Reimer Injury

[Madferret]

Both goalies have struggled to put together a 60 minute performance together...what's really the difference in the age going to make? There isn't a determined age where goalies are either determined a flop, plateaued, what-not. If there ever was a position where age is a wash...it's goaltending.

Who is the best goalie in the league right now?

For a sens fans, you sure do watch alot of Leafs games.

I make no bones about that, but I watch a lot of other team's too - I'm probably the Markham Waxer's second biggest fan.

 

[bustaheims]

I make no bones about that, but I watch a lot of other team's too - I'm probably the Markham Waxer's second biggest fan.

I blame you for the demise of the Thornhill Thunderbirds.

 

[Madferret]

I make no bones about that, but I watch a lot of other team's too - I'm probably the Markham Waxer's second biggest fan.

I blame you for the demise of the Thornhill Thunderbirds.

I'll carry that stone for you - my bad Thornhill.

 

[Joe S.]

Both goalies have struggled to put together a 60 minute performance together...what's really the difference in the age going to make? There isn't a determined age where goalies are either determined a flop, plateaued, what-not. If there ever was a position where age is a wash...it's goaltending.

Who is the best goalie in the league right now?

For a sens fans, you sure do watch alot of Leafs games.

I make no bones about that, but I watch a lot of other team's too - I'm probably the Markham Waxer's second biggest fan.

I'm a fan of the Markham splendid tower glorious warriors.

 

[Madferret]

Both goalies have struggled to put together a 60 minute performance together...what's really the difference in the age going to make? There isn't a determined age where goalies are either determined a flop, plateaued, what-not. If there ever was a position where age is a wash...it's goaltending.

Who is the best goalie in the league right now?

For a sens fans, you sure do watch alot of Leafs games.

I make no bones about that, but I watch a lot of other team's too - I'm probably the Markham Waxer's second biggest fan.

I'm a fan of the Markham splendid tower glorious warriors.

I hear Markham could be a destination for the Phoenix Coyotes.

 

[Bonsixx]

Sports journalism has gone downhill in this town since those men wrote for the Star. Cox is one of the reasons why. He and his paper are as fair game as anyone. And I think the Leafs had a legitimate point in this particular case.

A legitimate point as to what? To be able to dictate who the free media speaks with? I disagree entirely.

The reporter didn't feel the Leafs were being completely open about the issue and went to other sources, then printed the results. Whether it was much more of a story or not doesn't change the fact the reporter had every right to do that and, actually, wouldn't have been doing his job well had he not.

And reporters, especially those in the Toronto media, take plenty of criticism. It comes with the territory. They just usually don't take it as personally as the Leafs apparently have in this regard.

Burke's reaction that if he were editor the reporter came to with the story he would "punch him in the nose" or whatever was borderline retarded. Seems he'd rather the team just issued press releases and was never called upon for anything further. Apparently some fans feel that way too.

The funny thing is, the Leafs have done a admirable job with shutting Reimer down, despite his position as arguably the most important player on a team in a crucial season with regards to management's job stability, but I still don't get why they couldn't just be more forthright with information on his progress. Clearly, people want to know.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Sports journalism has gone downhill in this town since those men wrote for the Star. Cox is one of the reasons why. He and his paper are as fair game as anyone. And I think the Leafs had a legitimate point in this particular case.

A legitimate point as to what? To be able to dictate who the free media speaks with? I disagree entirely.

The reporter didn't feel the Leafs were being completely open about the issue and went to other sources, then printed the results. Whether it was much more of a story or not doesn't change the fact the reporter had every right to do that and, actually, wouldn't have been doing his job well had he not.

And reporters, especially those in the Toronto media, take plenty of criticism. It comes with the territory. They just usually don't take it as personally as the Leafs apparently have in this regard.

Burke's reaction that if he were editor the reporter came to with the story he would "punch him in the nose" or whatever was borderline retarded. Seems he'd rather the team just issued press releases and was never called upon for anything further. Apparently some fans feel that way too.

The funny thing is, the Leafs have done a admirable job with shutting Reimer down, despite his position as arguably the most important player on a team in a crucial season with regards to management's job stability, but I still don't get why they couldn't just be more forthright with information on his progress. Clearly, people want to know.

