Kings @ Maple Leafs - Oct. 31st, 8:00pm - TSN4, Fan 590

[Bender]

Domi doing stupid nonsense...spend more time playing hockey.  You couldn't be bothered to do anything when the game mattered

There?s a reason Dubas had no interest in Beetuzzi and Domi.

We're revering Dubas' decision making now?

I am, yes.

Because he was so great in 5yrs, right? And always made great evaluations, right? And just because someone doesn't come here, definitely means there wasn't any interest on either side, right? Right.

This is such a bizarro board when players go cold or when the Leafs lose a few.

 

[herman]

Bertuzzi looks better when he doesn't have to deal with whatever Marner is trying to do these days. Historically, his success came alongside Dylan Larkin (LC) and Lucas Raymond (RW) who are both fairly direct and speedy players who carry the puck for the line. Bertuzzi-Matthews-Nylander fits the bill, as Matthews has shown he can adapt to just about any playstyle, and Nylander is Nylander. The key for Bertuzzi key is to just free up pucks into designated areas (back posts, bottom of the faceoff dots, high slot when available).

Domi is supposedly an offensive Kerfoot; what he lacks in off-puck management, he is supposed to have in speedy rush playmaking abilities. Keefe's system generally stresses attacking as a unit, save for the recent addition of springing Nylander, but creating a dedicated rush line would give opponents something different to contend with. Kampf is a decent centre for anchoring a rush line in that he is safe and can spring his wingers, but he doesn't add much offense himself unless the net is emptied. What would be very fun and worth a try is Domi-Kampf-Marner. Marner needs some time just playing N-S hockey to simplify his approach (he can E-W after getting set up in the OZ), and playing zippy hockey with his old London Knights buddy should be fun and silly. All three have pre-existing relationships outside of 5v5 with the Leafs.

Knies-Tavares-Jarnkrok puts a bit of burden on Jarnkrok and Knies to carry the puck through traps, but with a steady diet of OZ starts, they could wear down opponents significantly over the course of a game. They are all extremely annoying, stoic, and heavy players each with disgusting shots.

Gregor-Holmberg-Marlie is what's left. Reaves hasn't been specifically bad, but his lack of footspeed, regardless of his anticipation and instincts, put the Leafs shorthanded when he's on the ice. We really need speed from the 4th line (and throughout the lineup), even if they don't/can't do anything for offense. At this point, I'd even try to get Kapanen back and he's a dumbass.

 

[Arn]

I think Bertuzzi and Domi will probably be fine.

The problem to me is that the bottom 6 is just a mess, primarily by the amount spent on Reaves, who might make great scary videos but is an absolute black hole and, with the amount being spent on him in particular, completely handcuffing the team in what they can do with that bottom 6.

I'd honestly rather have split his salary in half on two younger players or league minimum types who offer penalty killing or speed or some bottom 6 offensive upside.

Then you have way more options to either spread stuff out across 4 lines or just have decent bottom 2 lines.

At the minute we're a 2 line team where only one line is firing.

As for last night, it's a bad sing to lose 4-1 and your goalie to probably be man of the match.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Gregor-Holmberg-Marlie is what's left. Reaves hasn't been specifically bad, but his lack of footspeed, regardless of his anticipation and instincts, put the Leafs shorthanded when he's on the ice. We really need speed from the 4th line (and throughout the lineup), even if they don't/can't do anything for offense. At this point, I'd even try to get Kapanen back and he's a dumbass.

No, he has.

 

[Guilt Trip]

Gregor-Holmberg-Marlie is what's left. Reaves hasn't been specifically bad, but his lack of footspeed, regardless of his anticipation and instincts, put the Leafs shorthanded when he's on the ice. We really need speed from the 4th line (and throughout the lineup), even if they don't/can't do anything for offense. At this point, I'd even try to get Kapanen back and he's a dumbass.

No, he has.

Yup. Great guy and all that but brutal signing.

 

[herman]

https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2023/11/01/game-in-10-maple-leafs-kings-game-9/

10.  William Nylander put five shots on net in this game and was the only Leaf who really created much of anything. John Tavares recorded four shots on net and led Leafs forwards in ice time. Auston Matthews made a few solo attempts but received little support and played 18:43.

Mitch Marner played one less second than Tavares at 19:24 and truly did not accomplish anything. This was a very sensible situation in which to bench him, plain and simple. The fact that he picked up an assist after this game was all but over was honestly infuriating more than anything else. He didn?t deserve the ice time much less the point.

