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The 2012-2013 Toronto Raptors thread: My Name is Jonas

Nice to see the Raps continue their strong play with a win in Washington. The Wizards had been putting up some strong defensive numbers recently so having both Gay and Derozan fill the bucket was nice to see. Of particular note, I thought, was the job Lowry did on John Wall, holding him to a terrible shooting night and a 6-7 assist/turnover ratio.
 
Raptors win a really sloppy, lazy, and uninteresting game in DC. The Bucks also lost, so this improves our standing to 5 games out. Upcoming schedules:

Toronto: Memphis, New York, Washington, @ Cleveland

Milwaukee: Brooklyn, Atlanta, @ Dallas, @ Houston
 
Tough loss for the Raptors tonight. The 5 game winning streak comes to an end.

We?re playing arguably the league?s best defense and Lowry, Gay, and DeRozan all have off nights.  Did we really expect to win that game in that case? I mean, we shouldn?t have had to be relying on Alan Anderson to carry this team back into the game. There was no going back from that awful 1st half this team had, end of story.
 
Justin said:
We?re playing arguably the league?s best defense and Lowry, Gay, and DeRozan all have off nights. 

You do see how those two things are connected, right?
 
Nik Gida said:
Justin said:
We?re playing arguably the league?s best defense and Lowry, Gay, and DeRozan all have off nights. 

You do see how those two things are connected, right?
Obviously, but someone had to step up in order for the Raptors to win this game. Neither of our 3 best players did so.
 
Well, the Raps have a new back-up point guard, dealing Hamed Haddadi and a 2nd round pick for Bassy Telfair.
 
The Raptors lose a very, very disappointing game against the Irvingless Cavaliers tonight. The Cavs are arguably a D-League team without Irving. What does that say about us?

Andrea Bargnani also went 0-for again tonight, which has happened 3 of the last 4 games.

4-21 and only 6 rebounds in Andrea's last 4 games combined.

He's reached Aki Berg levels of hate among Raptors fans. No, he's surpassed Aki Berg.
 
I was at the game tonight, some thoughts:

-Aside from Gay and JV this team didn?t show up tonight. Really disappointed in the all-around effort of this team. Demar looked indifferent, Amir and Lowry weren?t effective, just not a good showing in front of your home fans.

-Lowry?s really starting to piss me off. Between him and JL3 this team doesn?t have an actual ball distributor. 2 assists on the night for Lowry was BRUTAL. He also made one really bad ?look at me? play again tonight. He?s an okay shooter but he just can?t create the plays that Jose was able to. Memphis and Houston both gave up on this guy and I?m starting to understand why.

-Bargnani finally put some points up but he couldn?t get a rebound and he looked silly in the paint on D the whole night. I enjoyed booing him and then giving him the mock cheer when he scored.

-I want to see more Quincy Acy. I?m pretty sure he got the loudest cheers of the night with those dunks.
 
Justin said:
Between him and JL3 this team doesn?t have an actual ball distributor.

That's a pretty big exaggeration based on one game. Lowry is averaging 7.3 assists per 36 minutes and has an Assist% of 33.8. Those aren't Steve Nash numbers but the facts are pretty solid that Lowry has been getting his teammates the ball this year reasonably well despite not playing in a particularly dynamic offense. Combined with his defense he's been a really effective player this year.
 
Nik Gida said:
Justin said:
Between him and JL3 this team doesn?t have an actual ball distributor.

That's a pretty big exaggeration based on one game. Lowry is averaging 7.3 assists per 36 minutes and has an Assist% of 33.8. Those aren't Steve Nash numbers but the facts are pretty solid that Lowry has been getting his teammates the ball this year reasonably well despite not playing in a particularly dynamic offense. Combined with his defense he's been a really effective player this year.
Lowry's no where close to the distributor Calderon was. His 7.3 AST per36 places him 23rd in the league, hardly anything to write home about. He has a "shoot first" mentality. He does have a good shot, but he still has to make room out there and create plays. It's something I'd like to see a lot more of from him. With Calderon gone, we're missing that.
 
Justin said:
His 7.3 AST per36 places him 23rd in the league

Maybe it doesn't make a big difference, but you're including a couple guys with 9 & 6 games played in that ranking, probably need a certain games played cut-off when ranking them.
 
Justin said:
Lowry's no where close to the distributor Calderon was. His 7.3 AST per36 places him 23rd in the league, hardly anything to write home about.

