We need Cory Schneider

[bustaheims]

I heard Bryan Hayes muse last week that Gardiner plus the high 1st rounder the Leafs are about to secure "might" be enough to get Schneider.  "Might"...?

This might be a reason why Bryan Hayes works in radio instead of for an NHL team. It just might . . .

 

[Deebo]

I don't know how he was doing with Chicago before he went to Europe, but what about Huet?

I think he would be a UFA this summer.

Or is that ridiculous?

 

[maplesyrup]

How close to Schneider would Gardiner on his own get you? 60-70%?

I heard Bryan Hayes muse last week that Gardiner plus the high 1st rounder the Leafs are about to secure "might" be enough to get Schneider.  "Might"...?

Pass... But I'd consider that deal if we're flipping firsts but that again, that's only if I knew there was a couple guys I really liked who I felt was going to be available at the back end of the first round. Also, it goes without saying that I would need to feel I wasn't trading away a potential franchise player with my own pick. 

 

[maplesyrup]

I don't know how he was doing with Chicago before he went to Europe, but what about Huet?

I think he would be a UFA this summer.

Or is that ridiculous?

I don't know. Sounds a wee bit desperate to me.

 

[Corn Flake]

I don't know how he was doing with Chicago before he went to Europe, but what about Huet?

I think he would be a UFA this summer.

Or is that ridiculous?

*Martin Gerber flashback*

 

[Corn Flake]

I don't know how he was doing with Chicago before he went to Europe, but what about Huet?

I think he would be a UFA this summer.

Or is that ridiculous?

I don't know. Sounds a wee bit desperate to me.

As desperate as trading Gardiner sounds?

8)

 

[bustaheims]

I don't know how he was doing with Chicago before he went to Europe, but what about Huet?

I think he would be a UFA this summer.

Or is that ridiculous?

His Sv% that final season in Chicago was bad (.895) and hockeydb doesn't have his European numbers, but . . . I'm not sure I'd call it ridiculous, but, he'd be well down the list in terms of guys I'd be looking at.

 

[maplesyrup]

As desperate as trading Gardiner sounds?

8)

Gotta give to get... know what I mean? Don't get me wrong though, I'm more than happy to keep Gardiner too.

 

[bustaheims]

Pass... But I'd consider that deal if we're flipping firsts but that again, that's only if I knew there was a couple guys I really liked who I felt was going to be available at the back end of the first round. Also, it goes without saying that I would need to feel I wasn't trading away a potential franchise player with my own pick.

Still not even close to tempting for me. If that's the price Vancouver wants to set on Schneider (and, honestly, I doubt even Gillis is stupid enough to expect that much in return), let some other team overpay to acquire him. Gardiner and whoever the Leafs pick up with their 1st rounder + a cheaper goaltending option are going to help the Leafs much more than Schneider and what's likely to be available at the backend of the 1st round.

 

[Erndog]

I'd like to look at Reimer and Scrivens next year,to see who excels...no need to rush to get a Schneider when he hasn't played in the Toronto market yet and could lay an egg trying to be a no.1

Which is part of the reason Vancouver won't get as much for him as people think. Yes, he's highly touted and he's put up very good numbers, but, all he's really shown is that he can play really well for short stretches behind one of the best teams in the league. He certainly wouldn't be the first goalie to go from that to struggling as the starter for a mediocre to bad team (the type of situation he's likely to end up in), and GMs are mindful of that.

This is why I think the Leafs should avoid trying to acquire a goalie who has not yet demonstrated he can consistently backstop a young, up and coming team with a solid body of work to draw from. 

Going with Reimer/Scrivens and spend far less to get a veteran to support them seems more prudent at this stage.  So then the only guesswork is whether they stick with Reimer as the goalie of the future or turn to Scrivens.. or find some crazy way to balance with 3 goalies, which usually never works.

I just think that all acquiring a veteran is going to do is delay the inevitable.  The inevitable being finding a permanent solution in goal.

Say we do get a decent vet, he then gives us 1, maybe 2 decent years (what does Reimer do in the meantime here? play 30-40 games?) then we have to test drive Reimer as a starter ALL over again.  Pass.

I want a potentially elite goalie for the next 10 years.  I want this goalie situation solved.  Getting a veteran just buys more time (and really?  Do we want a Nabokov? A Khabibulan?  Seriously?)... I'd much prefer giving the keys to Schneider and letting the chips fall where they may.  Hey, he may not be the answer but at the very least it's a well calculated risk that has potential for a MASSIVE payoff.  All getting a veteran does is become a stop-gap for a year or two.

 

[maplesyrup]

Pass... But I'd consider that deal if we're flipping firsts but that again, that's only if I knew there was a couple guys I really liked who I felt was going to be available at the back end of the first round. Also, it goes without saying that I would need to feel I wasn't trading away a potential franchise player with my own pick.

Still not even close to tempting for me. If that's the price Vancouver wants to set on Schneider (and, honestly, I doubt even Gillis is stupid enough to expect that much in return), let some other team overpay to acquire him. Gardiner and whoever the Leafs pick up with their 1st rounder + a cheaper goaltending option are going to help the Leafs much more than Schneider and what's likely to be available at the backend of the 1st round.

Again, I'd obviously need to defer to my scouting staff on this idea. You nor I really don't have much of an idea what the talent is actually like.