Marner is a lot better than he has played this season, and at some point, he will pop off. In the meantime, he shouldn?t be trotted out without any form of accountability when he is playing well below the expected standard. Apparently, though, #16 is immune to a benching.

 

[herman]

Gregor-Holmberg-Marlie is what's left. Reaves hasn't been specifically bad, but his lack of footspeed, regardless of his anticipation and instincts, put the Leafs shorthanded when he's on the ice. We really need speed from the 4th line (and throughout the lineup), even if they don't/can't do anything for offense. At this point, I'd even try to get Kapanen back and he's a dumbass.

No, he has.

I mean, is he making mistakes, or is he just not able to get involved in the play?

Marner and Domi have been actively bad.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I mean, is he making mistakes, or is he just not able to get involved in the play?

Marner and Domi have been actively bad.

I mean I guess I see what you're saying but the only reason you don't see him making "mistakes" exactly is because he's consistently 3-4-5 steps behind every single play. That's still being "specifically bad".

 

[herman]

I mean, is he making mistakes, or is he just not able to get involved in the play?

Marner and Domi have been actively bad.

I mean I guess I see what you're saying but the only reason you don't see him making "mistakes" exactly is because he's consistently 3-4-5 steps behind every single play. That's still being "specifically bad".

In any case, we're all in agreement he shouldn't be in the top 12 as it is hamstringing the 4th line's ability to function.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

In any case, we're all in agreement he shouldn't be in the top 12 as it is hamstringing the 4th line's ability to function.

I'm praying that Treliving's been a huge Puljujarvi fan while out West and once he's healthy Treliving uses that signing as an excuse to bounce Reaves out. Pool Party aka Finnish Engvall with Kampf on the 4th line would be able to give it a legitimate defensive purpose again.

 

[Guilt Trip]

I mean, is he making mistakes, or is he just not able to get involved in the play?

Marner and Domi have been actively bad.

I mean I guess I see what you're saying but the only reason you don't see him making "mistakes" exactly is because he's consistently 3-4-5 steps behind every single play. That's still being "specifically bad".

In any case, we're all in agreement he shouldn't be in the top 12 as it is hamstringing the 4th line's ability to function.

Agree. And the shine is off Gregor for me as well. Would rather have seen a Marlie there. Steeves Abruzzese type guys.

 

[Joe S.]

Domi doing stupid nonsense...spend more time playing hockey.  You couldn't be bothered to do anything when the game mattered

There?s a reason Dubas had no interest in Beetuzzi and Domi.

We're revering Dubas' decision making now?

I am, yes.

Because he was so great in 5yrs, right? And always made great evaluations, right? And just because someone doesn't come here, definitely means there wasn't any interest on either side, right? Right.

This is such a bizarro board when players go cold or when the Leafs lose a few.

Don?t paint me as one of these knee jerk reaction negative posters. I?m absolutely not one of those people.

My position is that I was never thrilled with the Bertuzzi and domi signings, and so far they?ve done nothing to change my opinion on the signings.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Agree. And the shine is off Gregor for me as well. Would rather have seen a Marlie there. Steeves Abruzzese type guys.

I'm hesitant to judge Gregor too much just because I really think Reaves has been that bad that it's basically impossible for his line mates to succeed. If they wanted a PK guy I'd maybe consider bringing Gambrell up to 4C with Holmberg sliding to the wing instead of Gregor. But like L4 will continue to struggle as long as they're basically playing short-handed at 5-on-5.

 

[Guilt Trip]

Agree. And the shine is off Gregor for me as well. Would rather have seen a Marlie there. Steeves Abruzzese type guys.

I'm hesitant to judge Gregor too much just because I really think Reaves has been that bad that it's basically impossible for his line mates to succeed. If they wanted a PK guy I'd maybe consider bringing Gambrell up to 4C with Holmberg sliding to the wing instead of Gregor. But like L4 will continue to struggle as long as they're basically playing short-handed at 5-on-5.

Agree with Reeves stuff but I just don't see anything in Gregor that we didn't already have. I went to work a few Marlies games last year and liked both Steeves and Abruzzese's games. Hoping they get a shot at some point.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

Domi doing stupid nonsense...spend more time playing hockey.  You couldn't be bothered to do anything when the game mattered

There?s a reason Dubas had no interest in Beetuzzi and Domi.

