Game 59 Sat Feb 18/2012 Leafs at Canucks 7 pm CBC, am640

[Tigger]

I just think that they have better staff.

First of all, what does any of that have to do with the situation now?

Second, two years before that the Leafs drafted Kaberle pretty late, honestly not that it matters.

Third, if the Detroit scouting staff had any idea that those players would become part of the bedrock of the team, don't you think they would have been taken just a little higher?

I think Detroits system has been pretty good over the years, better than most sure, pointing to those two as evidence of much more than luck doesn't ring true to me. The 4 picks taken before Pavel never played a game in the NHL and from what I can tell Detroit counted on the draft so much that the next year they didn't even have a pick until the 4th round, he never played a game in the NHL, neither did the guy from the next round and the guy from the 6th round played all of 32 games in his career, all for Columbus.

 

[Tigger]

So I decided to leave the game in an hour on just to catch some of the details I might have missed from the live broadcast, funny, they didn't have the commentary for almost two periods, just the game mikes, it was a far and away better experience, as soon as someone remembered to punch up the commentary, I shut it off.

If there was a choice, I'd pay for a broadcast with no colour commentary at all.

 

[Corn Flake]

So I decided to leave the game in an hour on just to catch some of the details I might have missed from the live broadcast, funny, they didn't have the commentary for almost two periods, just the game mikes, it was a far and away better experience, as soon as someone remembered to punch up the commentary, I shut it off.

If there was a choice, I'd pay for a broadcast with no colour commentary at all.

A big +1 on that idea. I find play by play totally distracting.  I mute the TV most of the time, especially when i'm trying to study a player or a team.  As soon as the commentary is off it completely changes how I watch the game.

 

[L K]

Tlusty
Rask
Steen
Colaiacovo
Boyes
Cereda
Antropov

Not exactly sure what you're trying to say here in regards to the Leafs drafting. All those guys are NHLers right now (and some of them are pretty darn good ones) except for Cereda who had his career cut short because of a freak injury.

their drafting sucks

And to prove that point you made a list of legitimate NHLers they've drafted? One's arguably the best back-up goalie in the NHL. One is a top-6 forward, another is a very good 3rd liner, another is a top-4 defenceman.

And that geriatric Tlusty (he's 23 and had some of the worst development handling I have seen for a prospect - come to the OHL and get a major leg injury; play 5 minutes a game in the NHL your 1st season, get AHL time the next year and then come up and play 5 minutes in the NHL a game; get traded for a crappy prospect because Burke is awesome at everything) is on pace for a 20 goal season.  People seem to have a real deluded concept of what non-top 5 draft picks are expected to become.

 

[lamajama]

Tlusty
Rask
Steen
Colaiacovo
Boyes
Cereda
Antropov

Not exactly sure what you're trying to say here in regards to the Leafs drafting. All those guys are NHLers right now (and some of them are pretty darn good ones) except for Cereda who had his career cut short because of a freak injury.

their drafting sucks

And to prove that point you made a list of legitimate NHLers they've drafted? One's arguably the best back-up goalie in the NHL. One is a top-6 forward, another is a very good 3rd liner, another is a top-4 defenceman.

And that geriatric Tlusty (he's 23 and had some of the worst development handling I have seen for a prospect - come to the OHL and get a major leg injury; play 5 minutes a game in the NHL your 1st season, get AHL time the next year and then come up and play 5 minutes in the NHL a game; get traded for a crappy prospect because Burke is awesome at everything) is on pace for a 20 goal season.  People seem to have a real deluded concept of what non-top 5 draft picks are expected to become.

Just wait til you see what they do with Kadri....

 

[lamajama]

A few comments from gong to the game last night....

- nice to see a lot of Leaf fans and vast majority were having fun
- one old guy (60s+) in from of us, wearing what looked like his school
elementary days Leafs cotton sweater (about 5 sizes to small) had a
sign that said "Hey Henrik, your brother is ugly" 
- we were near one obnoxious Leaf fan who couldn't roll with it and started
bringing the St Louis Blues into it (??) and ended up getting tossed after
starting/being in a fist fight... :
- the usher told us that about 50-60 "fans" were throwing down just outside the building..... :-\
- Reimer is, at least this year a sieve. Horribly poor positioning and barely made an effort (I know he did but it sure looked like he didn't)
- Phil is fun to watch and when he whiffed on that sure goal it would have been 3-2. Moments later it's 4-1  :-[
- a noticeable sag after the goals when Reimer was in net. Dion's face
on one was very obvious (yes Dion showed another emotion...)
- Gus looked far more confident live that on TV (to me) and unfortunately
had the PP to handle right away.
- Ron Wilson is an idiot - but you don't need to attend a live game to see that.

