Armstrong bought out

[bustaheims]

That strikes me as being well within the margin that means nothing at all.

That was pretty much my sense of it as well. The Leafs were marginally more successful with Armstrong in the lineup, but, not by enough to be able to say that he had a significant impact on that success, or any impact at all.

 

[Omallley]

Agreed, Bender. I seriously doubt buying him out was Burke's first choice strategy.

Especially since it happened on the final day of the buyout period.

Bingo. I don't particularly like buyouts in general, but in this case, the added cap space, and roster spot make it a lot more palatable.

 

[BermudaBudsFan]

ADD - My bad, I thought Orr was bought out
Right or wrong I still think it's bad business - I'll just leave it at that I guess

Nope -- both options were collectively bargained for -- buy out or bury.  Whilst the buy out leads to the player receiving less money on the original contract, he gets to try his luck elsewhere, which is what the players would choose if they had to.

 

[cw]

I still respect Armstrong. He just got hurt as guys that play more physically do. In his case, some of it was sort of freak injury. The sad part with the buyout may be that they do not expect him to be able to bounce back because they needed a healthy version of him to play Carlyle's style.

 

[Madferret]

ADD - My bad, I thought Orr was bought out
Right or wrong I still think it's bad business - I'll just leave it at that I guess

Nope -- both options were collectively bargained for -- buy out or bury.  Whilst the buy out leads to the player receiving less money on the original contract, he gets to try his luck elsewhere, which is what the players would choose if they had to.

When I say 'bad business' I mean the optics of Burke's revolving door GMing - players / agents talk. Versteeg, Beachemin, Exelby, Orr, Armstrong - these are all players he's brought in and then shipped out in a relatively short time span.

 

[Zee]

ADD - My bad, I thought Orr was bought out
Right or wrong I still think it's bad business - I'll just leave it at that I guess

Nope -- both options were collectively bargained for -- buy out or bury.  Whilst the buy out leads to the player receiving less money on the original contract, he gets to try his luck elsewhere, which is what the players would choose if they had to.

When I say 'bad business' I mean the optics of Burke's revolving door GMing - players / agents talk. Versteeg, Beachemin, Exelby, Orr, Armstrong - these are all players he's brought in and then shipped out in a relatively short time span.

You can make similar lists for other teams of players brought in and shipped out one way or another. It's business.

 

[Madferret]

ADD - My bad, I thought Orr was bought out
Right or wrong I still think it's bad business - I'll just leave it at that I guess

Nope -- both options were collectively bargained for -- buy out or bury.  Whilst the buy out leads to the player receiving less money on the original contract, he gets to try his luck elsewhere, which is what the players would choose if they had to.

When I say 'bad business' I mean the optics of Burke's revolving door GMing - players / agents talk. Versteeg, Beachemin, Exelby, Orr, Armstrong - these are all players he's brought in and then shipped out in a relatively short time span.

You can make similar lists for other teams of players brought in and shipped out one way or another. It's business.

I'm not sure about that Zee - but if you can show me another GM who has had to self-correct himself 5 times over the past 4 seasons I'll let you get back to your bbq.

 

[Corn Flake]

ADD - My bad, I thought Orr was bought out
Right or wrong I still think it's bad business - I'll just leave it at that I guess

Nope -- both options were collectively bargained for -- buy out or bury.  Whilst the buy out leads to the player receiving less money on the original contract, he gets to try his luck elsewhere, which is what the players would choose if they had to.

When I say 'bad business' I mean the optics of Burke's revolving door GMing - players / agents talk. Versteeg, Beachemin, Exelby, Orr, Armstrong - these are all players he's brought in and then shipped out in a relatively short time span.

You can make similar lists for other teams of players brought in and shipped out one way or another. It's business.

I'm not sure about that Zee - but if you can show me another GM who has had to self-correct himself 5 times over the past 4 seasons I'll let you get back to your bbq.

Pascal Leclaire is on line 2 for you..........

 

[Madferret]

ADD - My bad, I thought Orr was bought out
Right or wrong I still think it's bad business - I'll just leave it at that I guess

Nope -- both options were collectively bargained for -- buy out or bury.  Whilst the buy out leads to the player receiving less money on the original contract, he gets to try his luck elsewhere, which is what the players would choose if they had to.

