Armchair GM 2017-2018

[CarltonTheBear]

Saw an interesting question get raised today on twitter: would anyone here trade Rielly or Gardiner (would probably need to be Rielly) for Dougie Hamilton? The Flames currently have him, Brodie, Hamonic, and Stone (making $3.5mil) as right-handed defencemen. Giordano is their only signed NHL defenceman who is left handed. So there might be some shuffling around there to be done.

Hero charts, for those into that kind of thing:

Hamilton was drafted 9th overall in 2011. He has 4 years left on his contract at $5.75mil.

Rielly was drafted 5th overall in 2012. He has 5 years left on his contract at $5mil.

Our top-4 essentially goes from this:

Rielly-Zaitsev
Gardiner-Hainsey

to this:

Gardiner-Hamilton
Hainsey-Zaitsev

I think that it's somewhat a sideways move at worst. Hamilton's chart obviously is more flattering but there's also the fact that Rielly plays more minutes and probably tougher minutes. Although last season Hamilton did play mostly with Giordano so I'm guessing he was getting the tough assignments too.

In the short term, it makes out top-4 defence a little easier to upgrade since acquiring a left-handed defenceman to replace Hainsey in the new group will probably be easier than finding someone who can bump him out of the RD2 spot in the old group.

In the future, it possibly creates a log jam on the right side of Liljegren becomes the defenceman we hope he'll be, but in that case Zaitsev becomes a nice trade chip.

 

[Coco-puffs]

Saw an interesting question get raised today on twitter: would anyone here trade Rielly or Gardiner (would probably need to be Rielly) for Dougie Hamilton? The Flames currently have him, Brodie, Hamonic, and Stone (making $3.5mil) as right-handed defencemen. Giordano is their only signed NHL defenceman who is left handed. So there might be some shuffling around there to be done.

Hero charts, for those into that kind of thing:

Hamilton was drafted 9th overall in 2011. He has 4 years left on his contract at $5.75mil.

Rielly was drafted 5th overall in 2012. He has 5 years left on his contract at $5mil.

Our top-4 essentially goes from this:

Rielly-Zaitsev
Gardiner-Hainsey

to this:

Gardiner-Hamilton
Hainsey-Zaitsev

I think that it's somewhat a sideways move at worst. Hamilton's chart obviously is more flattering but there's also the fact that Rielly plays more minutes and probably tougher minutes. Although last season Hamilton did play mostly with Giordano so I'm guessing he was getting the tough assignments too.

In the short term, it makes out top-4 defence a little easier to upgrade since acquiring a left-handed defenceman to replace Hainsey in the new group will probably be easier than finding someone who can bump him out of the RD2 spot in the old group.

In the future, it possibly creates a log jam on the right side of Liljegren becomes the defenceman we hope he'll be, but in that case Zaitsev becomes a nice trade chip.

TJ Brodie is left-handed.  He will most likely pair with Hamonic.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

TJ Brodie is left-handed.  He will most likely pair with Hamonic.

Ah, I felt something seemed off about that. Capfriendly has Brodie listed as right defence for some reason.

Still, I wonder if Hamilton might be available regardless, and this just means defence wouldn't be what they'd be shopping him for which is beneficial to us. They brought in Hamonic and Stone and still have Bartkowski on the right side (edit: Bart also shoots left, goddamnit Capfriendly). If they gave Stone $3.5mil and a M-NTC then they might be banking on him playing a top-4 role.

Basically, I just really want Dougie Hamilton.

 

[herman]

More grist for the mill:
2016-2017: Hamilton | Rielly

 

[Coco-puffs]

TJ Brodie is left-handed.  He will most likely pair with Hamonic.

Ah, I felt something seemed off about that. Capfriendly has Brodie listed as right defence for some reason.

Still, I wonder if Hamilton might be available regardless, and this just means defence wouldn't be what they'd be shopping him for which is beneficial to us. They brought in Hamonic and Stone and still have Bartkowski on the right side (edit: Bart also shoots left, goddamnit Capfriendly). If they gave Stone $3.5mil and a M-NTC then they might be banking on him playing a top-4 role.

