Ontario Election 2018

[CarltonTheBear]

I don't doubt for a second that this played a role too, at least for some people (this tweet's from when Ford won the the PC leadership over Christine Elliott but the same principle applies):

https://twitter.com/JeremyJSchultz/status/972600147606691840

 

[bustaheims]

He had no money allocated to anything, no budget, no numbers, when the voting started. It's still unfathomable to me that someone would vote for him simply on that basis alone. I mean, can anyone be mad if a promise isn't fulfilled? It's their own freaking fault.

In this election, the PCs could basically have run a wet towel on a stick and won. People were too fed up with the Liberals to elect them, and enough of the electorate either can't align with the NDP or still has trust issues from the Rae days. That's really how he won - he was put into a virtual no-lose situation.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

People were too fed up with the Liberals to elect them, and enough of the electorate either can't align with the NDP or still has trust issues from the Rae days.

I really don't know what the NDP does from here. If they couldn't win this election I'm not sure how they can ever expect to win a future one.

 

[Kin]

I really don't know what the NDP does from here. If they couldn't win this election I'm not sure how they can ever expect to win a future one.

Well, I guess looking on the bright side would be that they weren't exactly running a fireball of charisma here.

 

[Bullfrog]

Most people vote with their beliefs rather than brains, and it's clear that most people in Ontario believe in helping themselves more important than helping those in need.

Here's an articulate sample of reasoning from my circle of acquaintances:

I voted PC because I work hard and hope that I will be rewarded by my hard work. I do not wish to be taxed to the poverty line so that the government can give FREE everything to those who do not believe in working for what you want in life, and that EVERYONE can be EQUAL. I have enough of the Liberals reaching into my pay check liberally. I don't want to be robbed by the NDP for another 4 years. Ford may not be the kind of leader I want, but I feel I need to exercise my right, instead of letting others to decide for me. I hope all of those who feel that our vote would not make a difference would just give it a shot.

I am always saddened by the assumption that those that need help need it because they are unwilling to just work a little bit harder.

The lack of understanding of the privilege that wealthy people have is also astounding to me. I had a conversation with a friend who makes close to $150k (plus his wife's $60k). He couldn't seem to understand why his tax rate had to be higher than the average earner. I have very little knowledge of economics, and even I can understand how much easier it is for a wealthy person to gain more wealth compared to a low earner.

 

[Zee]

On the bright side, my brother will finally bring a case of beer over during BBQs with this new buck-a-beer thing.

 

[Andy007]

He had no money allocated to anything, no budget, no numbers, when the voting started. It's still unfathomable to me that someone would vote for him simply on that basis alone. I mean, can anyone be mad if a promise isn't fulfilled? It's their own freaking fault.

In this election, the PCs could basically have run a wet towel on a stick and won. People were too fed up with the Liberals to elect them, and enough of the electorate either can't align with the NDP or still has trust issues from the Rae days. That's really how he won - he was put into a virtual no-lose situation.

I have to imagine that this is a big part of the problem. The NDP platform budgeted for over a billion less spending annually than the Liberals (over a shorter period of time too, if I'm not mistaken) but there were still Liberal voters who felt the NPD was too extreme. I guess I can understand Conservative voters who essentially didn't have a legitimate alternative in this election but I can't understand Liberal voters who would rather vote Liberal than NDP here.

 

[Frank E]

He had no money allocated to anything, no budget, no numbers, when the voting started. It's still unfathomable to me that someone would vote for him simply on that basis alone. I mean, can anyone be mad if a promise isn't fulfilled? It's their own freaking fault.

In this election, the PCs could basically have run a wet towel on a stick and won. People were too fed up with the Liberals to elect them, and enough of the electorate either can't align with the NDP or still has trust issues from the Rae days. That's really how he won - he was put into a virtual no-lose situation.

I have to imagine that this is a big part of the problem. The NDP platform budgeted for over a billion less spending annually than the Liberals (over a shorter period of time too, if I'm not mistaken) but there were still Liberal voters who felt the NPD was too extreme. I guess I can understand Conservative voters who essentially didn't have a legitimate alternative in this election but I can't understand Liberal voters who would rather vote Liberal than NDP here.

The NDP did the whole "tax corporations more, and tax higher income earners more" tactic to funding things, and that's a no-go for many, especially given what Trump is doing on business taxes south of the border.

 

[Bender]

He had no money allocated to anything, no budget, no numbers, when the voting started. It's still unfathomable to me that someone would vote for him simply on that basis alone. I mean, can anyone be mad if a promise isn't fulfilled? It's their own freaking fault.

In this election, the PCs could basically have run a wet towel on a stick and won. People were too fed up with the Liberals to elect them, and enough of the electorate either can't align with the NDP or still has trust issues from the Rae days. That's really how he won - he was put into a virtual no-lose situation.

I have to imagine that this is a big part of the problem. The NDP platform budgeted for over a billion less spending annually than the Liberals (over a shorter period of time too, if I'm not mistaken) but there were still Liberal voters who felt the NPD was too extreme. I guess I can understand Conservative voters who essentially didn't have a legitimate alternative in this election but I can't understand Liberal voters who would rather vote Liberal than NDP here.

Just thinking out loud here,

Would the PC party be that much different if Christine Elliott or Caroline Mulroney were the figurehead? I don't know enough about them or if they had costed platforms going into their leadership races, but it sounds like people wanted to get the Libs out, were afraid of the NDP vote, liked their local PC candidate but don't like the Premier.

 

[Kin]

The NDP did the whole "tax corporations more, and tax higher income earners more" tactic to funding things, and that's a no-go for many, especially given what Trump is doing on business taxes south of the border.

