Round 1: Canadiens (A1) vs. Senators (W1)

[Strangelove]

Yeah I can't stand the way Montreal has played the past few seasons. Team of whiny, diving, gutless players. I can't believe I'm cheering for Ottawa but I am.

 

[Kin]

Well, if someone from Ottawa does end up taking a run at Subban or Price or something...the NHL can fine whoever they want but that'll be on them.

 

[rdowdall]

So here's a scenario that probably won't happen, but I'm bored.

Let's say in game three, something bad happens to the Habs.  The 40% Hab fan base at the game starts throwing down garbage.  The announcement comes on that if the garbage doesn't stop, then the home team is going to get a penalty.  This encourages the Habs fans to throw more garbage on the ice till the Sens get a penalty.  How do you think the league would handle that? 

 

[Deebo]

By a clean hit.

Couldn't disagree more but it was 2 years ago so it's not worth the debate.  That's the beauty of your team actually making the playoffs.

You're the one who started debating it, so don't debate it if its not worth.

Also, don't troll please. There was no reason to take a shot at the Leafs.

 

[L K]

I thought he got slashed on the forearm?

Basically right above where the glove ends it looks like.  But depending on the way his wrist was bent, more of his wrist could have been exposed.  It's hard to really tell for sure.


http://pbs.twimg.com/tweet_video/CCrGEzgVEAAghhi.mp4
http://pbs.twimg.com/tweet_video/CCrFxYxUEAAd2UZ.mp4

He was slashed on the distal forearm.  That is really akin to "the wrist".  Based on purely anatomic definition the wrist is the joint between the carpal bones (where your palm is essentially) and the radius and ulna.  In practical terms a distal radius fracture is considered part of the wrist although in theory you could also refer to it as a forearm fracture.  It just isn't really done that way.

 

[Manson]

You're the one who started debating it, so don't debate it if its not worth.

Also, don't troll please. There was no reason to take a shot at the Leafs.

I didn't start it, MF did.  There was a short exchange because that's all it's worth.

 

[Manson]

So he broke he wrist with a two hander and he was faking it? If that was a Hab the Montreal police would be getting involved.

Sucks if he ends up missing time or his play is significantly affected.  I thought he was totally selling it but I guess not. 

 

[Madferret]

You're the one who started debating it, so don't debate it if its not worth.

Also, don't troll please. There was no reason to take a shot at the Leafs.

I didn't start it, MF did.  There was a short exchange because that's all it's worth.

The Stone chop I'll accept as part of the playoffs - but don't throw me under the bus like a chump!

 

[Bill_Berg]

So here's a scenario that probably won't happen, but I'm bored.

Let's say in game three, something bad happens to the Habs.  The 40% Hab fan base at the game starts throwing down garbage.  The announcement comes on that if the garbage doesn't stop, then the home team is going to get a penalty.  This encourages the Habs fans to throw more garbage on the ice till the Sens get a penalty.  How do you think the league would handle that?

With a wink to Leaf fans.

 

[Manson]

The Stone chop I'll accept as part of the playoffs - but don't throw me under the bus like a chump!

I didn't mean you "started" anything bad.  I just meant you broached the topic, not me, which is totally fine anyway.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

So, am I the only person besides Mason that thinks the slash wasn't that bad? You guys are going to make me stand alone with him?

I mean, penalty sure. Game misconduct/suspension worthy? I don't know about that. An inch higher or lower and he hits equipment and avoids an injury. Subban's aim isn't that good.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Well, if someone from Ottawa does end up taking a run at Subban or Price or something...the NHL can fine whoever they want but that'll be on them.

Has this ever really happened before? I mean aside from the Bertuzzi/Moore thing. It always seems like there's a lot of talk about the next game when something like this happens but it's usually pretty tame. The sens have to know all of the NHL's eyes will be watching this one closely.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

I mean, penalty sure. Game misconduct/suspension worthy? I don't know about that. An inch higher or lower and he hits equipment and avoids an injury. Subban's aim isn't that good.

But that's the whole thing - if he hits the equipment, Stone doesn't have the injury/pain, doesn't go to the room and it's 2:00 (if it's called).  Since the ref obviously thought the slash caused injury to stone, he was obligated to call a 5:00 major for slashing, and once a 5:00 major for slashing it's called it's automatically a game misconduct.

It doesn't really matter how hard the slash was as much as the ref thought there was an injury caused by it so he gave 5 + a game misconduct, as the rules state he should.

With hindsight maybe it wasn't the right call, but the ref doesn't have that luxury.  What if his wrist was badly broken and he didn't return?  Then it would be too light to give 2:00.

I thought this was a good recap by Justin Bourne:

A few bullet points on the slash, before I get to my big picture thoughts:

It?s possible (if not likely) the Habs tried to target Mark Stone to make the game a little more difficult for him.

The drive-by whack-slash by Subban is one you can get away with fairly regularly - this one just happened to land (intentionally or not) between the rookie?s elbow pad and glove cuff, costing him some pain and Subban the game.