All you're doing is moving the goalposts. That many assists for someone who, in your words, "isn't a ball distributor" and has a "shoot first" mentality is actually pretty good. I'm not saying he's the second coming of John Stockton, just that he's racking up a reasonable amount of assists in addition to the other things he's bringing.

Calderon was a "distributor" because teams weren't afraid of his shot and let him have space. Lowry is someone who teams actually have to be afraid of offensively and, unlike Calderon, can actually hold his weight defensively. You make a big deal about how Memphis and Houston "gave up" on Lowry but what does it say about Calderon's deficiencies that Colangelo has essentially been trying to replace him since he got here? Or that as soon as he was traded Memphis turned around and dealt him for Tayshaun Prince's corpse?

Anyone who's been a Raptors fan over the last few years knows exactly what a team with Calderon at the point will look like. Beyond sloppy defensively and racking up loss after loss. Lowry's not perfect and we'd all love him to be Chris Paul but he works hard, can shoot the ball and is a pretty good playmaker. He's miles better for the team than Calderon was.
 
Potvin29 said:
Maybe it doesn't make a big difference, but you're including a couple guys with 9 & 6 games played in that ranking, probably need a certain games played cut-off when ranking them.

And even just raw assist numbers penalize him for the fact that he's not exactly playing with the most efficient offensive group. His assist rate isn't with guys like Paul and Rondo and so on but it's solidly in a second tier of PG's, right there with guys like Nash and Dragic and Ty Lawson.

Toss in that he's one of the better rebounding guards in the league, the efficient shooting, the defense...Lowry's PER is higher than Rajon Rondo, Steve Nash, Jrue Holiday, Ricky Rubio, Brandon Jennings, Deron Williams, etc, etc.
 
We all know the player Calderon was. Horrible defense, great distribution, a good 3 shooter. Lowry and Calderon have very different styles of play, obviously. I'm just making the point that Calderon was able to create more plays and get more assists than Lowry with this same group. Lowry has got to show more distribution skills moving forward and run the offense more efficiently. It's the facet of Calderon's game that we're missing.
 
Justin said:
I'm just making the point that Calderon was able to create more plays and get more assists than Lowry with this same group.

Sure, but that's a stylistic question, not one of efficiency. Lowry's play is more effective than Calderon's. Saying "Lowry has got to put up assist totals like Calderon" is fine and all but if Lowry was continuing to score the way he is, rebound and defend like he does and was in the top 5 in terms of AST%, he'd basically be Chris Paul. That criticism is basically just saying that he's not an all-star.

It'd be like saying Demar Derozan has to add a three point shot to his game. Essentially you're asking him to be a different and much better player. 

Justin said:
Lowry has got to show more distribution skills moving forward and run the offense more efficiently. It's the facet of Calderon's game that we're missing.

No, it's not a facet the Raptors are missing, it's something they're slightly less good at. Again, Lowry's assist totals, his assist %, are good. Not great but good. They're certainly not so low that they're in and of themselves an impediment to the team being competitive. Lowry's assist numbers are essentially the same as Ty Lawson's and the Nuggets are 38-20 in a much tougher conference.

With Lowry on the floor the Raptors offensive efficiency is 114 points per 100 possessions. As a point of comparison, the Thunder's offensive efficiency rating with Russell Westbrook is 110 per 100, Stephen Curry's is at 114, Deron Williams is at 112. Ty Lawson is at 110 and on and on. The offense, with Lowry on the court, is efficient enough.

You went to a game where Lowry had 2 assists. That'll happen to him on some nights, especially if they're playing him with two wings who aren't much in the way of spot-up shooters. Still, as he proved against the Bucks, he's more than capable of having good assist totals.
 
Bill Simmons, on Rudy Gay:

"Nobody wants to accept that he's a horrific shooter ? repeat: horrific ? who excels at posting up smaller defenders, and that's about it. Math doesn't lie: According to Hoopdata.com, Gay is shooting 25 percent on shots from 16 to 23 feet (the worst percentage of anyone who attempted three-plus shots per game from that range) and 23.3 percent from 3 (the worst percentage of anyone who attempted three-plus 3s per game). In other words, Gay attempts nearly 10 shots per game from more than 15 feet and makes two of them. I stand by 'horrific.'"

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/9030601/the-worst-contracts-nba
 
I don't think anyone was labouring under the impression that Rudy Gay was the second coming of Larry Bird. The things that he does well that the Raptors needed are defense, the ability to create his own shot in crunch time and getting to the rim.
 

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