Basically, I just really want Dougie Hamilton.

Yeah, the Flames D is pretty much set:

Gio - Hamilton
Brodie - Hamonic
Bartkowski - Stone

Not sure if they will give a youngster a shot at the 6/7 D or sign a cheap vet but not much will change there.

I would really like Dougie Hamilton as well, but I don't see him shaking loose for anyone outside our big 3.  I don't think Rielly or Jake get it done (maybe with a 1st round pick?).  And I'm not paying any of those prices. 

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Yeah, the Flames D is pretty much set:

Gio - Hamilton
Brodie - Hamonic
Bartkowski - Stone

Not sure if they will give a youngster a shot at the 6/7 D or sign a cheap vet but not much will change there.

I would really like Dougie Hamilton as well, but I don't see him shaking loose for anyone outside our big 3.  I don't think Rielly or Jake get it done (maybe with a 1st round pick?).  And I'm not paying any of those prices. 

Yeah like I said when they acquired Hamonic, that's one of the best defences in the league now. I just hoped Hamilton might have came loose in those moves. But it's pretty pipe-dreamy. And even if he was available they'd have Gaudreau and Tkachuk already on the left side so our biggest trade piece (JVR) would be of little interest to them (would have taken much more than that but still).  They need right wingers and our big-2 obviously aren't going anywhere. So unless Burke REALLY likes Brown there's nothing to be done.

It's still crazy to me Calgary got Hamilton for just a (mid) 1st and two 2nds.

 

[Kin]

Saw an interesting question get raised today on twitter: would anyone here trade Rielly or Gardiner (would probably need to be Rielly) for Dougie Hamilton? The Flames currently have him, Brodie, Hamonic, and Stone (making $3.5mil) as right-handed defencemen. Giordano is their only signed NHL defenceman who is left handed. So there might be some shuffling around there to be done.

I'd trade Gardiner, probably not Rielly.

 

[Frank E]

I'm trying to appreciate why Calgary would want to do this?

 

[Bates]

Burke just doesn't like or want Hamilton!!!!

I'm trying to appreciate why Calgary would want to do this?

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I'm trying to appreciate why Calgary would want to do this?

Like I said, it really makes sense if you think some of Calgary's defencemen at right handed instead of left handed.

 

[princedpw]

As leafs GM, I would trade Marner for Hamilton tomorrow ...

(I mean, I'd have to do a check on this year's and next year's cap situation to be sure there was a way I could make Hamilton's salary fit, but I'll bet someone creative can make it happen.  We still have a bit more LTR room, but I'm not sure it is quite enough.  If I had to trade Komorov or Brown to some random team for draft picks, because I couldn't fit both Brown/Komorov and Hamilton, I'd do that too.) 

Subbing in Kapanen in place of Marner and adding Hamilton gives us a better overall team, in my opinion. 

Marner is at peak value the next two years due to his contract situation, but after that, if he gets an 7, 8 million contract like some are suggesting then suddenly Hamilton has a significantly more efficient contract (until he gets a raise). 

I don't know Calgary's team very well, but if I were their GM, I doubt I do a straight up Marner for Hamilton swap.  Defensemen seem to be worth significantly more than wingers. 

 

[Bender]

As leafs GM, I would trade Marner for Hamilton tomorrow ...

(I mean, I'd have to do a check on this year's and next year's cap situation to be sure there was a way I could make Hamilton's salary fit, but I'll bet someone creative can make it happen.  We still have a bit more LTR room, but I'm not sure it is quite enough.  If I had to trade Komorov or Brown to some random team for draft picks, because I couldn't fit both Brown/Komorov and Hamilton, I'd do that too.) 

Subbing in Kapanen in place of Marner and adding Hamilton gives us a better overall team, in my opinion. 

Marner is at peak value the next two years due to his contract situation, but after that, if he gets an 7, 8 million contract like some are suggesting then suddenly Hamilton has a significantly more efficient contract (until he gets a raise). 

I don't know Calgary's team very well, but if I were their GM, I doubt I do a straight up Marner for Hamilton swap.  Defensemen seem to be worth significantly more than wingers.

