Morgan Rielly

[bustaheims]

If there's one thing I've learned in my years as a hockey fan, it's that fans tend to have little to no idea of what the trade value of individual players actually are - especially when it comes to prospects/younger players in other organizations. They either become seriously over-valued or seriously under-valued.

 

[Erndog]

Go ahead, mention their names in trade rumours and see what happens.  I'm not saying it's right or wrong, I'm just saying that most people don't look highly on many  of our prospects.

Those are probably the last places I would look to gauge trade value of just about any player, and especially not Leafs prospects, and what Kipper and Doug MacLean think might be even lower on my list.

From people I speak to whom I regard their knowledge and objective opinions highly, Kadri is still regarded as a top end prospect and would conceivably have plenty of value in a trade. Perhaps not as much as some of us with blue chip glasses on all day long might hope, but he is still considered a guy who will be a player.

I'm not really sure why you keep suggesting he has little value, because it simply isn't true.

I am not suggesting he has little value.  In fact, I haven't even stated what I personally think.

I am just stating that nobody thinks our other prospects have value.  No fans, not media scribes, not co-workers, not tv hosts, not beat writers, etc.  Everytime you hear Kadri or Colborne somewhere in trade discussions it's pretty much laughed at at this point.

Again, nothing to do with what I think OR what GM's think.  Just saying that generally speaking these guys are going the way of Jiri Tlusty's value (when we dealt him) on most peoples eyes.

 

[Champ Kind]

Which just means that going forward every single Leafs trade rumour will revolve around either Gardiner and/or Rielly.... cuz nobody else regards our young players/prospects as anything to write home about.

Really?  By most, if not all, accounts, isn't the Leafs' prospect pool in the top half of the league?

You haven't read many other message boards have you?

Guys like Kadri and Colborne have very little trade value in a lot of fans' eyes.  And since I mentioned trade rumours - that's what I was getting at.  Remember the Rick Nash stuff?  I remember everyone saying we didn't have enough (even tv dudes like Kypper, Doug Mclean, etc).

Go ahead, mention their names in trade rumours and see what happens.  I'm not saying it's right or wrong, I'm just saying that most people don't look highly on many  of our prospects.

I'm glad you clarified that you were referring to a group whose opinion you yourself don't put much faith in. 

And no, Ern, I don't visit other message boards.  For the most part, I value and trust the opinions expressed by a good number of posters on this forum. 

 

[Jalili]

Which just means that going forward every single Leafs trade rumour will revolve around either Gardiner and/or Rielly.... cuz nobody else regards our young players/prospects as anything to write home about.

Really?  By most, if not all, accounts, isn't the Leafs' prospect pool in the top half of the league?

It's probably around the middle-of-the-pack. There's 1 blue chipper, 1 likely top 6 forward, and the rest are guys that for the most part every organization has. Which doesn't mean they won't become NHL players, but you have to be conservative to some extent.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Which just means that going forward every single Leafs trade rumour will revolve around either Gardiner and/or Rielly.... cuz nobody else regards our young players/prospects as anything to write home about.

Really?  By most, if not all, accounts, isn't the Leafs' prospect pool in the top half of the league?

It's probably around the middle-of-the-pack. There's 1 blue chipper, 1 likely top 6 forward, and the rest are guys that for the most part every organization has. Which doesn't mean they won't become NHL players, but you have to be conservative to some extent.

That's probably closest to the truth.  This is one listing that has the Leafs at 15th: http://www.hockeyprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1347

Of course, I'm sure some lists would have them higher or lower - but middle of the pack is probably most accurate.

 

[bustaheims]

It's probably around the middle-of-the-pack. There's 1 blue chipper, 1 likely top 6 forward, and the rest are guys that for the most part every organization has. Which doesn't mean they won't become NHL players, but you have to be conservative to some extent.

That's probably fair. There are a number of interesting prospect in the Leafs' system - some with an outside shot of being something special - but, there are really only two guys who are expected to be high-end NHL players.

 

[Redleaf]

Which just means that going forward every single Leafs trade rumour will revolve around either Gardiner and/or Rielly.... cuz nobody else regards our young players/prospects as anything to write home about.

Really?  By most, if not all, accounts, isn't the Leafs' prospect pool in the top half of the league?

It's probably around the middle-of-the-pack. There's 1 blue chipper, 1 likely top 6 forward, and the rest are guys that for the most part every organization has. Which doesn't mean they won't become NHL players, but you have to be conservative to some extent.

That's probably closest to the truth.  This is one listing that has the Leafs at 15th: http://www.hockeyprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1347

Of course, I'm sure some lists would have them higher or lower - but middle of the pack is probably most accurate.

The Leafs prospect pool is certainly deep defensively. Burke now needs a blue chip forward in the system to round it out a bit. I think MacKinnon could fill that role nicely.

 

[The Red Polar Bear]

For the most part, I value and trust the opinions expressed by a good number of posters on this forum.

And there's your first mistake

 

[Champ Kind]

For the most part, I value and trust the opinions expressed by a good number of posters on this forum.

And there's your first mistake

Touche! 