We're revering Dubas' decision making now?

I am, yes.

Because he was so great in 5yrs, right? And always made great evaluations, right? And just because someone doesn't come here, definitely means there wasn't any interest on either side, right? Right.

This is such a bizarro board when players go cold or when the Leafs lose a few.

No kidding. The team is coming of a 3-1-1 road trip and 1 night later they are complete garbage. Bi-polar at best.

In regards to Dubas, he spent the farm in Pittsburgh and everyone applauded him this summer. Not sure if anyone has looked at their record but the Penguins sit in last place in the Metropolitan, last place in the East and 29th in the NHL. He certainly makes great decisions.

We can criticize Domi and Bertuzzi if we like. We can criticize Treliving's roster decisions in the 5 months he's been here. But come on, 75-85% of this team is of Dubas' decisions. So if we're going to point the finger......

 

[Bender]

Domi doing stupid nonsense...spend more time playing hockey.  You couldn't be bothered to do anything when the game mattered

There?s a reason Dubas had no interest in Beetuzzi and Domi.

We're revering Dubas' decision making now?

I am, yes.

Because he was so great in 5yrs, right? And always made great evaluations, right? And just because someone doesn't come here, definitely means there wasn't any interest on either side, right? Right.

This is such a bizarro board when players go cold or when the Leafs lose a few.

Don?t paint me as one of these knee jerk reaction negative posters. I?m absolutely not one of those people.

My position is that I was never thrilled with the Bertuzzi and domi signings, and so far they?ve done nothing to change my opinion on the signings.

Which is fair, but shoehorning Dubas into that conversation is just odd.

 

[Joe S.]

Domi doing stupid nonsense...spend more time playing hockey.  You couldn't be bothered to do anything when the game mattered

There?s a reason Dubas had no interest in Beetuzzi and Domi.

We're revering Dubas' decision making now?

I am, yes.

Because he was so great in 5yrs, right? And always made great evaluations, right? And just because someone doesn't come here, definitely means there wasn't any interest on either side, right? Right.

This is such a bizarro board when players go cold or when the Leafs lose a few.

Don?t paint me as one of these knee jerk reaction negative posters. I?m absolutely not one of those people.

My position is that I was never thrilled with the Bertuzzi and domi signings, and so far they?ve done nothing to change my opinion on the signings.

Which is fair, but shoehorning Dubas into that conversation is just odd.

I think it goes back to arguments I was having on Twitter last year (I?m not active there anymore) about people pushing for both domi and Bertuzzi, and I felt (without any evidence I guess) that Dubas kind of would target players who also were decent people, and these 2 always struck as a bit of a couple of d-bags.

That?s where I was coming from. Not that I?m pining for Dubas, it was more of a comment around the quality of the players.

And I know that I can?t substantiate any of this, and it looks like I was wrong about him having interest in Bertuzzi.

Anyway I think I?ve incoherently rambled enough.

 

[dappleganger]

You can go through any GM's track record and find good and bad moves. Bottom line is Domi and Bertuzzi have to start justifying their salaries or it's going to be a long season.

 

[Joe S.]

You can go through any GM's track record and find good and bad moves. Bottom line is Domi and Bertuzzi have to start justifying their salaries or it's going to be a long season.

Absolutely true.

But I think the issue is that none of Treliving?s moves so far have looked good, and the Reaves one is just baffling. And in fairness many of us felt that way when the signing happened.

What possessed him to look at Reaves and say ?yeah, this is the kind of player we need for 3 years?. 

 

[rdowdall]

You can go through any GM's track record and find good and bad moves. Bottom line is Domi and Bertuzzi have to start justifying their salaries or it's going to be a long season.

Absolutely true.

But I think the issue is that none of Treliving?s moves so far have looked good, and the Reaves one is just baffling. And in fairness many of us felt that way when the signing happened.

What possessed him to look at Reaves and say ?yeah, this is the kind of player we need for 3 years?. 

Because the narrative on the Leafs is that they are bunch of scared hockey players and they need someone to protect them.  It's a flawed narrative as the Leafs real issue is that the invested heavily in 4 players in a cap system.  The investment is fine because they are all world players and you take what the draft gives you.  But their drafting after the fact and that one of their superstars is not a defenceman causes problems in the playoffs.