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Random rumours

Nik the Trik said:
princedpw said:
Of course, we dont know what is in Nonis brain and I wont try to speculate because he has done a bunch of things that I vehemently disagree with.  But ignoring that, it could be the case that literally, the buyouts and cap space do make the difference *this year* between keeping all the guys you want going forward at prices you think are reasonable going forward.  Everyone predicts the cap will rise dramatically soon.  eg, franson tight this year but sensible in the following years.
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But I think regardless of what some people might want to attribute to whatever it is or isn't in Nonis' brain we still have to acknowledge that where they are is by design as opposed to an accident. If Nonis put himself in a position where he's unable to sign Franson at what he wants I don't think that can be said to have snuck up on him. In signing guys like Orr and Ranger and to some extent Clarkson I think Nonis would have had to have budgeted what he'd be willing/able to pay Franson this year. While you're right, if the Leafs didn't have the buyouts on their books it'd be easier to do it I still think you have to say that if Nonis can't pay Franson what he wants this year then it's a pretty good sign that keeping Franson was pretty low on the list of priorities.
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Agreed. But that just means we're not criticizing Nonis for not being able to use a calculator but for prioritizing Clarkson, the goaltending tandem, Orr, and McLaren over retaining one of the team's best RFAs. Not for rank incompetence but for questionable taste.
 
mr grieves said:
Agreed. But that just means we're not criticizing Nonis for not being able to use a calculator but for prioritizing Clarkson, the goaltending tandem, Orr, and McLaren over retaining one of the team's best RFAs. Not for rank incompetence but for questionable taste.
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Which is fine and everything but being as that's a criticism that's either fundamentally based on something unknowable like the relative value of Franson at whatever price it would take to sign him vs. what he could fetch in a trade or it's based on an outright falsehood like saying that Rielly being viewed as a potential replacement this year is a "panic move" as opposed to a pretty normal development pattern when compared to other young top defense prospects I think that criticism is roughly equivalent to someone loudly and repeatedly expressing a distaste for a movie's ending as they're finding their seats in the theatre.
 
Depending on prospect and draft pick, I would sort of liked if the Leafs were for once able to sell high. The other thing is that especially on PP Franson departure Leafs a huge hole.
 
TML fan said:
Almost all of Franson's value is on the scoresheet. He's a below average defenceman in my opinion. If his offence dries up I don't think he even cracks the roster. He's got PP specialist written all over him, and a short track record to boot. I like him as a player and he has potential, but if that's what he wants I'll take the future assets.
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I wholeheartedly agree with this assessment.

Pre-concussion Liles was a significantly better defenceman. I'd love to see him re-gain some of that form; he can easily fill the void on the PP left by Franson too if he is healthy and symptom free, of course.
 
Nik the Trik said:
mr grieves said:
Agreed. But that just means we're not criticizing Nonis for not being able to use a calculator but for prioritizing Clarkson, the goaltending tandem, Orr, and McLaren over retaining one of the team's best RFAs. Not for rank incompetence but for questionable taste.
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Which is fine and everything but being as that's a criticism that's either fundamentally based on something unknowable like the relative value of Franson at whatever price it would take to sign him vs. what he could fetch in a trade or it's based on an outright falsehood like saying that Rielly being viewed as a potential replacement this year is a "panic move" as opposed to a pretty normal development pattern when compared to other young top defense prospects I think that criticism is roughly equivalent to someone loudly and repeatedly expressing a distaste for a movie's ending as they're finding their seats in the theatre.
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Well, it didn't take a genius to know World War Z wasn't coming to any good. I get it though: folks like to be surprised.


 
mr grieves said:
Well, it didn't take a genius to know World War Z wasn't coming to any good. I get it though: folks like to be surprised.
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And everyone loves the guy in the lobby who swears he could make a better movie in between sips of mountain dew.
 
Nik the Trik said:
mr grieves said:
Well, it didn't take a genius to know World War Z wasn't coming to any good. I get it though: folks like to be surprised.
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And everyone loves the guy in the lobby who swears he could make a better movie in between sips of mountain dew.
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Yeah, some people just don't go into public looking for the approval and adoration of strangers. Weird.
 
mr grieves said:
Yeah, some people just don't go into public looking for the approval and adoration of strangers. Weird.
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That guy would be the next Spielberg if only those jerks in Hollywood would subscribe to his blog.
 
Nik the Trik said:
mr grieves said:
Yeah, some people just don't go into public looking for the approval and adoration of strangers. Weird.
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That guy would be the next Spielberg if only those jerks in Hollywood would subscribe to his blog.
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Yeah, except in our analogy, even the next Zach Synder would do.