 

[Redleaf]

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/Toronto/2012/11/07/20340106.html

 

[LuncheonMeat]

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/Toronto/2012/11/07/20340106.html

I could see him start the season with the Leafs (if there is a season).  With 20 games under his belt already, he's going to be sharper than most of the guys at camp.  I worry about the possibility, though.  :-\

 

[lamajama]

Well trust the brains behind the Leafs and our luck to ensure they do the wrong thing. He only played - what - 20 games or something last year as an 18 year old?  Absolutely asinine if they even consider it. Bring him to a quick camp maybe for experience but no way no how put him on the team.

 

[LuncheonMeat]

Well trust the brains behind the Leafs and our luck to ensure they do the wrong thing. He only played - what - 20 games or something last year as an 18 year old?  Absolutely asinine if they even consider it. Bring him to a quick camp maybe for experience but no way no how put him on the team.

Perhaps a look for a few games to give him some motiviation, but I think you have to send him back down regardless of how well he plays.

 

[bustaheims]

Perhaps a look for a few games to give him some motiviation, but I think you have to send him back down regardless of how well he plays.

My guess would be, at most, he gets a couple games (if there's a season), but, at the same time, if they've already decided he's going to stay in junior, they might not even bring him to camp. They might decide it's better not to interrupt his season like that.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Read in a Damien Cox piece earlier in the week that Rielly's skating is not even back to what it was prior to his injury.  I have thought his skating looks great in the highlights I've seen, so if that's not even what he could potentially be at, then that's exciting.

I think it's looking less and less like Burke was crazy when he said they had him #1 overall.

 

[ZBBM]

Perhaps a look for a few games to give him some motiviation, but I think you have to send him back down regardless of how well he plays.

My guess would be, at most, he gets a couple games (if there's a season), but, at the same time, if they've already decided he's going to stay in junior, they might not even bring him to camp. They might decide it's better not to interrupt his season like that.

Quite possible.  Anyway, I agree 100% that there is no way he should be considered for a slot on the team right now.  That is so not worth it.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

Read in a Damien Cox piece earlier in the week that Rielly's skating is not even back to what it was prior to his injury.  I have thought his skating looks great in the highlights I've seen, so if that's not even what he could potentially be at, then that's exciting.

I think it's looking less and less like Burke was crazy when he said they had him #1 overall.

But with Cox constantly trying to throw wrenches at Leaf fans to tell them how horrible every decision their management has made is......I wouldn't be surprised that it's just more BS from Cox.

 

[Corn Flake]

Perhaps a look for a few games to give him some motiviation, but I think you have to send him back down regardless of how well he plays.

My guess would be, at most, he gets a couple games (if there's a season), but, at the same time, if they've already decided he's going to stay in junior, they might not even bring him to camp. They might decide it's better not to interrupt his season like that.

I think it will depend on the timing of when camp actually happens, plus the WJC's which he will no doubt be a part of and everything aligning.

If the NHL say breaks camp in the last week of Nov, I could see him attending just so he can get the feel of what pro is like and they can see him with pros as well. 

If he stays up then, well... I'm just going to assplode in frustration.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Read in a Damien Cox piece earlier in the week that Rielly's skating is not even back to what it was prior to his injury.  I have thought his skating looks great in the highlights I've seen, so if that's not even what he could potentially be at, then that's exciting.

I think it's looking less and less like Burke was crazy when he said they had him #1 overall.

But with Cox constantly trying to throw wrenches at Leaf fans to tell them how horrible every decision their management has made is......I wouldn't be surprised that it's just more BS from Cox.

It wasn't his opinion.

Rielly, drafted higher than any Moose Jaw player in team history, still wears a brace, and both Stothers and Millar believe he was a little slow out of the gate this season.

?When I saw him before he got hurt, I couldn?t believe how fast he was,? says Leaf chief scout Dave Morrison, who has seen Rielly only once this season.

?So I believe there?s still a little more there. That injury typically takes a year to heal.?

http://www.thestar.com/sports/leafs/article/1282201--toronto-maple-leafs-morgan-rielly-at-home-in-moose-jaw-cox

 

[OldTimeHockey]

Read in a Damien Cox piece earlier in the week that Rielly's skating is not even back to what it was prior to his injury.  I have thought his skating looks great in the highlights I've seen, so if that's not even what he could potentially be at, then that's exciting.

I think it's looking less and less like Burke was crazy when he said they had him #1 overall.

But with Cox constantly trying to throw wrenches at Leaf fans to tell them how horrible every decision their management has made is......I wouldn't be surprised that it's just more BS from Cox.

It wasn't his opinion.

Rielly, drafted higher than any Moose Jaw player in team history, still wears a brace, and both Stothers and Millar believe he was a little slow out of the gate this season.

?When I saw him before he got hurt, I couldn?t believe how fast he was,? says Leaf chief scout Dave Morrison, who has seen Rielly only once this season.

?So I believe there?s still a little more there. That injury typically takes a year to heal.?

http://www.thestar.com/sports/leafs/article/1282201--toronto-maple-leafs-morgan-rielly-at-home-in-moose-jaw-cox

Imagine that!