2024 Offseason Thread: Changes

[CarltonTheBear]

I'm actually pretty okay trying Jarnkrok at 3C, considering that's where he played when Nashville went to the Stanley Cup Finals.  In fact, IIRC, I'm pretty sure he was matched up against Crosby for most of that series.

Was curious, so looked this up. Mike Fisher was the centre who actually spent the most amount of time vs. Crosby in that series for Nashville. In about 34 (5-on-5) minutes against Fisher the Pens outscored Nashville 4-1. Jarnkrok spent about 21 (5-on-5) minutes vs. Crosby and the goals were 0-0.

With that said, that was a long, long, time ago now and for whatever reason Jarnkrok seems to have been playing less and less C ever since then. He mostly played wing in his last couple years with Nashville. Played wing with Seattle after they claimed him in the expansion draft. Did go back to C when Calgary/Treliving traded for him at the deadline in 2022. But went back to wing mostly with the Leafs after that.

So it might be fair to say he's best suited for wing at this point in his career. But at the same time the Leafs are obviously kinda desperate. Last season a 19-year old Minten wasn't suited to play 3C. Neither was Kampf. Neither was Domi. Neither was Holmberg. But they all got extended looks at the position despite that. If the Leafs are planning on just repeating that experiment this season then Jarnkrok at least should get thrown into the rotation at some point to try him out.

 

[dappleganger]

It's ok fellas, I got the superb lineup to start next season:

Domi - Matthews - Robertson
Jarnkrok - Nylander - Marner
Knies - Tavares - McMann
Dewar - Kampf - Holmberg


Try Robertson there, give him a real shot. If anything it'll give you a trade chip if he produces to get more serious going into the playoffs.

Ideally you'd want an upgrade on J?rnkrok there, maybe Cowan shows he belongs or you have to move Knies up.

I love the idea of Tavares playing sheltered 3rd line minutes with Knies and McMann. I think they would dominate the ice share of their minutes.

4th line is solid. Good defensive players you could utilize against opposing teams top lines in the defensive zone starts.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

It's ok fellas, I got the superb lineup to start next season:

Domi - Matthews - Robertson
Jarnkrok - Nylander - Marner
Knies - Tavares - McMann
Dewar - Kampf - Holmberg

If I had full control this is (mostly) what I'd do with the top-9. Only change would be doing Knies-Matthews-Domi on the top line and have Robertson/Cowan compete for the LW3 spot. Or if you want to build the Tavares L3 line as one that focuses a little more on defensive match-ups put Jarnkrok there instead.

I know there's lot of people out there thinking that Nylander playing C is a fantasy-land idea, but I mean the teams GM himself literally wanted to see it a year ago. Kinda funny Keefe told him he'd try it out (while semi-interviewing to keep his job) and then just didn't do it. I guess we'll see if Treliving got a coach who actually agrees with him this time.

 

[herman]

I want to see a London Knights chaos line: Cowan - Domi - Marner, but that's mostly just for fun.

Domi-Matthews-Jarnkrok
McMann-Tavares-Marner
Knies-Nylander-Cowan/Robertson*

Matthews naturally has the hardest workload, based on winger strength to carry, but he's paid like he can do it and has shown he can. Other than faceoffs, Nylander actually handled a lot of offensive centre duties when winging for Tavares (high F in OZ), as well as the occasional F3 swingman role.

* 3RW could be Grebyonkin or Tverberg later, or swing Jarnkrok down if someone else clicks with Domi-Matthews; whatever offensively inclined depth forward who can forecheck and make an area pass to the point or the circles.

If Minten looks like he can cut it at C with Nylander carrying the puck moving load, then I'd slot him there with Nylander on the wing.

Either way, if the Cs are all the 11+M guys, that's a better than solid spine for the forward lineup to build around.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

I don't think you want to saddle Matthews with two wingers that struggle to put the puck on his stick. Matthews accounted for 23% of the teams goals. I'm all for trying out different combinations with him, and he should be able to make those around him stronger, but if he's showing any signs of 'not producing', you need to change it quickly.

Ultimately, I am never a big fan of spreading talent around. The balanced attack does not work if there's a boat anchor on your line.

 

[herman]

I don't think you want to saddle Matthews with two wingers that struggle to put the puck on his stick. Matthews accounted for 23% of the teams goals. I'm all for trying out different combinations with him, and he should be able to make those around him stronger, but if he's showing any signs of 'not producing', you need to change it quickly.

