a save.  The end result was a save so why would the goalie coach have an issue with that?  There must be some truth to the talk that he was inflexible.

By the same token though if he's suddenly so out of touch why did Burke stick with him for 3 years?

 

[Kin]

By the same token though if he's suddenly so out of touch why did Burke stick with him for 3 years?

What are you talking about? We're at war with Francois Allaire and we've always been at war with Francois Allaire. Rick St. Croix is the goalie coach and he's always been the goalie coach.

 

[Zee]

By the same token though if he's suddenly so out of touch why did Burke stick with him for 3 years?

What are you talking about? We're at war with Francois Allaire and we've always been at war with Francois Allaire. Rick St. Croix is the goalie coach and he's always been the goalie coach.

LOL.

Burke's neck is on the line next. He's replaced Wilson and now Allaire, once the new season gets underway in 2014 he better hope for good results or he'll be gone in 4-5 years after that.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

By the same token though if he's suddenly so out of touch why did Burke stick with him for 3 years?

Burke has come to be convinced otherwise whereas he wasn't before?  These are things that evolve over time, there isn't really a moment where one day one style is dominant and the next another, so it could just be he has come to change his opinion on it.

 

[TML fan]

I don't think you make it as far as he did without a firm grasp of the fundamentals. Style is probably the least relevant factor in the makeup of a goalie. Allaire has coached some pretty great goalies, but I wonder if Allaire's success has more to do with them than it does with him.

Well, Hasek's career would suggest that you can go pretty far regardless of how erratic you play. For the record, I don't know what Cujo, or even Hasek, knows about fundamentals, but they didn't really seem to apply them terribly well. Does that make either one of them a bad coach? Not at all. But it seems to me that mediocre to terrible players - the ones who are only in professional hockey because of a dedication to fundamental hockey and self-sacrifice - are the ones who make the best coaches.

I don't think their style had any bearing on their understanding of the position or how to play it.