Lou Will Not Return

[Zee]

And this is why it was important for Shanahan to name Lou's successor FAST after announcing Lou wouldn't be back as GM.  The fallout from one guy or the other is huge.  There was no waiting around and doing things "by committee" like they had in the past since both parties wanted to know who would be boss.

If he chose Hunter as GM, I'm sure it would have been Dubas leaving today.

Man, this is huge changeover, I hope Dubas is up to the task of running this team.

 

[herman]

And this is why it was important for Shanahan to name Lou's successor FAST after announcing Lou wouldn't be back as GM.  The fallout from one guy or the other is huge.  There was no waiting around and doing things "by committee" like they had in the past since both parties wanted to know who would be boss.

If he chose Hunter as GM, I'm sure it would have been Dubas leaving today.

Man, this is huge changeover, I hope Dubas is up to the task of running this team.

Shanahan's math: Dubas - Lou - Hunter > Hunter - Lou - Dubas

I'm less worried about this today than I was yesterday.

 

[caver]

i don't think losing Lou is a big blow to the Leafs...Hunter definitely had value but no one is irreplaceable...it may be an interesting week..

 

[Highlander]

my gut feeling is Ron Francis may make an appearance.

 

[Guilt Trip]

my gut feeling is Ron Francis may make an appearance.

Could be the case and Gord Miller has said that Chuck Fletcher was an awesome head scout before being GM. Would he take a step down? Who knows, but money talks.

 

[Zee]

The Shanaplan really goes into high gear this summer. 

When he first came on board with the Leafs it seemed like he'd go the more progressive route.  The first summer he's here, Leafs immediately draft for skill in taking Nylander when some people thought they should go for bigger and tougher.  Then he hires Dubas, a young progressive hockey mind, seen as part of the "next wave" of hockey exec.  Then, it seemed like Shanahan took a step back into the more traditional approach by bringing on the older, more traditional hockey guys like Hunter, and finally Lamoriello. 

After 3 years of that regime, it's almost as if Shanahan has decided Dubas was the right move after all, let the young guy fill out his staff, don't worry about losing Lamoriello and Hunter, and move forward.

Was this all part of the plan, or did Shanahan initially want to go the full progressive route, but had second thoughts and brought in the established hockey guys to get a more rounded opinion of how to proceed?  Am I reading too much into this?  Maybe it's just the natural progression, you hire bright minds, and you'll lose bright minds as well since there's only so many top jobs to go around...

 

[herman]

The Shanaplan really goes into high gear this summer. 

When he first came on board with the Leafs it seemed like he'd go the more progressive route.  The first summer he's here, Leafs immediately draft for skill in taking Nylander when some people thought they should go for bigger and tougher.  Then he hires Dubas, a young progressive hockey mind, seen as part of the "next wave" of hockey exec.  Then, it seemed like Shanahan took a step back into the more traditional approach by bringing on the older, more traditional hockey guys like Hunter, and finally Lamoriello. 

After 3 years of that regime, it's almost as if Shanahan has decided Dubas was the right move after all, let the young guy fill out his staff, don't worry about losing Lamoriello and Hunter, and move forward.

Was this all part of the plan, or did Shanahan initially want to go the full progressive route, but had second thoughts and brought in the established hockey guys to get a more rounded opinion of how to proceed?  Am I reading too much into this?  Maybe it's just the natural progression, you hire bright minds, and you'll lose bright minds as well since there's only so many top jobs to go around...

I think it was the plan all along to go with Dubas, but surrounded by a mix of perspectives and smart voices. The 3 year wait to get to this point was partly because there was a lot of analytics backlash around the league, which Shanahan has indirectly quieted as much as he could around the Leafs, and because Babcock and subsequently Lou kind of fell into our laps.

Babcock was a bit like winning the draft lottery (poor Guy Boucher), but he needed to be curated properly or else he'd Glendenning and Cleary all over the place. Dubas and Babcock have a lot of healthy respect for each other's views and I think can do a lot of good together.

 

[sickbeast]

I don?t want to get drawn into a back in forth on this, but is the guy who called someone senile really playing the victim card here?

Dude, my reaction might have been over the top, but why aren?t you holding your hands up and admitting fault here? Is being right on the internet that important to you?

Never mind the fact your comments about Lou were in extremely bad taste, did it cross your mind that many of the posters here probably have older family members dealing with diminished mental faculties?

Your comment was uncalled for and insensitive and your subsequent attempt to play it off as tongue in cheek while you break out your victim schtick is pretty poor form.

Honestly, if you don?t like the place, you know where the door is.

I really meant no offense by it and I do sincerely apologize if it was a bad joke.

And yes, I have generally stayed away from this place.  741 posts in 7 years.

You guys can say I play the victim card, but like I keep saying, I'm not the only one on here that notices the whole "clique" thing.  And it wasn't me that started the thread about it!

