Game 47: MTL @ TOR - Jan. 21 - 7:00pm - CBC

[bustaheims]

Kulemin is pretty far from invisible in my books.

Same here. He might not be producing as much offensively as I would like, but he's certainly contributing in a number of other ways.

 

[Zee]

Kulemin is pretty far from invisible in my books.

When a player who scored 30 goals one season is on pace for 9 this year, it's very discouraging.  The Leafs were counting on him for at least 25 goals.  Sure he's defensively responsible, makes some nice plays out there, but he's expected to put up points.

 

[Tigger]

Kulemin is pretty far from invisible in my books.

You're so forgiving.

Not really, if he wasn't doing everything but putting up similar numbers to last year I would say so.

 

[Tigger]

Kulemin is pretty far from invisible in my books.

When a player who scored 30 goals one season is on pace for 9 this year, it's very discouraging.  The Leafs were counting on him for at least 25 goals.  Sure he's defensively responsible, makes some nice plays out there, but he's expected to put up points.

So, not really invisible then.

 

[Zee]

Kulemin is pretty far from invisible in my books.

When a player who scored 30 goals one season is on pace for 9 this year, it's very discouraging.  The Leafs were counting on him for at least 25 goals.  Sure he's defensively responsible, makes some nice plays out there, but he's expected to put up points.

So, not really invisible then.

Never said he was, just very disappointing.  If he was putting up points like last season the Leafs would be in better shape today.

 

[Erndog]

Kulemin is pretty far from invisible in my books.

Same here. He might not be producing as much offensively as I would like, but he's certainly contributing in a number of other ways.

lol Yeah, he 'might not be producing as much offensively as you would like' 

How about this?  He's been bad. 

And thats okay.  That happens... will I forgive him and move on?  Absolutely.  Do I think he could be better?  For sure.  Will I go into next season assuming he will bounce back?  For sure!

But god almighty stop freaking sugar coating his play.  He's been crap.  Brutal.  Invisible.  I've watched basically every game this year and you can count on 1 finger how many times I've left a game saying, "Kulemin was very good tonight."  He does nothing.  He chips in, chases, doesn't catch, and leaves.  Rinse, repeat, continue to suck.

I can't for the life of me understand how guys like Dupuis and Kulemin circa 2011-2012 have guys defending them.  I apologize in advance for going off on you Busta, but I just can't take this anymore.  I'm sure at the end of the year if asked Kulemin would gladly come out and say, "I was terrible this year, I have to be better."

 

[Erndog]

Kulemin is pretty far from invisible in my books.

You're so forgiving.

Not really, if he wasn't doing everything but putting up similar numbers to last year I would say so.

So, basically, he's been playing at the level of any good 4th liner.

You're typical 4th liner like Gregory Campbell is essentially in the same boat.

The difference is, Boston expects Campbell to play 6min a night and be their 10 or 11th best forward.  We expected Kulemin to play 16-18 min a night, score ~25 and one one of our top 6. 

 

[Tigger]

Kulemin is pretty far from invisible in my books.

When a player who scored 30 goals one season is on pace for 9 this year, it's very discouraging.  The Leafs were counting on him for at least 25 goals.  Sure he's defensively responsible, makes some nice plays out there, but he's expected to put up points.

So, not really invisible then.

Never said he was, just very disappointing.  If he was putting up points like last season the Leafs would be in better shape today.

Discouraging, disappointing in terms of offensive production sure you'd like to see more but I wouldn't paint his whole game like that, he's been very good in other areas that matter too.

 

[Zee]

Kulemin is pretty far from invisible in my books.

You're so forgiving.

Not really, if he wasn't doing everything but putting up similar numbers to last year I would say so.

So, basically, he's been playing at the level of any good 4th liner.

You're typical 4th liner like Gregory Campbell is essentially in the same boat.

The difference is, Boston expects Campbell to play 6min a night and be their 10 or 11th best forward.  We expected Kulemin to play 16-18 min a night, score ~25 and one one of our top 6.

That's the issue right there.  Kulemin is a 2nd line player but not producing like one.  Sure he can be playing great defensive hockey and "helping out in other ways", but the Leafs need a 2nd line.  MacArthur and Kulemin are not producing like 2nd line players.  Kulemin's ice time is right after Lupul and Kessel for wingers, so it's not like they're not playing him enough.

 

[maplesyrup]

he's been very good in other areas that matter too.

Yes, he's been as good as Crabb in those other areas. 

 

[Erndog]

he's been very good in other areas that matter too.

Yes, he's been as good as Crabb in those other areas. 

Or Mike Brown, or David Steckal.  They've all been about the same in "those other areas."

Whoopdy-friggin-do

 

[maplesyrup]

he's been very good in other areas that matter too.

Yes, he's been as good as Crabb in those other areas. 

Or Mike Brown, or David Steckal.  They've all been about the same in "those other areas."

Whoopdy-friggin-do

Oh, I'm with you Ern... Just yipping over your shoulder. 

