Training Camp

[Kin]

I understand, but everyone close to the game comments with ideas to that effect, there has to be something to the whole peace of mind theory.

Or it's argumentum ad antiquitatem that's just taken root with some. It's not universal. The Red Wings have frequently gone without a traditional enforcer in their line-up and nobody accuses them of being soft, their star players aren't constantly hurt because players take runs at them and, and I may have to check on this, they've been pretty successful over the last 20 years.

 

[Frank E]

@Frank: ... I just don't get it I suppose ...

Think about it this way...when you go to the bar (went to the bar?), and you've got your eye on this wicked hot blonde, but you're not sure whether or not she's with another guy, or who she came here with, you're more likely to run your game if you came with a few buddies that could take care of things if someone decided to get tough. 

If you came to the bar with a couple of buddies that are more likely to bolt if things got a little rough, you're not nearly as likely to roll the dice and take a run at her. 

 

[Kin]

@Frank: ... I just don't get it I suppose ...

Think about it this way...when you go to the bar (went to the bar?), and you've got your eye on this wicked hot blonde, but you're not sure whether or not she's with another guy, or who she came here with, you're more likely to run your game if you came with a few buddies that could take care of things if someone decided to get tough. 

If you came to the bar with a couple of buddies that are more likely to bolt if things got a little rough, you're not nearly as likely to roll the dice and take a run at her.

Something tells me that metaphor may not help.

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

Wicked hot blonde?

What is this, Good Will Hunting?

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

I think Orr making the team really is more about having guys on the roster who you're alright with sitting in the pressbox.

That's about it.

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

I think Orr making the team really is more about having guys on the roster who you're alright with sitting in the pressbox.

That's about it.

Most definitely, but at times last year Boston took some liberties when they played the Leafs, if Orr can play these types of games and put a stop to that type of thing in some way, then it's a pretty big deal.

I think you'd see that light a fire under the Brown's and Komarov's in terms of ramping up the physicality.

 

[Frank E]

Wicked hot blonde?

What is this, Good Will Hunting?

If that helps my comparison, then yes, this is Good Will Hunting.

Wait, who's the chick in that one?

 

[bustaheims]

If that helps my comparison, then yes, this is Good Will Hunting.

Wait, who's the chick in that one?

Matt Damon.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Most definitely, but at times last year Boston took some liberties when they played the Leafs, if Orr can play these types of games and put a stop to that type of thing in some way, then it's a pretty big deal.

I think you'd see that light a fire under the Brown's and Komarov's in terms of ramping up the physicality.

Don't get me wrong, watching Colton Orr scare Lucic is fun to watch, but his hockey is not very good.

I actually think this team is going to be a bit tougher, regardless of whether Colton plays that night or not. Komisarek, Phaneuf, Brown, Fraser, Komarov and maybe Holzer a bit can probably keep things in check and chances are one of those guys will be on the ice at any given time.

It's a good mix, but with the actual amount of fighting I think there will be this season, Colton will probably not see too much ice, no matter how good of shape he's in.

 

[Frank E]

If that helps my comparison, then yes, this is Good Will Hunting.

Wait, who's the chick in that one?

Matt Damon.

Then yes, it's totally like Good Will Hunting.

I loved him in We Bought a Zoo. 

 

[Kin]

Most definitely, but at times last year Boston took some liberties when they played the Leafs, if Orr can play these types of games and put a stop to that type of thing in some way, then it's a pretty big deal.

But that if is exactly what people are doubting. I don't think Orr's presence is what changes Boston beating the Leafs up, it's about guys like Kessel and Grabo and Lupul being able to fight through it. Team toughness solves that problem, not Orr and Thornton doing the Foxtrot.

 

[Britishbulldog]

I think Orr making the team really is more about having guys on the roster who you're alright with sitting in the pressbox.

That's about it.

Most definitely, but at times last year Boston took some liberties when they played the Leafs, if Orr can play these types of games and put a stop to that type of thing in some way, then it's a pretty big deal.

I think you'd see that light a fire under the Brown's and Komarov's in terms of ramping up the physicality.

That is how I see it as well.  With the Boogey Man gone (RIP), only ex-Bruin Steve MacIntyre is clearly tougher than Orr and Pittsburgh hardly played him.