I'm just going to put this out there:

THEY DON'T HAVE ANY MORE INFO TO GIVE

Why is that so hard to grasp?  They have repeatedly said they have no updates to give, there's no timetable for his return, and it's a situation of him waiting until the symptoms disappear.

It's like the weeks and weeks of Crosby returning talk.  Are they hiding updates on him?  It's the same thing every time they ask - he'll be back when he feels symptom-free and ready.

And if he wouldn't have been doing his job well if he had not called Reimer's mother, than perhaps he's not a very good sports journalist.

Maybe he can hack into Reimer's cell phone and see if there are any updates in there?  Just doing his job better, you know.

And maybe as fans we can just handle not knowing EVERYTHING about a player?  Seriously, unless you have him in a hockey pool and want to know when you can play him again, it really doesn't affect my day.  If I know, great that's obviously better to know, but if I don't know, I'm not freaking out at the Leafs feeling like they failed me and are hiding something.

 

[Kin]

Forgive me if I'm a step or two behind as I haven't followed this story all that closely but did they ever come out and say whether it was whiplash or "concussion-like" symptoms? If not, does that mean that there is no way to tell? Is that valid medically, where they're unable to conclusively diagnose whiplash? What causes concussion like symptoms if not a concussion?

 

[Bonsixx]

Maybe he can hack into Reimer's cell phone and see if there are any updates in there?  Just doing his job better, you know.

And maybe as fans we can just handle not knowing EVERYTHING about a player?  Seriously, unless you have him in a hockey pool and want to know when you can play him again, it really doesn't affect my day.  If I know, great that's obviously better to know, but if I don't know, I'm not freaking out at the Leafs feeling like they failed me and are hiding something.

Calling a player's mother has nothing even remotely to do with hacking a cell phone. So whatever that point was, you lost me.

As to your other point there, I actually agree. As I said, I think the Leafs have handled the injury admirably and have pretty much released as much info as they've needed to, although they were probably a bit unnecessarily cryptic at times and way too stand-offish at others, but that's nothing new when it comes to Wilson, especially.

All I'm saying is, the reporter had every right to seek other avenues for information if he thought there was more to the story. Whether it was worth writing or not can probably only be answered by each individual reader, but there's certainly a fixation - maybe even a starvation - for news, for better or worse, about this hockey team. It's the job of any Leafs beat reporter to fill that.

 

[Bonsixx]

Forgive me if I'm a step or two behind as I haven't followed this story all that closely but did they ever come out and say whether it was whiplash or "concussion-like" symptoms? If not, does that mean that there is no way to tell? Is that valid medically, where they're unable to conclusively diagnose whiplash? What causes concussion like symptoms if not a concussion?

A similar injury happened to a friend of mine who plays professionally and they legitimately couldn't tell whether the symptoms were stemming from whiplash or a concussion.

I know this doesn't answer much but it appears, at least as of a few years ago, even medical professionals struggled to separate the two.

 

[bustaheims]

What causes concussion like symptoms if not a concussion?

His results on the baseline tests put him below the minimum threshold for his injury to be considered a concussion, and the only symptoms we know he's still suffering from are headaches - and, just about any damage to the CNS will cause those, even if the damage isn't to the brain directly.

 

[Kin]

His results on the baseline tests put him below the minimum threshold for his injury to be considered a concussion, and the only symptoms we know he's still suffering from are headaches - and, just about any damage to the CNS will cause those, even if the damage isn't to the brain directly.

Fair enough.

Anyways, I think the journalist was probably within the bounds of acceptable actions by asking Reimer's mother but, being as it's a crime, probably wouldn't be in hacking a phone.

Unless Reimer's mother was really upset by being asked, and based on the quote she gave I think it's fair to say she wasn't, I think we can respect that she's a grown woman who is capable of making the decision of giving a statement to a reporter by herself.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Maybe he can hack into Reimer's cell phone and see if there are any updates in there?  Just doing his job better, you know.

And maybe as fans we can just handle not knowing EVERYTHING about a player?  Seriously, unless you have him in a hockey pool and want to know when you can play him again, it really doesn't affect my day.  If I know, great that's obviously better to know, but if I don't know, I'm not freaking out at the Leafs feeling like they failed me and are hiding something.

Calling a player's mother has nothing even remotely to do with hacking a cell phone. So whatever that point was, you lost me.