Well, if there's anyone we should be taking cues from...

 

[louisstamos]

In this election, the PCs could basically have run a wet towel on a stick and won. People were too fed up with the Liberals to elect them, and enough of the electorate either can't align with the NDP or still has trust issues from the Rae days. That's really how he won - he was put into a virtual no-lose situation.

I'm not sure this is exactly true.  Remember, pre-scandal Patrick Brown was basically polling just slightly ahead of Wynne.  Statiscally speaking, before an election it was considered a dead heat.  I still strongly believe that considering how quickly the party dropped him that the info about the sexual assault assertions may have come from within the party.  The PCPO weren't really confident in Brown going into a general election.

The brand of populism that Ford spoke of really invigorates his core supporters to their base, emotional instincts.  He really didn't need to release a costed platform - his platform was "I hate Katheen Wynne" and that was enough.  There are sects of every ideology where they actually hate the opposing side more than they like their own, and that's exactly who he was trying to appeal to, and it worked.

 

[hockeyfan1]

Most people vote with their beliefs rather than brains, and it's clear that most people in Ontario believe in helping themselves more important than helping those in need.

Here's an articulate sample of reasoning from my circle of acquaintances:

I voted PC because I work hard and hope that I will be rewarded by my hard work. I do not wish to be taxed to the poverty line so that the government can give FREE everything to those who do not believe in working for what you want in life, and that EVERYONE can be EQUAL. I have enough of the Liberals reaching into my pay check liberally. I don't want to be robbed by the NDP for another 4 years. Ford may not be the kind of leader I want, but I feel I need to exercise my right, instead of letting others to decide for me. I hope all of those who feel that our vote would not make a difference would just give it a shot.

Your point is well-taken.  I voted with my brain, BTW. 

After carefully compartmentalizing each leader's platform, and after Wynne's conceding defeat but urging Ontarians to keep the other two parties from going to extremes (for a minority government of either one), she made more sense than either of Ford or Horwath.

Neither extremism of the right nor the left is appropriate.  I always like to say one extreme leads to another extreme.  Such was the case after Rae's NDP (the next election brought the right-wing Harris), as an example.  And not just limited to the political field.  It can be applied anywhere, etc.

Many people whom I spoke to all had one thing on their minds:  get rid of Wynne and last vestiges of her party.  Anyone but her & the Liberals.  When I responded that a PC party may not be so worthy for this province with their beliefs (under Ford), they taught I would be foolish to not vote for change.

Let's remember one thing:  Kathleen Wynne became premier by default, largely because no one else believed the other party leaders offered anything better.  Many commented about this, and some (media) people were wondering if she could have won on her own merits back then, if she had had true competition in the race for premier at the time.

No one should be truly shocked or surprised of the election results. What is stunning is in how this election wiped the provincial Liberal party off the political map.  Pundits and polls were predicting a potential washout of the Liberal party before Wynne conceded defeat.  It happened worse than anyone could have imagined it.

 

[cabber24]

Huge shoutout to my fellow Guelphites for making history tonight!  ;D

I thought my area of Parrysound Muskoka had a chance for Green but fell short. Congrats! It starts with one.

 

[mr grieves]

Your point is well-taken.  I voted with my brain, BTW. 

After carefully compartmentalizing each leader's platform, and after Wynne's conceding defeat but urging Ontarians to keep the other two parties from going to extremes (for a minority government of either one), she made more sense than either of Ford or Horwath.

Neither extremism of the right nor the left is appropriate.  I always like to say one extreme leads to another extreme.  Such was the case after Rae's NDP (the next election brought the right-wing Harris), as an example.  And not just limited to the political field.  It can be applied anywhere, etc.

Except now your brain has to reconcile the thing you always like to say with the brutal fact of a moderate party being wiped off the political map by (what I gather is) the most right-wing government that Ontario's had in a while. The Liberals seem to have lost as much of their vote as the NDP did in 1995 and nearly as many seats. It's as much a bloodbath, and seems not to have been called into being by starting from one extreme.

 

[princedpw]

I don?t live in Canada any more and don?t keep up with the politics as I should but I?m curious ? what specific policies made the liberals so unpopular?

 

[Bullfrog]

Modern and informative sex ed curriculum, increased minimum wage so people don't have to live in poverty, perceived (and possible) improprieties with Ontario Hydro.

 

[princedpw]

Modern and informative sex ed curriculum, increased minimum wage so people don't have to live in poverty, perceived (and possible) improprieties with Ontario Hydro.

Seriously, people don?t like sex education? (Is that a joke?)

Has the increase in minimum wage led to any adverse consequences for Ontario business? 

 

[Kin]

Seriously, people don?t like sex education? (Is that a joke?)

That can't come as too much of a shock to you. Some people don't want their kids getting realistic information about sex and contraception. After all, if they do, for the first time in recorded history some teenagers will start having sex.

Has the increase in minimum wage led to any adverse consequences for Ontario business?

Horror of horrors, some of them might be paying slightly lower dividends to their shareholders.

 

[Highlander]

Recently moved to BC (yes Bring Cash), no conservative provincial government at all, no right wing choices :'(. 
It was time for a move to the right in Ontario.  Wynne was a complete and utter disaster, power costs out here about half.  Ontario is paying the highest energy costs in N.A.

 

[Kin]

Although I was never much for the Joe Clark-George HW Bush style of conservative politics I will say this for them, they at least represented an ideology where competence in elected officials was still valued.

I would be the first to say that Centrists too often value "charisma" over something more tangible but the response to go running to the dumbest, loudest voice in the room is pretty breath taking for a movement that once prided itself of being the voice of cold, hard rationality.