No one on the Bruins is a tougher fighter than Orr , Shawn Thornton is one of the smartest fighters in the NHL but not a KO guy like Orr.  Chara is strong but not a true fighter either...just ask Chris Neil.

...and yes it does make a difference if you have a top fighter on the bench during a game.  If  you don't agree than I bet you haven't played even Major Junior.  I hope Orr skates hard and hits every opposing player that moves.

 

[Frank E]

Most definitely, but at times last year Boston took some liberties when they played the Leafs, if Orr can play these types of games and put a stop to that type of thing in some way, then it's a pretty big deal.

But that if is exactly what people are doubting. I don't think Orr's presence is what changes Boston beating the Leafs up, it's about guys like Kessel and Grabo and Lupul being able to fight through it. Team toughness solves that problem, not Orr and Thornton doing the Foxtrot.

Not to belabour the point, but we've seen plenty of times where a fight has changed the momentum of a game...there's something there.  Having a guy that can win those fights can be pretty useful.

I'm under no illusion that Orr is a good hockey player, but I think he serves a purpose...maybe less so than 10 years ago, but still. 

 

[Kin]

...and yes it does make a difference if you have a top fighter on the bench during a game.  If  you don't agree than I bet you haven't played even Major Junior.

I confess, I haven't played Major Junior.

That said, I do watch a lot of hockey and I think that if having a top fighter on the bench made a team more likely to win a tough, physical game then teams wouldn't largely sit guys like that in the playoffs where games tend to be the toughest/physicalest.

 

[Kin]

Not to belabour the point, but we've seen plenty of times where a fight has changed the momentum of a game...there's something there.  Having a guy that can win those fights can be pretty useful.

I'd say personally, from my experience watching hockey, that the much heralded "momentum shift" that fights can bring about tends to be a zero-sum gain for the most part.

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

Not to belabour the point, but we've seen plenty of times where a fight has changed the momentum of a game...there's something there.  Having a guy that can win those fights can be pretty useful.

I'd say personally, from my experience watching hockey, that the much heralded "momentum shift" that fights can bring about tends to be a zero-sum gain for the most part.

I think that's the case in these staged fights, but when tempers run high and there is real reason for a fight, sticking up for a teammate after a bad hit etc, it almost definitely helps the team, gives most of the team an extra stride.

 

[Kin]

I think that's the case in these staged fights, but when tempers run high and there is real reason for a fight, sticking up for a teammate after a bad hit etc, it almost definitely helps the team, gives most of the team an extra stride.

That strikes me as a largely different issue though. A guy like Orr, who hardly sees the ice, isn't likely to be the guy who's going to have that "Clark is really nailing McSorley" moment. At best, in a game where something like that takes place, he's really only likely to get in a scrap with someone after the fact and even then only if that player is a guy who'd fight Orr in the first place.

 

[Britishbulldog]

I confess, I haven't played Major Junior.

Neither have I.    ;D

 

[princedpw]

@Frank: ... I just don't get it I suppose ...

Think about it this way...when you go to the bar (went to the bar?), and you've got your eye on this wicked hot blonde, but you're not sure whether or not she's with another guy, or who she came here with, you're more likely to run your game if you came with a few buddies that could take care of things if someone decided to get tough. 

If you came to the bar with a couple of buddies that are more likely to bolt if things got a little rough, you're not nearly as likely to roll the dice and take a run at her.

Something tells me that metaphor may not help.

Tell me more about the guy the hot blonde is with.  He seems like he might be my type.   




(I may have missed your point initially because I was laughing so hard at the kind of situation you imagined I might be in.  All in good fun though.)

 

[princedpw]

...and yes it does make a difference if you have a top fighter on the bench during a game.  If  you don't agree than I bet you haven't played even Major Junior.

I confess, I haven't played Major Junior.

That said, I do watch a lot of hockey and I think that if having a top fighter on the bench made a team more likely to win a tough, physical game then teams wouldn't largely sit guys like that in the playoffs where games tend to be the toughest/physicalest.

... and moreover, the playoffs are the place where injuring (or intimidating) a guy on the other team has the biggest possible payoff -- you'd see the payoff through the whole series ...