Anyway, if you'd really like to hold those "if you don't like what the team/movie/book/album/whatever
is doing, shaddup and do better!" and "if you're so smart, why aren't YOU doing it?" views on an internet discussion board, feel free. But I really don't see what you're doing here. This is the 21st century. Interested amateurs go to virtual places to debate what professionals do, exchange predictions, see who turns out right. It's a pretty common thing, you know? I didn't think this was the board people came to try out for Leafs TV gigs.
 
mr grieves said:
Yeah, except in our analogy, even the next Zach Synder would do.

Anyway, if you'd really like to hold those "if you don't like what the team/movie/book/album/whatever
is doing, shaddup and do better!" and "if you're so smart, why aren't YOU doing it?" views on an internet discussion board, feel free. But I really don't see what you're doing here. This is the 21st century. Interested amateurs go to virtual places to debate what professionals do, exchange predictions, see who turns out right. It's a pretty common thing, you know? I didn't think this was the board people came to try out for Leafs TV gigs.
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You'll notice that in our analogy, I'm talking about a loudmouth complaining before the movie starts, not AO Scott.
 
Nik the Trik said:
mr grieves said:
Yeah, except in our analogy, even the next Zach Synder would do.

Anyway, if you'd really like to hold those "if you don't like what the team/movie/book/album/whatever
is doing, shaddup and do better!" and "if you're so smart, why aren't YOU doing it?" views on an internet discussion board, feel free. But I really don't see what you're doing here. This is the 21st century. Interested amateurs go to virtual places to debate what professionals do, exchange predictions, see who turns out right. It's a pretty common thing, you know? I didn't think this was the board people came to try out for Leafs TV gigs.
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You'll notice that in our analogy, I'm talking about a loudmouth complaining before the movie starts, not AO Scott.
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I bet AO Scott would be able to sustain an analogy better than us. He is a pro. So does the loudmouth in lobby want to be a filmmaker or a paid movie critic? 

Anyhow, you or I -- any loudmouth in the lobby -- can be fairly confident of the outcome of something without watching it through the credits. I was ready to be pleasantly surprised by World War Z, but it turned out to be the pointless mediocrity I expected it was. So, without being Spielberg or AO Scott or -- to get around this filmmaker/critic confusion -- Jacques Rivette, my amateur intuition was right. There's nothing about writing for the NY Times or having made Jaws that ensures only AO Scott or Steven Spielberg can have opinions with predictive value about at $200m vanity project zombie movie. 

 
mr grieves said:
Anyhow, you or I -- any loudmouth in the lobby -- can be fairly confident of the outcome of something without watching it through the credits. I was ready to be pleasantly surprised by World War Z, but it turned out to be the pointless mediocrity I expected it was. So, without being Spielberg or AO Scott or -- to get around this filmmaker/critic confusion -- Jacques Rivette, my amateur intuition was right. There's nothing about writing for the NY Times or having made Jaws that ensures only AO Scott or Steven Spielberg can have opinions with predictive value about at $200m vanity project zombie movie.
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Yes, but you see your intuition is fundamentally tied to what you know you, specifically, like out of a movie. You didn't think you'd like it and nobody would blame you for not seeing it or even loudly announcing that you don't plan to see it(although that would wear relatively thin at, oh, the 50th time it was artlessly shouted). However you're only right in the sense that it wasn't for you. The movie has a generally favourable rating at Rotten Tomatoes and an even higher audience score so clearly opinions vary and, heck, are equally valid.

If, however, we're attempting the serious criticism of someone like an AO Scott then I think it's pretty fair to say that even if we can't objectively speak to quality we can at least contribute to an intelligent discourse of film although watching the movie is required. If our "criticism" is no more than "That totally would have been a better movie if they'd spent 50 million more on better special effects and they totally should have hired Ed Norton to star" without accounting for the possible realities of raising the extra money or the potential availability of actors who might be better in the various roles it betrays a kind of fundamental ignorance of the actual business of film making. So much so that a rebuke of it isn't a argumentum ad auctoritatem that you find deeply unfair, but just a sort of effort to ground our criticism in practical realities.

It's the difference between "That movie sucked because it dragged in the middle" and "That movie sucked because it wasn't about dinosaurs".
 
TML fan said:
Almost all of Franson's value is on the scoresheet. He's a below average defenceman in my opinion. If his offence dries up I don't think he even cracks the roster. He's got PP specialist written all over him, and a short track record to boot. I like him as a player and he has potential, but if that's what he wants I'll take the future assets.
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McCabe redux!
 
Per Dreger...

Large gap in the Leafs arb case with Mark Fraser. Toronto offering $855,000 & Fraser has requested $2 mil.
 
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