Ultimately, I am never a big fan of spreading talent around. The balanced attack does not work if there's a boat anchor on your line.

I wouldn?t characterize Domi as someone who has trouble putting the puck on Matthews? stick. He has other issues, certainly, but that one ain?t it.

 

[herman]

https://twitter.com/dalter/status/1811870845469348160
This kind of draws more attention to the wrong thing than otherwise.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

https://twitter.com/dalter/status/1811870845469348160
This kind of draws more attention to the wrong thing than otherwise.

Nah, f THN. Why did they think this warranted a story? Don't they have any other quotes from others peoples podcasts to steal or instagram photos from Leafs players to repost? That publication is literally being driven into the ground.

 

[Guilt Trip]

https://twitter.com/dalter/status/1811870845469348160
This kind of draws more attention to the wrong thing than otherwise.

Kind of gets the big who cares? Now they can cry about something else about him.

 

[herman]

Nah, f THN. Why did they think this warranted a story? Don't they have any other quotes from others peoples podcasts to steal or instagram photos from Leafs players to repost? That publication is literally being driven into the ground.

Isn?t this the MO of the Score as well?

 

[cw]

McMann (he came up as a center)

I'm not certain this is true. I'm almost 100% sure he never played centre with the Marlies. In general I just don't ever recall hearing that he did and it's somewhat easy to scan through old Marlies line-up notes throughout the years and in every season he played I can only find him lining up on the wing. There aren't as many line-up notes from his NCAA days but again the only ones I can find have him listed as a winger in them.

Also I mean even if he played a bit of C in college, everything about his game just screams winger to me.

He did. But how much I'm not sure. Didn't see them enough.
He centered the 3rd line when he first arrived under coach Moore. Moore increased his usage there. He then bounced to the ECHL and back.

I remember him centering lines with Der-Arguchintsev as one winger, Abramov as another winger on another line and Ellis as a winger on another line. It's been a while so I'm fuzzy. He did some PK too and took some draws.

He was between wing and center at Colgate. How much again, I'm not sure. I also don't know what he did in the ECHL.

He's won 58% of his draws in the NHL - a miniscule sample size. But he's not getting killed in the faceoff circle. His size and strength helps him there.
He likes the middle of the ice. He scores a lot from there and around the net.
He has a defensive conscience - he works in both ends of the ice.
He skates well - one of the faster players on the team so he can cover a bunch of ice defensively.
He has a lot of ingredients to play the position defensively and score some while he's at it - which is a 3C requirement in today's NHL.
The raw attributes seem as good or better than anyone else for that role.

Here's my concern with him in that role: He made progress last year but he still seemed to be figuring out the NHL game mentally. His reads and reaction and where he should be going sometimes seemed a little hesitant or uncertain. I do not recall that when I saw him in the AHL. I saw it more than once last season so I think there is something going on there. It is probably pretty common among call ups and should dissipate with experience. We'll soon find out.

With Marner & Nylander being physical lightweights, there's certainly a case to be made for Knies and McMann to help offset that in the top 6.

I had hoped that Hakanpaa's addition might free up Liljegren to be traded for a 3rd line center. That doesn't look like it is going to happen anytime soon.

I don't think Nylander will ever be interested defensively - his head doesn't seem into it. He doesn't seem into shot blocking or hitting anyone. Jarnkrok has the smarts but doesn't seem as physically strong. Domi is not always mindful with what he does with the puck and for that, seems safer on the wing. Holmberg seems to have his limits. Kampf has proven he isn't up to it. Dewar's a 4th liner. Robertson is having trouble sticking in a NHL lineup. Minten will take time before he can flourish in that role. They all have flaws.

So out of a flawed group, I'd take a look at McMann & Jarnkrok. If one of them could do the job, it would be a heck of a lot easier to add a winger.

 

[Redleaf]

I can?t help but think that with all this Marner-must-go business in the media over the past few months, and heading into next season? What if this is finally the breakout year for the club? What if they win a couple of playoff rounds and the core-four actually deliver the goods?

They finally have what appears to be a decently sound defensive core and a solid goaltending tandem. 

Perhaps just wishful thinking per usual, but the narrative on Marner could do a complete 180 if anything good transpires in next years playoffs.

It wouldn?t surprise me one iota if that happens.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

I can?t help but think that with all this Marner-must-go business in the media over the past few months, and heading into next season? What if this is finally the breakout year for the club? What if they win a couple of playoff rounds and the core-four actually deliver the goods?