It was an example of the lengths the more seedy media members will go to in order to get a story.  Obviously a huge exaggeration in this scenario, but that should be fairly obvious.

I think a Leafs beat reporter should be ashamed if the best they can come up with is a (and it was) terrible, non-newsworthy story from his mother.  I don't understand how, if you're upset about getting a lack of info about an injury, you're going to get more info on it from a woman in Manitoba.  It's basically telling the Leafs that they are being liars.  It would not have been a newsworthy story had people not been upset about it.

It's probably been beat to death at this point, though.

 

[pnjunction]

Reimer 4-0-1
Other goalies 6-6-1
Reimer can't work out without headaches after almost a month

What more is there to know before you start eating anti-depressants like candy

 

[bustaheims]

Anyways, I think the journalist was probably within the bounds of acceptable actions by asking Reimer's mother but, being as it's a crime, probably wouldn't be in hacking a phone.

Unless Reimer's mother was really upset by being asked, and based on the quote she gave I think it's fair to say she wasn't, I think we can respect that she's a grown woman who is capable of making the decision of giving a statement to a reporter by herself.

In terms of journalistic ethics, there's probably no real problem here, but, I can't help but feel like this is tabloid-esque quality journalism here. To me, it's akin to going after the family member of a celebrity to ask for their position on stories that they're not directly involved in. It just kind of left a bad taste in my mouth and, while it may be ethically acceptable, it really doesn't feel right. I mean, he's working for the Star, not TMZ.

 

[bustaheims]

What more is there to know before you start eating anti-depressants like candy

That there's a whole, big world out there with a wide variety of things that are more important than hockey?

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Yeah, just to be clear, I wasn't suggesting calling Reimer's mother is akin to hacking a phone.  You can call my parents and confirm.

 

[Kin]

To me, it's akin to going after the family member of a celebrity to ask for their position on stories that they're not directly involved in.

I think the issue we'd disagree on here is the kind of loaded language inherent in "going after". They didn't, I'm assuming, camp out on her lawn or show up at her favourite restaurant and shove a microphone in her face. It was, I'm pretty sure, a phone call that probably lasted a minute.

I'd think you'd have more of a point if she'd angrily slammed the phone down but clearly she did have something she wanted to say. So long as the reporter identified himself upfront I think it's a little overly sensitive to be taking umbrage that she didn't.

Is it something I'd print? I don't know. I don't think it adds to the story a ton. But it's a fair question to ask provided it's done respectfully and above-board.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Anyways, I think the journalist was probably within the bounds of acceptable actions by asking Reimer's mother but, being as it's a crime, probably wouldn't be in hacking a phone.

Unless Reimer's mother was really upset by being asked, and based on the quote she gave I think it's fair to say she wasn't, I think we can respect that she's a grown woman who is capable of making the decision of giving a statement to a reporter by herself.

In terms of journalistic ethics, there's probably no real problem here, but, I can't help but feel like this is tabloid-esque quality journalism here. To me, it's akin to going after the family member of a celebrity to ask for their position on stories that they're not directly involved in. It just kind of left a bad taste in my mouth and, while it may be ethically acceptable, it really doesn't feel right. I mean, he's working for the Star, not TMZ.

Cox was talking about all these other times the Leafs didn't mind parents/family being talked to, but in my mind, I'm assuming the reporters probably arranged it with the player/team/family beforehand (especially since a reporter visited Reimer's home in the summer), and it was for the purpose of building a biographical story of the player.

This is not to provide 'context' of a story - it is the whole story.  If they want to do that, okay, but the fall out should really be making them feel like they're being a tabloid.  I think that is more insulting than anything else.

 

[Kin]

This is not to provide 'context' of a story - it is the whole story.  If they want to do that, okay, but the fall out should really be making them feel like they're being a tabloid.  I think that is more insulting than anything else.

I think the point Cox is making, and I think it's a fair one, is that if calling her up and asking her "What do you think of how great James has played?" is alright then so is "What have the Leafs told you about his injury?". The capacity to embarrass the Leafs or create controversy for them should largely be irrelevant to a responsible journalist.

Again, provided Mrs. Reimer doesn't mind being asked it's not the Maple Leafs or even James' place to be offended on her behalf.

But journalism fun-fact: Tabloid actually refers to the size of paper used, not standards of journalism.