Nonis, Horachek and assistants fired

[moon111]

I believe the Leafs could of done better if they let Kessel do whatever he wanted to.  When they tried to make him into a better player which might mean more wins, but less personal points, Kessel took his ball home.  Kessel's character comes across as just one step below my brother-in-law's.

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

Yes I know the Shannaplan and all but doesn't this just feel like a never ending cycle with this team? It was barely two years ago that Burke was fired and he was supposed to be the saviour.

I do not mean this personally at all, but this sentiment is one I fear being very common in the fan base and the media before very long and it's why I don't really know if there will ever be a full rebuild here.

The media and fans have the potential to get very ugly and it's going to scare a lot of the MLSE board.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Might be more people unemployed by the end of today:

[tweet]587311032827256834[/tweet]
[tweet]587312620090163200[/tweet]

Hopefully Dave Morrison, Steve Kaspar, and Mike Penny (how is he still here) are all among them.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

[tweet]587313877659992065[/tweet]

Speak of the devil! Steve Kaspar fired as well.

 

[Tigger]

Hopefully Dave Morrison, Steve Kaspar, and Mike Penny (how is he still here) are all among them.

The others I get but Morrison not so much, for those that deserve it.

 

[L K]

[tweet]587313877659992065[/tweet]

Speak of the devil! Steve Kaspar fired as well.
[/quote

Professional scouting has been downright awful for the team for years.

 

[mr grieves]

Potvin, To be completely honest, you are right too of course. Nonis absolutely deserved it. Horachek too. He disappointed me. Wasn't any more progressive than RC. As for the assistants they are unfortunately collateral damage

Nonis deserved it. They had to do it in my opinion. But Nonis did get caught up in Burke's retooling fiasco. He kind of didn't get a clean shot to be Leafs GM. I cut him that much slack.

I don't know. Nonis's tenure was a continuation of a retooling that Burke started, which gave the team a core that didn't have a good enough complements of centers or defensemen to go far, but I don't know that Burke would've had the first week of July 2013 that Nonis did.

Here are the hits:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMT5oAdHHfg&feature[/youtube]

 

[CarltonTheBear]

The others I get but Morrison not so much, for those that deserve it.

Meh, he's been with the club since 2004, and has been their director of amateur scouting since 2006. Get some fresh blood in there. His results haven't been anything great.

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

Regarding the scouting firings, I suspect they're letting go those who insist on an eyeballs only approach to scouting.

 

[Joe S.]

I guess this Way Babcock can bring in who he wants.

 

[lamajama]

Shanahan so needs to do a executive discipline video for each firing in the style of his old player discipline videos, complete with slow-motion breakdown of the various offences and relevant prior history of discipline.

How long of a video will people sit through...?

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Professional scouting has been downright awful for the team for years.

Professional scouts are Kasper, Tom Watt, Mike Penny, and Rob Cowie. Tom Watt, who is currently 80 years old, was hired in 2008. Kaspar and Cowie were hired in 2009. Mike Penny has been with the club since 2000. It really boggles my mind how much job security guys like them have.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Regarding the scouting firings, I suspect they're letting go those who insist on an eyeballs only approach to scouting.

From an interview with Kasper conducted by MLHS:

AB: Does the pro scouting staff measure players with anything other than their ?eyeballs?? Does the team use any statistical metrics within their database of players?

SK: No, we are not using a statistical analysis. I am not saying there?s not room for that in the game, but sometimes a player?s contribution does not always show up on a stat sheet. I know a statistical analysis isn?t simply looking at goals and assists, but sometimes a player can play his best game and you don?t see his name anywhere on the scoresheet. My own personal belief is that I like to be there live and see a game myself.

http://mapleleafshotstove.com/2013/08/12/a-quick-interview-with-director-of-pro-scouting-steve-kasper/

 

[lamajama]

I can't believe Mike Penny is (hopefully was) still there. That's a Quinn hire - and Penny
was with Quinn out here in Vancouver - who's drafting record then was atrocious.

I read last week that since "the trade" with Detroit and Phaneuf falling through at the deadline that Phaneuf's attitude went way downhill. Can anyone of you guys closer to Toronto comment on that? 

 

[CarltonTheBear]

[tweet]587320815487684608[/tweet]

Hughes gone as well as Kasper. Would seem that Morrison is safe.

edit: Dreger saying that Rob Cowie is gone too.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I read last week that since "the trade" with Detroit and Phaneuf falling through at the deadline that Phaneuf's attitude went way downhill. Can anyone of you guys closer to Toronto comment on that? 

Kypreos reported that Phaneuf was upset he wasn't traded. Honestly, I'm not really sure how he could comment on that. In the few games/periods I watched since the deadline I actually felt that Phaneuf was playing better hockey than he was earlier in the season.

 

[lamajama]

Do you think Dion wants out then?

 

[L K]

Regarding the scouting firings, I suspect they're letting go those who insist on an eyeballs only approach to scouting.

From an interview with Kasper conducted by MLHS:

AB: Does the pro scouting staff measure players with anything other than their ?eyeballs?? Does the team use any statistical metrics within their database of players?

SK: No, we are not using a statistical analysis. I am not saying there?s not room for that in the game, but sometimes a player?s contribution does not always show up on a stat sheet. I know a statistical analysis isn?t simply looking at goals and assists, but sometimes a player can play his best game and you don?t see his name anywhere on the scoresheet. My own personal belief is that I like to be there live and see a game myself.

http://mapleleafshotstove.com/2013/08/12/a-quick-interview-with-director-of-pro-scouting-steve-kasper/

I do tend to agree with the argument that things get missed when looking at stats independent of context...however that seems kind of like the sort of rudimentary logic you would expect out of a house league parent-coach and not a professional level scout.  It really is mind-numbing that you can have people at the top of your scouting ranks with that kind of mentality.

 

[cw]

Potvin, To be completely honest, you are right too of course. Nonis absolutely deserved it. Horachek too. He disappointed me. Wasn't any more progressive than RC. As for the assistants they are unfortunately collateral damage

Nonis deserved it. They had to do it in my opinion. But Nonis did get caught up in Burke's retooling fiasco. He kind of didn't get a clean shot to be Leafs GM. I cut him that much slack.

I don't know. Nonis's tenure was a continuation of a retooling that Burke started, which gave the team a core that didn't have a good enough complements of centers or defensemen to go far, but I don't know that Burke would've had the first week of July 2013 that Nonis did.

Here are the hits:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMT5oAdHHfg&feature[/youtube]

That 2013 run of transactions - particularly June/July to Dec 2013 run of contracts/moves will probably make many peoples top 10 worst six month stretches in Leafs GM history. So it certainly wasn't all Burke's fault.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Do you think Dion wants out then?

Like most hockey players (or even just people really), I think that he probably wants to be on a team that wants him.