Kadri "made available" -according to 2 teams

[Corn Flake]

Does anyone still believe Kadri can become a #1 centre?

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

I'm not quite sure why Ryan O'Reilly gets so much praise.  He's definitely a better defensive player than Kadri, but Kadri's "bad" season is 27 points in 45 games.  O'Reilly has 31 points in 44 games.  O'Reilly doesn't hit anything and has an unsustainable 14.5% shooting percentage this year (career 10%).  He's also been moved from center to play the wing this year.

I'd love to acquire O'Reilly but I feel like this would be more trading laterally and not really improving the team long-term.

You might be right on the lateral part of the deal, but O'Rielly is only 22, so you can continue to mold him. Where's his ceiling?

Also, I don't think people are heaping much praise on him, only that he's a player that might work for us, as opposed to a pending UFA in any trade for Kadri. I'd be pissed if we didn't get equal or better value for Kadri, especially in the age department.

 

[Strangelove]

Does anyone still believe Kadri can become a #1 centre?

What does that have to do with anything? Do I think he can be better than Bozak at both ends of the ice?  Yes.  But that's irrelevant as well.

 

[bustaheims]

I'm not quite sure why Ryan O'Reilly gets so much praise.  He's definitely a better defensive player than Kadri, but Kadri's "bad" season is 27 points in 45 games.  O'Reilly has 31 points in 44 games.  O'Reilly doesn't hit anything and has an unsustainable 14.5% shooting percentage this year (career 10%).  He's also been moved from center to play the wing this year.

I'd love to acquire O'Reilly but I feel like this would be more trading laterally and not really improving the team long-term.

His qualifying offer this summer will also be $6.5M, so, he's going to end up with a very substantial cap hit. A long-term contract will likely be able to bring that number down, but, you're probably still looking at $5.5M+ per going forward. The on ice value is probably close, but the overall asset value doesn't make it a deal that makes sense for the Leafs.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

I'm not quite sure why Ryan O'Reilly gets so much praise.  He's definitely a better defensive player than Kadri, but Kadri's "bad" season is 27 points in 45 games.  O'Reilly has 31 points in 44 games.  O'Reilly doesn't hit anything and has an unsustainable 14.5% shooting percentage this year (career 10%).  He's also been moved from center to play the wing this year.

I'd love to acquire O'Reilly but I feel like this would be more trading laterally and not really improving the team long-term.

I don't know if it's so much Kadri's "bad" season as it is he got fortunate in the short season too: http://theleafsnation.com/2013/9/12/nazem-kadris-coming-regression-and-why-it-will-happen

That article predicts Kadri around 55-60 points, and he's on pace for about 50 right now.

But I think the big thing with O'Reilly is his defensive play.  He's playing the PP and the PK.  Roy has stated that he's able to play him in any situation on the ice with confidence.  I'd take a guy like Patrice Bergeron as a C over a player able to put up similar ~60ish point offensive numbers because he'd be overall better.  Even if O'Reilly is on the wing moreso this season, his career face-off numbers (over 50% every season but his rookie season).

I don't necessarily want to trade Kadri, but if we're comparing the two I take O'Reilly.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Does anyone still believe Kadri can become a #1 centre?

I'm conflicted about it. I think he is a good 2nd liner at his best. I could be wrong about it, but that all depends on Kadri.

 

[Redleaf]

Does anyone still believe Kadri can become a #1 centre?

I still believe he's got a pretty high ceiling, but number one centre? I dont think so. He probably tops out at 2nd line centre, and probably a streaky one at that.

 

[Redleaf]

I like Kadri, but all the work the Leafs staff have put into developing his defensive game over the years hasn't helped at all. I personally don't think you'll see him get much better defensively, and that's a pretty big draw back for a 2nd line centre on any team.

 

[bustaheims]

I like Kadri, but all the work the Leafs staff have put into developing his defensive game over the years hasn't helped at all. I personally don't think you'll see him get much better defensively, and that's a pretty big draw back for a 2nd line centre on any team.

While there's some truth there, the team already has a couple guys who can fill the 2nd line centre role and are responsible defensively in Bozak and Holland. While neither of these guys will likely ever win the Selke, trading Kadri to fill a position that can already be filled pretty well in-house is not smart asset management.