 

[Kin]

I heard Bryan Hayes muse last week that Gardiner plus the high 1st rounder the Leafs are about to secure "might" be enough to get Schneider.  "Might"...?

It sounds like a lot, I agree but if you're a team like Tampa or NYI and you don't love this year's draft but think Schneider's a legit #1 then you might offer a ton for him.

 

[Corn Flake]

As desperate as trading Gardiner sounds?

8)

Gotta give to get... know what I mean? Don't get me wrong though, I'm more than happy to keep Gardiner too.

I agree with Busty though.. you don't have to give that much.  No way.

You talk about franchise players.. you are considering giving up A possible franchise pick in the top 5 and then giving up Gardiner who has the potential to be within spitting distance of being a franchise player himself. 

That seems like a lot when there are significantly less expensive options out there and when the Leafs have as many as 4 options in the system who could establish themselves as a #1.

 

[maplesyrup]

It sounds like a lot, I agree but if you're a team like Tampa or NYI and you don't love this year's draft but think Schneider's a legit #1 then you might offer a ton for him.

... and that's where I'm kind of at from the Leaf's perspective too.

 

[bustaheims]

Again, I'd obviously need to defer to my scouting staff on this idea. You nor I really don't have much of an idea what the talent is actually like.

It's still just more of the same downward spiral that has the Leafs where they are right now - give up a couple big pieces of the future to plug an immediate hole. Sure, in this case, like with the Kessel deal, it's with a younger guy, but, it's still not the type of move this team should be making when there are cheaper, less expensive options out there that may not be a significant downgrade in terms of talent - especially considering we really have no idea how Schneider would handle being the starting goalie on what is a pretty mediocre Leafs' team. It's much more important that the team focus on improving other areas than it is to take away significant assets from those areas to improve one where the potential solution may already be in the organization (Reimer could bounce back, Scrivens/Rynnas/Owuya might only be a season or two away from starting themselves, etc).

 

[Kin]

It sounds like a lot, I agree but if you're a team like Tampa or NYI and you don't love this year's draft but think Schneider's a legit #1 then you might offer a ton for him.

... and that's where I'm kind of at from the Leaf's perspective too.

But the difference is that if you're NYI then what you're doing there is committing to building around Tavares/Niederreiter/Okposo/Bailey and the same with Tampa with Stamkos/Connolly/Hedman and so on. If the Leafs make that trade they're committing to building around what they have which, to my mind, is nuts.

So I'm just saying that could well be Schneider's price. I think the Leafs would be bonkers to pay it.

 

[maplesyrup]

It's still just more of the same downward spiral that has the Leafs where they are right now - give up a couple big pieces of the future to plug an immediate hole. Sure, in this case, like with the Kessel deal, it's with a younger guy, but, it's still not the type of move this team should be making when there are cheaper, less expensive options out there that may not be a significant downgrade in terms of talent - especially considering we really have no idea how Schneider would handle being the starting goalie on what is a pretty mediocre Leafs' team. It's much more important that the team focus on improving other areas than it is to take away significant assets from those areas to improve one where the potential solution may already be in the organization (Reimer could bounce back, Scrivens/Rynnas/Owuya might only be a season or two away from starting themselves, etc).

I get it. I just can't stomach another year or two of crap goaltending.

 

[Corn Flake]

I just think that all acquiring a veteran is going to do is delay the inevitable.  The inevitable being finding a permanent solution in goal.

Say we do get a decent vet, he then gives us 1, maybe 2 decent years (what does Reimer do in the meantime here? play 30-40 games?) then we have to test drive Reimer as a starter ALL over again.  Pass.

I want a potentially elite goalie for the next 10 years.  I want this goalie situation solved.  Getting a veteran just buys more time (and really?  Do we want a Nabokov? A Khabibulan?  Seriously?)... I'd much prefer giving the keys to Schneider and letting the chips fall where they may.  Hey, he may not be the answer but at the very least it's a well calculated risk that has potential for a MASSIVE payoff.  All getting a veteran does is become a stop-gap for a year or two.

Well I do think what they need is a stop gap and a support guy.  the stop gap buys a bit more time to evaluate the prospects they have, and see if Reimer bounces back. There never is a "permanent" solution in goal.  Of the best ones the Leafs have had in the last 25 years, Potvin was here for only 7 seasons, and arguably only 4 of those were actually really good ones.

No I don't want a Navokov or a Khabbi ... not THAT old ... as suggested, Biron is a good option and Vokoun is another one.  You could trade for a Halak, who wouldn't cost what Schneider would because of the contract. 

I still think Reimer deserves a good chance next year, and he will get it.  Give the kid the off season to fully recover from the head spins and give him a veteran guy to support him.  The Leafs have at least four options in the system starting with Reimer so its not as if they are devoid of goalie prospects.  And we all know they can come out of nowhere at any time. 

I think Schneider and the cost to get him is as much of a risk as putting faith in Reimer taking on 50% of the starts next year along with a veteran... just a different kind of risk.

 

[bustaheims]

I get it. I just can't stomach another year or two of crap goaltending.

It's better than what could easily become another decade of having the rest of the team never quite being good enough. It's a slippery slope.

 

[maplesyrup]

It's better than what could easily become another decade of having the rest of the team never quite being good enough. It's a slippery slope.

Sure... but nothing ventured...