When I say 'bad business' I mean the optics of Burke's revolving door GMing - players / agents talk. Versteeg, Beachemin, Exelby, Orr, Armstrong - these are all players he's brought in and then shipped out in a relatively short time span.

You can make similar lists for other teams of players brought in and shipped out one way or another. It's business.

I'm not sure about that Zee - but if you can show me another GM who has had to self-correct himself 5 times over the past 4 seasons I'll let you get back to your bbq.

Pascal Leclaire is on line 2 for you..........

Leclaire's contract expired - Murray didn't bury / trade / buy him out but I'm a sport and I'll give you that one. Now I just need 4 more players names - I'll be holding on line 3.

 

[bustaheims]

I'm not sure about that Zee - but if you can show me another GM who has had to self-correct himself 5 times over the past 4 seasons I'll let you get back to your bbq.

Well, you really only listed 4 "self corrections," since Exelby was simply allowed to leave as a UFA, but, Bryan Murray "self corrected" on Rundblad, Cheechoo, Ruutu, Kovalev and Campoli in the same time period.

 

[Corn Flake]

Leclaire's contract expired - Murray didn't bury / trade / buy him out but I'm a sport and I'll give you that one. Now I just need 4 more players names - I'll be holding on line 3.

Brought in/shipped out/let go/whatever

Kovalev
Leclaire
Campoli
Svatos
Filatov

I just looked at one year. Should I keep going??

 

[Peter D.]

Quite honestly, I forgot Armstrong was even on the team anymore.  Not fond of having money towards the cap go to guys not on the team, but I'd rather take the $2M savings that have him on the team.

 

[Madferret]

I'm not sure about that Zee - but if you can show me another GM who has had to self-correct himself 5 times over the past 4 seasons I'll let you get back to your bbq.

Well, you really only listed 4 "self corrections," since Exelby was simply allowed to leave as a UFA, but, Bryan Murray "self corrected" on Rundblad, Cheechoo, Ruutu, Kovalev and Campoli in the same time period.

Other than Turris the others were purged during rebuild 201 - let's have a look-see:

Rundblad - Turris
Ruutu - 6th rnder <Max McCormick>
Cheechoo - demoted <score Busta>
Campoli - Potulny & a 2nd <was packaged with one of our 2nds for Wings 1st - Puempel
Kovalev - 7th rnder Ryan Dzingel

 

[Madferret]

I wish you guys would let Zee fight his own battles  :-*

 

[sickbeast]

I liked Armstrong but he was underwhelming.  It will be interesting to see who Burke signs.

 

[maplesyrup]

With these buy-outs (two thirds over twice the duration) I think I'd like to see teams be able to manage the two thirds (for the most part) as they see fit. I Army's example, it would be nice for the team to be able to decide in advance that they'd want, say, 1.5 mil. allocated to this year's hit and 0.5 mil. allocated towards next year should they choose to. Obviously some rules would need to be put in place but I think it would allow for more creativity.   

 

[Kin]

Kovalev - 7th rnder Ryan Dzingel

So that's an exception but dealing Beauchemin for Gardiner/Lupul is a "correction"?

 

[bustaheims]

So that's an exception but dealing Beauchemin for Gardiner/Lupul is a "correction"?

And a pick in the 2013 draft.

I'm also a little confused as to how any of those moves are different in basic structure than moving Versteeg for 2 picks that became Percy and Leivo.

 

[bustaheims]

With these buy-outs (two thirds over twice the duration) I think I'd like to see teams be able to manage the two thirds (for the most part) as they see fit. I Army's example, it would be nice for the team to be able to decide in advance that they'd want, say, 1.5 mil. allocated to this year's hit and 0.5 mil. allocated towards next year should they choose to. Obviously some rules would need to be put in place but I think it would allow for more creativity. 

That's probably a little more chaotic than the league would like, but, I think the option to take the hit over the remaining length of the contract instead of double should be an option.

 

[ZBBM]

That strikes me as being well within the margin that means nothing at all.

That was pretty much my sense of it as well. The Leafs were marginally more successful with Armstrong in the lineup, but, not by enough to be able to say that he had a significant impact on that success, or any impact at all.

I agree.  Thanks Busta for looking it up.  My recollection was that we did signficantly better with him in, but it wasn't so.