 

[Kin]

Does anyone still believe Kadri can become a #1 centre?

Sure. Not in a "our #1 centre is the best in the league" sense but in the way that Dion Phaneuf is a #1 defenseman, why not?

 

[Redleaf]

I like Kadri, but all the work the Leafs staff have put into developing his defensive game over the years hasn't helped at all. I personally don't think you'll see him get much better defensively, and that's a pretty big draw back for a 2nd line centre on any team.

While there's some truth there, the team already has a couple guys who can fill the 2nd line centre role and are responsible defensively in Bozak and Holland. While neither of these guys will likely ever win the Selke, trading Kadri to fill a position that can already be filled pretty well in-house is not smart asset management.

Not sure I get your thinking. So Kadri should stay and centre the 3rd line? Personally I think good teams have 4 centers that can play well defensively and can contribute to keeping the puck out of their nets.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Personally I think good teams have 4 centers that can play well defensively and can contribute to keeping the puck out of their nets.

I agree strongly with this point.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

I don't get all the criticism in the media and by some segments of the fans.  This was all predicted.  I posted one above already, and even in the mainstream papers: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/hockey/leafs-beat/leafs-nazem-kadri-one-lucky-man/article11176186/?page=all

 

[Kin]

Not sure I get your thinking. So Kadri should stay and centre the 3rd line? Personally I think good teams have 4 centers that can play well defensively and can contribute to keeping the puck out of their nets.

So you don't think good teams can have a PP specialist sort of centre anywhere in the line-up?

 

[Redleaf]

Not sure I get your thinking. So Kadri should stay and centre the 3rd line? Personally I think good teams have 4 centers that can play well defensively and can contribute to keeping the puck out of their nets.

So you don't think good teams can have a PP specialist sort of centre anywhere in the line-up?

Sure. Providing he has some defensive acumen.

 

[bustaheims]

Not sure I get your thinking. So Kadri should stay and centre the 3rd line? Personally I think good teams have 4 centers that can play well defensively and can contribute to keeping the puck out of their nets.

The team needs to have at least one centre that has high-end offensive skills, and, right now, Kadri's the only guy who fits that bill (even if his production of late hasn't shown that). If he's traded, the guy coming back should also have high-end offensive skills. I mean, one of the best ways to keep the puck out of your net is to have control of it in the other team's end.

 

[Redleaf]

Not sure I get your thinking. So Kadri should stay and centre the 3rd line? Personally I think good teams have 4 centers that can play well defensively and can contribute to keeping the puck out of their nets.

The team needs to have at least one centre that has high-end offensive skills, and, right now, Kadri's the only guy who fits that bill (even if his production of late hasn't shown that). If he's traded, the guy coming back should also have high-end offensive skills.

I agree. That is why I proposed that they trade for someone with just that quality, but preferably one with more defensive awareness as well.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Does anyone still believe Kadri can become a #1 centre?

Like a legit top-20 centre in the league? I never really thought he was capable of that. I've said this before, but Mike Riberio has always been the guy I've projected Kadri to be. An ideal 2nd line offensive centre who can maybe play on a top line if the situation is right. Generally scores 50-65 points but will have a season or two where he might crack 70.

 

[Corn Flake]

Does anyone still believe Kadri can become a #1 centre?

Sure. Not in a "our #1 centre is the best in the league" sense but in the way that Dion Phaneuf is a #1 defenseman, why not?

My loose "criteria" is: can he play on a top line, go up against the top defenders on the other team every night, and still produce at a respectable clip, make his linemates better and provide some clutch offense when needed, without being a defensive black hole.  He's not going to be Crosby or Stamkos, but can he be at least as good as (this year's version of) Tyler Bozak??

Phaneuf would roughly be the defenseman version of that.

 

[Corn Flake]

Does anyone still believe Kadri can become a #1 centre?

Like a legit top-20 centre in the league? I never really thought he was capable of that. I've said this before, but Mike Riberio has always been the guy I've projected Kadri to be. An ideal 2nd line offensive centre who can maybe play on a top line if the situation is right. Generally scores 50-65 points but will have a season or two where he might crack 70.

I'm starting to feel that is about where he tops out as well.  I'm not seeing legit #1 in him, at least not right now.  The only thing Kadri has over Ribero is he is a much more physical player, so that could give him a slight edge.