And yet, here you are still arguing about it. You got us bud. You really can?t stand this place.
The truth is, you hate it every time your opinion gets challenged. You?d rather exist in an echo chamber, where everyone reinforces your ultra original insights.
Now please spend the next 10 posts telling me how much you hate this place and it is a clique. Also please note my post count and tell me I am part of the clique too. The only clique I?m interested in, is rational intelligent debate. I?m sorry you can?t  be part of that clique.

You call what just happened my opinion getting challenged? I call it a bunch of BS trolling from multiple people. Where was all your outcry when multiple other people on here called Don Cherry senile? Oh wait I forgot, you were just trolling me. Nice try.

 

[Highlander]

Dear Sickbeast,
I usually don't get involved in this sort of thing outside of the odd joust with Nik (and its been a long while since the last joust), however it seems that "Thou do protest to much" and to be honest it is getting stale real quick.
If the heat is to much in this kitchen then leave the room.
A friend of mine had a restaurant and on the menu, it had to no do's: no smoking cigars and no crybabies.

 

[sickbeast]

Dear Sickbeast,
I usually don't get involved in this sort of thing outside of the odd joust with Nik (and its been a long while since the last joust), however it seems that "Thou do protest to much" and to be honest it is getting stale real quick.
If the heat is to much in this kitchen then leave the room.
A friend of mine had a restaurant and on the menu, it had to no do's: no smoking cigars and no crybabies.

That seems to be the general attitude on this forum and it's why you guys keep driving multiple people away from this place. I'm not even a major or regular poster here. Look at my post count.

 

[TimKerr]

Dear Sickbeast,
I usually don't get involved in this sort of thing outside of the odd joust with Nik (and its been a long while since the last joust), however it seems that "Thou do protest to much" and to be honest it is getting stale real quick.
If the heat is to much in this kitchen then leave the room.
A friend of mine had a restaurant and on the menu, it had to no do's: no smoking cigars and no crybabies.

That seems to be the general attitude on this forum and it's why you guys keep driving multiple people away from this place. I'm not even a major or regular poster here. Look at my post count.

Yes, the general attitude on this forum is that you are a crybaby. And how many posts will it take for you to prove to us that you aren't a regular poster here?
Highlander must be part of the clique too.

 

[sickbeast]

Dear Sickbeast,
I usually don't get involved in this sort of thing outside of the odd joust with Nik (and its been a long while since the last joust), however it seems that "Thou do protest to much" and to be honest it is getting stale real quick.
If the heat is to much in this kitchen then leave the room.
A friend of mine had a restaurant and on the menu, it had to no do's: no smoking cigars and no crybabies.

That seems to be the general attitude on this forum and it's why you guys keep driving multiple people away from this place. I'm not even a major or regular poster here. Look at my post count.

Yes, the general attitude on this forum is that you are a crybaby. And how many posts will it take for you to prove to us that you aren't a regular poster here?
Highlander must be part of the clique too.

If you were actually a nice person I would have nothing to complain about.

Is this place even moderated? How is stuff like this allowed to happen?

 

[Bill_Berg]

What's the over/under on beards for opening night?

 

[bustaheims]

If you were actually a nice person I would have nothing to complain about.

Is this place even moderated? How is stuff like this allowed to happen?

Except, your definition of "nice" basically seems to boil down to "doesn't disagree with me or point out when I'm wrong." If everyone was like that, we'd have an echo chamber, not a discussion forum.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

If you were actually a nice person I would have nothing to complain about.

Is this place even moderated? How is stuff like this allowed to happen?

I'm assuming 99% of the posters here are grown adults, I don't feel the need to babysit you people. If you want to have a conversation with people about what's bothering you, I haven't stood in the way in any shape or form.

If you don't like this place, nobody is forcing you to be here. I really don't know what else to say.

 

[sickbeast]

If you were actually a nice person I would have nothing to complain about.

Is this place even moderated? How is stuff like this allowed to happen?

Except, your definition of "nice" basically seems to boil down to "doesn't disagree with me or point out when I'm wrong." If everyone was like that, we'd have an echo chamber, not a discussion forum.

Here's the thing, and this is where I stand on this. Everyone is entitled to an opinion when it comes to the Leafs or anything else people discuss on here. Generally speaking there is no right or wrong outside of the odd comment that is monumentally stupid, which does happen rarely. I'm not saying to agree with everything. All I am saying is you guys should be allowing others to at least have an opinion without blindly disagreeing with them and telling them they are wrong constantly. It is happening all the time on here. I'm really not one to complain, honestly, it's just *really* bad on here. The way you all jumped on my back about my tongue in cheek comment about Lou is just another example, sadly.

 

[Highlander]

Dear Sickbeast,
I usually don't get involved in this sort of thing outside of the odd joust with Nik (and its been a long while since the last joust), however it seems that "Thou do protest to much" and to be honest it is getting stale real quick.
If the heat is to much in this kitchen then leave the room.
A friend of mine had a restaurant and on the menu, it had to no do's: no smoking cigars and no crybabies.