The crazy thing is both Billy Ny and Marner are convertable C/W

 

[herman]

The crazy thing is both Billy Ny and Marner are convertable C/W

Convince me, please.

 

[WAYNEINIONA]

As leafs GM, I would trade Marner for Hamilton tomorrow ...

(I mean, I'd have to do a check on this year's and next year's cap situation to be sure there was a way I could make Hamilton's salary fit, but I'll bet someone creative can make it happen.  We still have a bit more LTR room, but I'm not sure it is quite enough.  If I had to trade Komorov or Brown to some random team for draft picks, because I couldn't fit both Brown/Komorov and Hamilton, I'd do that too.) 

Subbing in Kapanen in place of Marner and adding Hamilton gives us a better overall team, in my opinion. 

Marner is at peak value the next two years due to his contract situation, but after that, if he gets an 7, 8 million contract like some are suggesting then suddenly Hamilton has a significantly more efficient contract (until he gets a raise). 

I don't know Calgary's team very well, but if I were their GM, I doubt I do a straight up Marner for Hamilton swap.  Defensemen seem to be worth significantly more than wingers.

No way I would make that trade. Hamilton is a third pairing D man at best.

 

[herman]

No way I would make that trade. Hamilton is a third pairing D man at best.

Okay, your turn to convince me of this assertion.

 

[WAYNEINIONA]

I watched at least 30 Flames games last year and was not impressed. I also have read the comments concerning Hamilton's play on the Calgary fan site. My statement was my opinion only. You have the right to yours as well.

 

[herman]

I watched at least 30 Flames games last year and was not impressed. I also have read the comments concerning Hamilton's play on the Calgary fan site. My statement was my opinion only. You have the right to yours as well.

I'd like to know more about what you saw in Hamilton (flaws and all), especially now that I know you had eyeballs on him. Something more substantial than asserting opinions would be nice, being the off-season and all.

For example, how is he on break outs? Is he merely a passenger to Giordano? Does he handle the puck patiently or like Polak? Shot: dangerous? or dangerous to teammates?

 

[Bender]

The crazy thing is both Billy Ny and Marner are convertable C/W

Convince me, please.

They both played both positions in their careers. Marner iirc believed he would be deployed at centre as well when in training camp. Kadri also started on wing for Leafs.

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[Kin]

They both played both positions in their careers. Marner iirc believed he would be deployed at centre as well when in training camp. Kadri also started on wing for Leafs.

Was Marner ever primarily used as a C in London even?

 

[herman]

They both played both positions in their careers. Marner iirc believed he would be deployed at centre as well when in training camp. Kadri also started on wing for Leafs.

Was Marner ever primarily used as a C in London even?

Bender is absolutely right that Marner and the Leafs intended him to play centre. He played wing that development camp to Trevor Moore, if memory serves. Then they drafted Matthews.

He was used in that spot for about a week in his D+1, if I recall correctly (L K?), and they promptly formed the Tkachuk - Dvorak - Marner line and tore up the league.

Edit: more like two months off and on. Prior to WJs, Canada's coach commented that he liked how Marner had played Centre this year, giving him some flexibility, even though he earmarked him for RW to Strome. Praise for Marner was oddly couched: Hunter said he was winning more than 50% of his faceoffs, and teammate Victor Mete said, yeah he'll be good if he has a few more years playing centre. http://www.lfpress.com/2015/10/21/london-knight-mitch-marner-likely-to-play-wing-during-canada-russia-series

Asked midway through this past season if Nylander and Marner were slated for Centre, Babcock emphatically said yes for Nylander, and tersely said no for Marner. He later walked the Nylander comment back in the offseason so as not to tank Bozak's trade value. http://www.toronto24hours.ca/2017/02/02/maple-leafs-coach-babock-sees-nylander-as-centre

Having watched them both play all season, Marner is better on the wing. He's the better playmaker and more defensively responsible player than others on his line, but he's too aggressive and crafty on the boards to play him down the middle. Especially when the options for top-9 are Matthews, Kadri, Bozak, and Nylander.