Where to send Liles??

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Has there been any rumors or news about Liles to be traded? He has been a waste of cash since he got hurt. IMO he needs a change of scenery to prove himself again.

Only Bruce Garrioch...


Another option is doing something, anything, with John-Michael Liles, something Bruce Garrioch says the Leafs have already begun exploring.

    The Leafs have been trying to move D John-Michael Liles with no success. There has been speculation he may be bought out during the window in the new collective bargaining agreement that starts Friday and closes Monday.

 

[Zee]

They really should have used a compliance buyout on Liles and a regular buyout on Komisarek.

 

[louisstamos]

Has there been any rumors or news about Liles to be traded? He has been a waste of cash since he got hurt. IMO he needs a change of scenery to prove himself again.

Not sure. Doesn't seem like there's much of a market for him though.

This is the scary thing - we're talking about the Leafs cap crunch, and how little cap space they have, and how they might not fit in both Kadri and Franson...

But league wide, the Leafs have the 11th most cap space in the entire league.  There are 19 teams with even less cap space than the Leafs have, and are probably trying to fit in their own players.  That probably dries up the market even further.

On top of that, there's his NTC...and I'm not sure how many teams that have cap space would be willing to take Liles that he'd waive to.  St.Louis?  Phoenix?  Colorado?

 

[Jalili]

Has there been any rumors or news about Liles to be traded? He has been a waste of cash since he got hurt. IMO he needs a change of scenery to prove himself again.

Not sure. Doesn't seem like there's much of a market for him though.

This is the scary thing - we're talking about the Leafs cap crunch, and how little cap space they have, and how they might not fit in both Kadri and Franson...

But league wide, the Leafs have the 11th most cap space in the entire league.  There are 19 teams with even less cap space than the Leafs have, and are probably trying to fit in their own players.  That probably dries up the market even further.

On top of that, there's his NTC...and I'm not sure how many teams that have cap space would be willing to take Liles that he'd waive to.  St.Louis?  Phoenix?  Colorado?

I know, just doing a brief look around the league it's hard to make any estimated guesses at who might be interested.

Colorado's the obvious one, but we don't know if they'd want him back, or if their owner is willing to spend more cash.

A few teams that were lacking PMD like NJ and Dallas already signed stopgaps like Gonchar and Zidlicky. And then a team like NYI could use him, but will probably opt to go with a younger unproven guy.

 

[jdh1]

They really should have used a compliance buyout on Liles and a regular buyout on Komisarek.

It looks like that might have been the better route to go...however Nonis might be packaging somebody else as well or a different player all together.It will be interesting how this all shakes out.

 

[Sudafederov]

I think I've worked out the math on Liles

TOR(24Liles + x) = COL(1C + y)

 

[sneakyray]

how about franson and kulemin to NJ for henrique?

I only include franson cause I think that they wouldn't give up henrique for liles...but franson?  Then it leaves ~7 mil to sign kadri and henrique which is doable(maybe?).

 

[Fanatic]

Berger - Looks like #Leafs will use a non-compliance buy-out on John-Michael Liles, though I'm not convinced team can ever have too many defensemen.

I know it is Berger, but he must know something before writing this.

 

[Jalili]

Berger - Looks like #Leafs will use a non-compliance buy-out on John-Michael Liles, though I'm not convinced team can ever have too many defensemen.

I know it is Berger, but he must know something before writing this.

Ouch, that's no good.

If that's the case then they really should've used that last compliance buyout on Liles instead of Komisarek.

 

[Jalili]

I still don't think that's gonna happen though.

The Leafs just may have to retain a bit more of his salary than what we might think is fair.

 

[Redleaf]

Berger - Looks like #Leafs will use a non-compliance buy-out on John-Michael Liles, though I'm not convinced team can ever have too many defensemen.

I know it is Berger, but he must know something before writing this.

Ouch, that's no good.

If that's the case then they really should've used that last compliance buyout on Liles instead of Komisarek.

Hindsight is 20-20. They were probably hoping to get something back in trade for Liles but knew Komisarek wouldnt fetch anything in return.

 

[Jalili]

Berger - Looks like #Leafs will use a non-compliance buy-out on John-Michael Liles, though I'm not convinced team can ever have too many defensemen.

I know it is Berger, but he must know something before writing this.

Ouch, that's no good.