That seems to be the general attitude on this forum and it's why you guys keep driving multiple people away from this place. I'm not even a major or regular poster here. Look at my post count.

Yes, the general attitude on this forum is that you are a crybaby. And how many posts will it take for you to prove to us that you aren't a regular poster here?
Highlander must be part of the clique too.

I would never belong to any club that would have someone like me for a member. Time for Sickbeast to grow a sense of humour or does his moniker have something to do with his inner workings?

 

[sickbeast]

Dear Sickbeast,
I usually don't get involved in this sort of thing outside of the odd joust with Nik (and its been a long while since the last joust), however it seems that "Thou do protest to much" and to be honest it is getting stale real quick.
If the heat is to much in this kitchen then leave the room.
A friend of mine had a restaurant and on the menu, it had to no do's: no smoking cigars and no crybabies.

That seems to be the general attitude on this forum and it's why you guys keep driving multiple people away from this place. I'm not even a major or regular poster here. Look at my post count.

Yes, the general attitude on this forum is that you are a crybaby. And how many posts will it take for you to prove to us that you aren't a regular poster here?
Highlander must be part of the clique too.

I would never belong to any club that would have someone like me for a member. Time for Sickbeast to grow a sense of humour or does his moniker have something to do with his inner workings?

Whatever joke just happened went completely over my head.

 

[bustaheims]

Here's the thing, and this is where I stand on this. Everyone is entitled to an opinion when it comes to the Leafs or anything else people discuss on here. Generally speaking there is no right or wrong outside of the odd comment that is monumentally stupid, which does happen rarely. I'm not saying to agree with everything. All I am saying is you guys should be allowing others to at least have an opinion without blindly disagreeing with them and telling them they are wrong constantly. It is happening all the time on here. I'm really not one to complain, honestly, it's just *really* bad on here. The way you all jumped on my back about my tongue in cheek comment about Lou is just another example, sadly.

That makes for a pretty poor discussion forum. If people can't express their disagreement with the opinions of others, that really takes away the meat of many discussions. Someone disagreeing with you is not an attack on you or your beliefs. Having your opinions challenged helps you to form stronger, more defensible opinions - and that's really the point of having a discussion in the first place.

Also, about the whole tongue-in-cheek thing, I'm going to impart a pretty simple life lesson here - saying something is a joke or a tongue-in-cheek comment doesn't make offensive comments alright. You said something that offended people, and you got rightfully called out on it. You apologized, that was good of you, but then you backtracked and doubled down by claiming it was a joke. If you had just let it go after you apologized initially and ignored any comments that followed, you would have been much better off. You have a lot of trouble letting things go.

 

[sickbeast]

Here's the thing, and this is where I stand on this. Everyone is entitled to an opinion when it comes to the Leafs or anything else people discuss on here. Generally speaking there is no right or wrong outside of the odd comment that is monumentally stupid, which does happen rarely. I'm not saying to agree with everything. All I am saying is you guys should be allowing others to at least have an opinion without blindly disagreeing with them and telling them they are wrong constantly. It is happening all the time on here. I'm really not one to complain, honestly, it's just *really* bad on here. The way you all jumped on my back about my tongue in cheek comment about Lou is just another example, sadly.

That makes for a pretty poor discussion forum. If people can't express their disagreement with the opinions of others, that really takes away the meat of many discussions. Someone disagreeing with you is not an attack on you or your beliefs. Having your opinions challenged helps you to form stronger, more defensible opinions - and that's really the point of having a discussion in the first place.

Also, about the whole tongue-in-cheek thing, I'm going to impart a pretty simple life lesson here - saying something is a joke or a tongue-in-cheek comment doesn't make offensive comments alright. You said something that offended people, and you got rightfully called out on it. You apologized, that was good of you, but then you backtracked and doubled down by claiming it was a joke. If you had just let it go after you apologized initially and ignored any comments that followed, you would have been much better off. You have a lot of trouble letting things go.

The question is, "why me"?

Not the senile idiot.  Not the senile idiot.  You're the senile idiot

This nonsense of hypocrisy on both sides.  Sure, there are massive problems with ALL politicians but this is some next level stuff.  To paraphrase a line that the Trump parrots liked - he's playing 4-D chess.  X, Y, Z and lies.

I just remembered that we are likely going to get some sort of nonsense "Canadians standing for the anthem" crap out of senile Don at the intermission.  Can't wait.......

See, I never bought that story. I always thought that Finger was a relatively young UFA coming off a year where he had pretty decent numbers(in the most superficial categories but still) and that was the sort of thing an old school guy would go for, senile or no.

I think we may be kidding ourselves if we think current GMs wouldn't do the same thing.

Reamer. AHAHAHA, Don Cherry is so senile.

Not one peep about any of these comments.  But then I'm suddenly a horrible person and told to go **** myself when I say the same thing.  Yeah sure, I'm the problem right?  Give your head a shake.