 

[Tigger]

Kulemin is pretty far from invisible in my books.

You're so forgiving.

Not really, if he wasn't doing everything but putting up similar numbers to last year I would say so.

So, basically, he's been playing at the level of any good 4th liner.

You're typical 4th liner like Gregory Campbell is essentially in the same boat.

The difference is, Boston expects Campbell to play 6min a night and be their 10 or 11th best forward.  We expected Kulemin to play 16-18 min a night, score ~25 and one one of our top 6.

You want to crap all over him, well feel free but I don't agree with you. Sometimes players have a rough go and need time to sort it out, if his defensive play had disappeared too then I would be really concerned but it hasn't and it's not like the Leafs are the Bruins.

 

[Zee]

Kulemin is pretty far from invisible in my books.

You're so forgiving.

Not really, if he wasn't doing everything but putting up similar numbers to last year I would say so.

So, basically, he's been playing at the level of any good 4th liner.

You're typical 4th liner like Gregory Campbell is essentially in the same boat.

The difference is, Boston expects Campbell to play 6min a night and be their 10 or 11th best forward.  We expected Kulemin to play 16-18 min a night, score ~25 and one one of our top 6.

You want to crap all over him, well feel free but I don't agree with you. Sometimes players have a rough go and need time to sort it out, if his defensive play had disappeared too then I would be really concerned but it hasn't and it's not like the Leafs are the Bruins.

Who knows maybe the few days off during the all star break will be just what he needs. If he gets back on track for the remainder of the schedule it'll go a long way to helping the Leafs make the playoffs.  I haven't given up on him by any stretch, i just know he can bring so much more to the team.

 

[Tigger]

he's been very good in other areas that matter too.

Yes, he's been as good as Crabb in those other areas. 

Or Mike Brown, or David Steckal.  They've all been about the same in "those other areas."

Whoopdy-friggin-do

Uh huh. :

Heck, who even cares about defence anyways.

 

[maplesyrup]

he's been very good in other areas that matter too.

Yes, he's been as good as Crabb in those other areas. 

Or Mike Brown, or David Steckal.  They've all been about the same in "those other areas."

Whoopdy-friggin-do

Uh huh. :

Heck, who even cares about defence anyways.

I  think that we all wanted/previously saw a good two-way guy. One side of his game completely vanished and it sucks. I'm not sure there's anything more to it then that.

 

[Tigger]

The point was that he hasn't been invisible and he's off by what, 10 or 12 points?

The biggest area of concern is his overall shots being down and his shooting percentage being down too, both are somewhat correctable.

He's also getting 2 full less minutes of ice time on average, not that he deserves more but that has an impact too.

 

[Erndog]

he's been very good in other areas that matter too.

Yes, he's been as good as Crabb in those other areas. 

Or Mike Brown, or David Steckal.  They've all been about the same in "those other areas."

Whoopdy-friggin-do

Uh huh. :

Heck, who even cares about defence anyways.

Ugh... he's been no different in the defensive side of things like Dupuis, Crabb, Steckal, Brown or Boyce.  Heck we could call up Zignomanis or Muller and probably get the same effort.

He hasn't separated himself "in those other areas" at all.  You could draw any name out of a hat and get the same level of play "in those other areas."

Kulemin was counted on for much, much more offensively.  Going from 30 goals to probably 9 is about as embarassing as it gets.  Cheechoo-ish.

 

[Erndog]

The point was that he hasn't been invisible and he's off by what, 10 or 12 points?

He hasn't been invisible in the same way that Steckal, Crabb or whoever haven't been invisible.  He gets quite a bit of ice time, of course you're going to see him every now and then!  :-*

In fact, I'd say Crabb has continously outperformed Kulemin game in and game out.

Oh and at the end of the year he's going to be "off" by 20 goals, let alone however many points.

The biggest area of concern is his overall shots being down and his shooting percentage being down too, both are somewhat correctable.

I agree.  He needs to start shooting more. 

Also, remember how fast he looked last year?  He used to blow past guys.  I haven't seen that at all this year (well, he's been invisible so yeah... I haven't seem much of anything save for 1 nice hit against Gaustad).

He's also getting 2 full less minutes of ice time on average, not that he deserves more but that has an impact too.

I'm sure it hasn't helped yeah, but if anything he should be getting less.  Give ice time to the players who are doing things and generally more noticable that Casper-Kulemin.

 

[Tigger]

he's been very good in other areas that matter too.

Yes, he's been as good as Crabb in those other areas. 

Or Mike Brown, or David Steckal.  They've all been about the same in "those other areas."

Whoopdy-friggin-do

Uh huh. :

Heck, who even cares about defence anyways.

Ugh... he's been no different in the defensive side of things like Dupuis, Crabb, Steckal, Brown or Boyce.  Heck we could call up Zignomanis or Muller and probably get the same effort.

He hasn't separated himself "in those other areas" at all.  You could draw any name out of a hat and get the same level of play "in those other areas."

I couldn't disagree more.

Muller?