 

[itsgametime]

Tlusty
Rask
Steen
Colaiacovo
Boyes
Cereda
Antropov

Not exactly sure what you're trying to say here in regards to the Leafs drafting. All those guys are NHLers right now (and some of them are pretty darn good ones) except for Cereda who had his career cut short because of a freak injury.

their drafting sucks

And to prove that point you made a list of legitimate NHLers they've drafted? One's arguably the best back-up goalie in the NHL. One is a top-6 forward, another is a very good 3rd liner, another is a top-4 defenceman.

not sure what your expectations are from a first rounder but I expect an impact player.

 

[Tigger]

not sure what your expectations are from a first rounder but I expect an impact player.

Just to get an idea of what 'expectations' are out of first round players, here's 3 consecutive draft years with the number of players that didn't play more than 100 games in the NHL listed as well as several others that might not be considered 'impact' players.

2000 10  Klesla, Alexeev, Marcel Hossa, Kolanos, Hale, Taffe
1999 12  Stefan, Beech, Lundmark, Mezei, Jillson, Koltsov, McCarthy 
1998 5    Kraft, Backman, Bell, Parker, Fata

So, 16 players from 2000, 19 from '99 and 10 from '98 ( the year the Leafs took Antropov )

I think those expectations should be tempered just a little.

 

[itsgametime]

not sure what your expectations are from a first rounder but I expect an impact player.

Just to get an idea of what 'expectations' are out of first round players, here's 3 consecutive draft years with the number of players that didn't play more than 100 games in the NHL listed as well as several others that might not be considered 'impact' players.

2000 10  Klesla, Alexeev, Marcel Hossa, Kolanos, Hale, Taffe
1999 12  Stefan, Beech, Lundmark, Mezei, Jillson, Koltsov, McCarthy 
1998 5    Kraft, Backman, Bell, Parker, Fata

So, 16 players from 2000, 19 from '99 and 10 from '98 ( the year the Leafs took Antropov )

I think those expectations should be tempered just a little.

It would be interesting to look at the same draft years and see how many were impact players (just by looking at stats).  I agree with your tempered statement - maybe need to define impact I don't expect a Crosby every draft.  To me an impact player should result in a top 6 forward that within 2 years of the draft is playing a key role on the top 2 lines...at least 50 points. (this just off the to of my head)

 

[bustaheims]

not sure what your expectations are from a first rounder but I expect an impact player.

Then you definitely need to temper your expectations, because, in the average draft, expecting an impact player to come from outside the top 3 or so picks is unrealistic.

 

[itsgametime]

To me an impact player should result in a top 6 forward that within 2 years of the draft is playing a key role on the top 2 lines...at least 50 points. (this just off the to of my head) - it maybe more or less

 

[CarltonTheBear]

To me an impact player should result in a top 6 forward that within 2 years of the draft is playing a key role on the top 2 lines...at least 50 points. (this just off the to of my head) - it maybe more or less

Using your loose definition, there were 2 impact players from the 2009 draft.

 

[itsgametime]

To me an impact player should result in a top 6 forward that within 2 years of the draft is playing a key role on the top 2 lines...at least 50 points. (this just off the to of my head) - it maybe more or less

Using your loose definition, there were 2 impact players from the 2009 draft.

esplain

 

[CarltonTheBear]

To me an impact player should result in a top 6 forward that within 2 years of the draft is playing a key role on the top 2 lines...at least 50 points. (this just off the to of my head) - it maybe more or less

Using your loose definition, there were 2 impact players from the 2009 draft.

esplain

Tavares and Duchene were the only players from the 2009 draft that within 2 years of being drafted were playing in a top-6 role on their respective teams and putting up 50+ points.

 

[itsgametime]

To me an impact player should result in a top 6 forward that within 2 years of the draft is playing a key role on the top 2 lines...at least 50 points. (this just off the to of my head) - it maybe more or less

Using your loose definition, there were 2 impact players from the 2009 draft.

esplain

Tavares and Duchene were the only players from the 2009 draft that within 2 years of being drafted were playing in a top-6 role on their respective teams and putting up 50+ points.

then my definition needs to be broadened so that we can truly and properly rate their drafting year by year.  I will try and put something together.