Stone coming back to the game doesn?t mean he wasn?t injured. I?ve received that slash, played on with the adrenaline, then had my tendon sheath become inflamed the next day only to need cortisone shots. ?Playing? in the playoffs doesn?t mean ?not injured.?

Maybe the call had to be made, as ex-ref Kerry Fraser was tweeting last night, but five and a game (where the Sens scored two powerplay goals), was more than ample punishment for that slash. More than. So, justice was served.

http://www.thescore.com/nhl/news/739780

 

[CarltonTheBear]

But that's the whole thing - if he hits the equipment, Stone doesn't have the injury/pain, doesn't go to the room and it's 2:00 (if it's called).  Since the ref obviously thought the slash caused injury to stone, he was obligated to call a 5:00 major for slashing, and once a 5:00 major for slashing it's called it's automatically a game misconduct.

It doesn't really matter how hard the slash was as much as the ref thought there was an injury caused by it so he gave 5 + a game misconduct, as the rules state he should.

With hindsight maybe it wasn't the right call, but the ref doesn't have that luxury.  What if his wrist was badly broken and he didn't return?  Then it would be too light to give 2:00.

Ok, I can get behind that. Although I've always hated the idea that a visible injury always brings about a higher penalty (an extra 2 minutes for drawing blood has never made any sense to me, especially since it basically happens at random). The fact that the misconduct was basically an automatic call is something I understand. Although like I said, injury aside that's 2 minutes, maybe a major penalty without the misconduct for attempt to injure.

What I don't get is the people who are out basically calling for Subban's head and saying he should definitely be suspended. The penalty assessed during the game was more than enough punishment already.

 

[Frank E]

So, am I the only person besides Mason that thinks the slash wasn't that bad? You guys are going to make me stand alone with him?

I mean, penalty sure. Game misconduct/suspension worthy? I don't know about that. An inch higher or lower and he hits equipment and avoids an injury. Subban's aim isn't that good.

He broke Stone's wrist with a two-handed slash, and the puck was nowhere around.

That's a suspension man.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

But that's the whole thing - if he hits the equipment, Stone doesn't have the injury/pain, doesn't go to the room and it's 2:00 (if it's called).  Since the ref obviously thought the slash caused injury to stone, he was obligated to call a 5:00 major for slashing, and once a 5:00 major for slashing it's called it's automatically a game misconduct.

It doesn't really matter how hard the slash was as much as the ref thought there was an injury caused by it so he gave 5 + a game misconduct, as the rules state he should.

With hindsight maybe it wasn't the right call, but the ref doesn't have that luxury.  What if his wrist was badly broken and he didn't return?  Then it would be too light to give 2:00.

Ok, I can get behind that. Although I've always hated the idea that a visible injury always brings about a higher penalty (an extra 2 minutes for drawing blood has never made any sense to me, especially since it basically happens at random).

Yeah, I mean it's clearly open to be abused.  But that's the rule (I don't really recall another situation where it's happened but I'm sure it has).  Probably one of those "good in theory, tough in practice" type rules.  Hard for a ref to make a quick judgment on whether an injury occurred (unless it's a very, very obvious situation...and then what is an "injury"..).

Actually just saw DGB has a good summation of it as well that's hard to argue with: http://grantland.com/the-triangle/10-observations-in-the-aftermath-of-the-slash/

Also worth reading for this:

There?s no nice way to put this: There may not be a combination of teams in the league that are any worse suited to handle this kind of situation. Montreal fans and media are obsessed with the team?s history and status, yet weirdly predisposed to view everything through the lens of shadowy conspiracy; Senators fans and media are almost cripplingly insecure about their place in the hockey world and prone to overreact to even the tiniest controversies. That?s an awfully bad pairing for this sort of thing, and if you?re not directly rooting for one of the teams involved in this series, you may want to just check out now. It?s going to get a lot worse before it gets better.

 

[Peter D.]

I'd be more lenient on the slash if Subban didn't choke right up on his stick to whack Stone.  That's just a reckless, dangerous play.

I don't think he should have been suspended, but I didn't at all agree with Mike Johnson who kept going on that it wasn't as bad as it looked.  It was a brutal slash that likely warrants a suspension if it were a 3rd liner who did it.

 

[Kin]

Well, if someone from Ottawa does end up taking a run at Subban or Price or something...the NHL can fine whoever they want but that'll be on them.

Has this ever really happened before? I mean aside from the Bertuzzi/Moore thing. It always seems like there's a lot of talk about the next game when something like this happens but it's usually pretty tame. The sens have to know all of the NHL's eyes will be watching this one closely.

I think it does, we just remember the Bertuzzi one because of the resulting injury. I think that even if you are trying to hurt another player, it's tough. They're also moving around and even the most vicious stick work, think Chris Simon, might not result in a serious injury.

 

[Madferret]

It's definitly time for Ryan to step up and get going - especially if Stone is done (which it sounds like he is).

 

[CarltonTheBear]

It's definitly time for Ryan to step up and get going - especially if Stone is done (which it sounds like he is).

Ryan himself is playing hurt, isn't he?