They finally have what appears to be a decently sound defensive core and a solid goaltending tandem. 

Perhaps just wishful thinking per usual, but the narrative on Marner could do a complete 180 if anything good transpires in next years playoffs.

It wouldn?t surprise me one iota if that happens.

Did the narrative on Marner not just flip over 1 playoff series? Wasn't he considered by many, unless your name is William 'herman' Nylander, to be a player you wouldn't even consider moving after his 97 point and 99 point seasons? Sports fans are a fickle bunch.

 

[herman]

herman is consistent

 

[OldTimeHockey]

I don't think you want to saddle Matthews with two wingers that struggle to put the puck on his stick. Matthews accounted for 23% of the teams goals. I'm all for trying out different combinations with him, and he should be able to make those around him stronger, but if he's showing any signs of 'not producing', you need to change it quickly.

Ultimately, I am never a big fan of spreading talent around. The balanced attack does not work if there's a boat anchor on your line.

I wouldn?t characterize Domi as someone who has trouble putting the puck on Matthews? stick. He has other issues, certainly, but that one ain?t it.

That's fine and you're probably correct. My point is, don't assume just because Matthews is the best player on the team, doesn't mean that playing with duds won't effect his play.

Like I said, try things out, but don't be afraid of throwing it back into the blender.

 

[herman]

I don't think you want to saddle Matthews with two wingers that struggle to put the puck on his stick. Matthews accounted for 23% of the teams goals. I'm all for trying out different combinations with him, and he should be able to make those around him stronger, but if he's showing any signs of 'not producing', you need to change it quickly.

Ultimately, I am never a big fan of spreading talent around. The balanced attack does not work if there's a boat anchor on your line.

I wouldn?t characterize Domi as someone who has trouble putting the puck on Matthews? stick. He has other issues, certainly, but that one ain?t it.

That's fine and you're probably correct. My point is, don't assume just because Matthews is the best player on the team, doesn't mean that playing with duds won't effect his play.

Like I said, try things out, but don't be afraid of throwing it back into the blender.

Just have to evaluate it on the aggregate. Matthews would be the first to tell everyone it?s not about his individual numbers, and if the configuration means +20G for lines 2 and 3 each at the expense of -10 to his high water mark, I think he?d take it.

In any case, I think we will see a top 9 configuration throughout the season, with a decent amount of juggling. New coach, new approach, new opportunities for something to connect.

 

[dappleganger]

Going off last season's statistics, you get more goals with Domi on Matthews wing, but they give up more goals as well.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

I don't think you want to saddle Matthews with two wingers that struggle to put the puck on his stick. Matthews accounted for 23% of the teams goals. I'm all for trying out different combinations with him, and he should be able to make those around him stronger, but if he's showing any signs of 'not producing', you need to change it quickly.

Ultimately, I am never a big fan of spreading talent around. The balanced attack does not work if there's a boat anchor on your line.

I wouldn?t characterize Domi as someone who has trouble putting the puck on Matthews? stick. He has other issues, certainly, but that one ain?t it.

That's fine and you're probably correct. My point is, don't assume just because Matthews is the best player on the team, doesn't mean that playing with duds won't effect his play.

Like I said, try things out, but don't be afraid of throwing it back into the blender.

Just have to evaluate it on the aggregate. Matthews would be the first to tell everyone it?s not about his individual numbers, and if the configuration means +20G for lines 2 and 3 each at the expense of -10 to his high water mark, I think he?d take it.

In any case, I think we will see a top 9 configuration throughout the season, with a decent amount of juggling. New coach, new approach, new opportunities for something to connect.

I just don't agree that spreading out the wealth equals to more production down the line up. That is all.

 

[herman]

I just don't agree that spreading out the wealth equals to more production down the line up. That is all.

Sheldon Keefe agreed with you! And our cap structure might force the issue as well.

I think for playoff longevity, player energy management throughout the season, and tactical matchup reasons, a spread lineup that can accordion to concentrate firepower situationally is the way to go. Not many top heavy forward teams end up winning it all.

 

[Bender]

I just don't agree that spreading out the wealth equals to more production down the line up. That is all.

Sheldon Keefe agreed with you! And our cap structure might force the issue as well.

I think for playoff longevity, player energy management throughout the season, and tactical matchup reasons, a spread lineup that can accordion to concentrate firepower situationally is the way to go. Not many top heavy forward teams end up winning it all.

We also don't have the luxury of having the best player in the world to which that general thinking may not apply to.