If that's the case then they really should've used that last compliance buyout on Liles instead of Komisarek.

Hindsight is 20-20. They were probably hoping to get something back in trade for Liles but knew Komisarek wouldnt fetch anything in return.

I don't know if I'd agree with the hindsight is 20-20 excuse in this case. That's more appropriate when dealing with something that's unknowable at the time a decision was made, like, which 18 year old to draft in the 6th round or something.

In this case there hasn't really been any surprise that could have been unforeseen.

But I'm still expecting in the end that Leaf management will come up with a better solution than a buyout.

 

[L K]

The Leads really seem to like wasting cap space over and over and over again if they are legitimately buying out Liles.  Having buyouts and hold over salary from trades is the reason tenLeafs are financially in trouble.  Beyond that it just seems like bad asset management to be completely unable to trade Liles even in a partial salary trade off.

 

[bustaheims]

Berger - Looks like #Leafs will use a non-compliance buy-out on John-Michael Liles, though I'm not convinced team can ever have too many defensemen.

I know it is Berger, but he must know something before writing this.

I don't know. I'm not convinced Berger actually has any connections anymore.

 

[Redleaf]

The Leads really seem to like wasting cap space over and over and over again if they are legitimately buying out Liles.  Having buyouts and hold over salary from trades is the reason tenLeafs are financially in trouble.  Beyond that it just seems like bad asset management to be completely unable to trade Liles even in a partial salary trade off.

At Liles cap hit, his age and his declining play, I'm curious as to what people expect in return, if anything.

 

[Frank E]

Berger - Looks like #Leafs will use a non-compliance buy-out on John-Michael Liles, though I'm not convinced team can ever have too many defensemen.

I know it is Berger, but he must know something before writing this.

I don't know. I'm not convinced Berger actually has any connections anymore.

I would hope they could get a bag of pucks for him, but man have the trades been non-existent lately.

 

[bustaheims]

I would hope they could get a bag of pucks for him, but man have the trades been non-existent lately.

Yeah, but that's usually what happens at this point in the summer. Late July and most of August are generally pretty slow.

 

[Kin]

Eh. Berger's not a guy who's at that "He said it so I'm reasonably sure it'll happen" stage.

 

[princedpw]

Berger - Looks like #Leafs will use a non-compliance buy-out on John-Michael Liles, though I'm not convinced team can ever have too many defensemen.

I know it is Berger, but he must know something before writing this.

Ouch, that's no good.

If that's the case then they really should've used that last compliance buyout on Liles instead of Komisarek.

Hindsight is 20-20. They were probably hoping to get something back in trade for Liles but knew Komisarek wouldnt fetch anything in return.

I don't know if I'd agree with the hindsight is 20-20 excuse in this case. That's more appropriate when dealing with something that's unknowable at the time a decision was made, like, which 18 year old to draft in the 6th round or something.

In this case there hasn't really been any surprise that could have been unforeseen.

If there is a buyout like this, it is just plain bad management.  End of story.  There was a time when they had control of their cap.  Management needed to do some calculations ahead of time and/or make some pre-emptive trades early to ensure success.  I've commented in several threads "oh oh, I'm worried, I don't see how the math will work out with realistic salary estimates for Franson, Kadri, Gunnar, Fraser" but a number of people have commented back "don't worry, management knows they are doing.  they must have a plan".  The longer this goes on, the less likely it seems like they have any reasonable plan.  They are just a @#$@$#ing stupid old-boys-club that doesn't know how to use math and science to help them construct a team that has the best possible chance of doing well. 

This is unrelated, but the fact that they are not even collecting data on what is going on during games is completely backwards 16th century kind of thinking.  Collect all the data!  Have 2 guys at every eastern conference game recording every pass made and received by every player, every board battle, every zone entry, everything. Start now so that in 10 years you have more data than everyone else.  This is why google has good maps and apple maps suck.  Maybe you'll find 95% of that data is useless.  Maybe that 5% helps you win 1 more round of the playoffs.  That just got you an extra $10 million or so of playoff revenue and paid for all your data collection efforts.  Maybe it helps you win more than that.  Who knows.  But for the love of god try!!!!  ugh.

/end rant

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Burke signed that deal, so I'm sure Nonis is not too broken up if he has to buyout Liles. He's correcting the cap problem if anything.